"survival mode update" ... is this a joke?!?!?!

[ben91]

ok, how do i make this thread without fanboys getting too much upset and getting instantly deleted/ banned for expressing my opinion/criticism …

lets start with describing the state of the game (Survival mode) for an experienced Player before the recent update:

- while being a Survival game and therefore having a huge potential to provide a seemingly indefinite amount of challenging Gameplay and replayability, TLD absolutly failed to provide such an experience for experienced Players due to the lack of Options to customize the world and difficulty of the game

- the implementation of the customizable game mode was the first and neccesary step to provide such an Option (not only for experienced Players) but it did not really provide the Option for experienced Players to create an intersting Gameplay that was more challenging than the existing difficulties, or create a challenging Gameplay that focuses on harsh weather conditions and rare supplies rather than placing Wolves at every Corner of the map and removing items from the game

- and there is also the Frustration that the developers started the trend (!) to implement items in the story mode that are not available in the Survival mode

- not to Mention all the outdated Systems and mechanics (like the skill System, workbenches, etc.)

These factors unfortunately resulted in a very much boring and unchallenging Gameplay for any experienced Player who was Looking for a challenge and almost indefinite replayablitly like other Survival games can offer.

Therefore it was very interesting to read that there is coming a new "Survival mode update" today. since i like the base idea and implementation of the game, but coudnt enjoy the game for the last months/years due to the lack of interessing/challenging Gameplay and improvements, i was hoping to finally being able to Play and enjoy the game again … i mean after all it is a "Survival mode update" and they only update the game About twice a year, so i was expecting a lot ...

but after watching the Video i was absolutly shocked and thought this has to be a joke.

- first of all, since the initial implementation of the custom game mode was such a Long time ago and this feature is so important for the fun and replayability of the game, i could not believe that they did not make any improvements...absolutly Nothing to improve one of the most important feature of the game (or even THE most important)

- and what a surprise … 4+ months was not enough time for them to make an item available in Survival mode that is already in the game (spear)

- and the rest of the update?! … a couple of items and some overhauls (while being a great Addition to the game, this adds absolutly Nothing to its replayability or challenging Gameplay)

after the initial shock i though i am going to try the new update... Maybe it is not that bad and i will have some fun. unfortunately i had to realize that this "Survival mode update" didnt only make the game any more interesting or created some sense of replayability, it is also frustrating to see that new Things get added to the game that make it easier, but since a couple of years basically Nothing has been added to make it more challenging and create this element of replayability that is so crucial in a Survival game, not only for experienced players

… that is my experience and opinion as Player who wants to Play and love this game, but is just frustrated by the evident lack of interest/competence from the developers to improve the game for this part of their community.

i do understand and made the experience that People can get very Angry when one of their favourite games is criticized, but while i hope that i can create a conversation and Argumentation About this Topic, try to Refrain to argue About how much you love the game and therefore i am wrong, and try to realize that as much as i understand that there are a lot of People who enjoy the current state of the game, there are also People who dont enjoy it and can express their criticism

 

[ManicManiac]

You can express your criticism... nothing wrong with that.
Just keep in mind the amount of content we have been basically getting for free.  There has been no additional cost to us at all, this is a lot of value.  Plus you don't seem to be aware of all the hard work that goes with making, testing, and implementing changes in a product that is already very layered and complex.

Edited May 6, 2019 by ManicManiac

[Raphael van Lierop]

36 minutes ago, ben91 said:

ok, how do i make this thread without fanboys getting too much upset and getting instantly deleted/ banned for expressing my opinion/criticism …

lets start with describing the state of the game (Survival mode) for an experienced Player before the recent update:

- while being a Survival game and therefore having a huge potential to provide a seemingly indefinite amount of challenging Gameplay and replayability, TLD absolutly failed to provide such an experience for experienced Players due to the lack of Options to customize the world and difficulty of the game

- the implementation of the customizable game mode was the first and neccesary step to provide such an Option (not only for experienced Players) but it did not really provide the Option for experienced Players to create an intersting Gameplay that was more challenging than the existing difficulties, or create a challenging Gameplay that focuses on harsh weather conditions and rare supplies rather than placing Wolves at every Corner of the map and removing items from the game

- and there is also the Frustration that the developers started the trend (!) to implement items in the story mode that are not available in the Survival mode

- not to Mention all the outdated Systems and mechanics (like the skill System, workbenches, etc.)

These factors unfortunately resulted in a very much boring and unchallenging Gameplay for any experienced Player who was Looking for a challenge and almost indefinite replayablitly like other Survival games can offer.

Therefore it was very interesting to read that there is coming a new "Survival mode update" today. since i like the base idea and implementation of the game, but coudnt enjoy the game for the last months/years due to the lack of interessing/challenging Gameplay and improvements, i was hoping to finally being able to Play and enjoy the game again … i mean after all it is a "Survival mode update" and they only update the game About twice a year, so i was expecting a lot ...

but after watching the Video i was absolutly shocked and thought this has to be a joke.

- first of all, since the initial implementation of the custom game mode was such a Long time ago and this feature is so important for the fun and replayability of the game, i could not believe that they did not make any improvements...absolutly Nothing to improve one of the most important feature of the game (or even THE most important)

- and what a surprise … 4+ months was not enough time for them to make an item available in Survival mode that is already in the game (spear)

- and the rest of the update?! … a couple of items and some overhauls (while being a great Addition to the game, this adds absolutly Nothing to its replayability or challenging Gameplay)

after the initial shock i though i am going to try the new update... Maybe it is not that bad and i will have some fun. unfortunately i had to realize that this "Survival mode update" didnt only make the game any more interesting or created some sense of replayability, it is also frustrating to see that new Things get added to the game that make it easier, but since a couple of years basically Nothing has been added to make it more challenging and create this element of replayability that is so crucial in a Survival game, not only for experienced players

… that is my experience and opinion as Player who wants to Play and love this game, but is just frustrated by the evident lack of interest/competence from the developers to improve the game for this part of their community.

i do understand and made the experience that People can get very Angry when one of their favourite games is criticized, but while i hope that i can create a conversation and Argumentation About this Topic, try to Refrain to argue About how much you love the game and therefore i am wrong, and try to realize that as much as i understand that there are a lot of People who enjoy the current state of the game, there are also People who dont enjoy it and can express their criticism

 

Have you considered the possibility that making the game more challenging to a relatively small % of our players, may not be our #1 priority?

[BareSkin]

1 hour ago, ben91 said:

i do understand and made the experience that People can get very Angry when one of their favourite games is criticized, but while i hope that i can create a conversation and Argumentation About this Topic, try to Refrain to argue About how much you love the game and therefore i am wrong, and try to realize that as much as i understand that there are a lot of People who enjoy the current state of the game, there are also People who dont enjoy it and can express their criticism

I have to thank you for validating once again my theory that the less people are prone to logic, the less they use punctuation, the more they use unjustified capital letters. (the Bible has this problem too <- joke)

While I do agree with you that every update makes the hardcore gaming (aka deadman and others) easier since you basically get 2 cooking spots, well fed buff , birch tea and energy drink without payoff, I also do realize we represent maybe 5% of the player base, and the more people play TLD, the more we get content and updates. Oh and btw, I just played the new build, you get sprained much more often when playing hardcore since you don't have enough time to lose following the smooth paths. Since a sprained wrist leads rapidly to death, well, not much easier from this POV.

Edited May 6, 2019 by BareSkin

[Failure]

1 hour ago, ManicManiac said:

Just keep in mind the amount of content we have been basically getting for free.  There has been no additional cost to us at all, this is a lot of value.  Plus you don't seem to be aware of all the hard work that goes with making, testing, and implementing changes in a product that is already very layered and complex.

What are you getting for free? Do you even realize how Early Access works? You buy a game cheaper, because not only it lacks in content, but also it may fail [couple of games I supported were abandoned, money lost], and as it develops, you obviously get updates, that you paid for, there's no "free content" here. Everything was paid for, you paid for it, by buying the game, or at least something that is supposed to be one in the future. The game might be out officially, but in reality, it's still early access, and I doubt that will ever change, seeing their priority are episodes. 

[ManicManiac]

@Failure

Yes, I do know how early access works... I participated.  What are we getting for free?  Well first of all I said basically for free... meaning that what ever you initially paid for the game is all you've ever had to pay.

Now getting back to the matter at hand... there have been several updates since the game came out of early access and officially released.  Many other publishers / developers (I can name more than a few, but I'm not going to do that in a public forum) would have been nickel and diming their communities; charging for each update as a "Paid DLC" or "expansion packs."

What has Hinterland done?  They've continued to enrich and expand their game... add more content, mechanics, and additional maps to explore; all at no additional charge to the players.

Edited May 7, 2019 by ManicManiac

[Raphael van Lierop]

8 minutes ago, micah6vs8 said:

> Have you considered the possibility that making the game more challenging to a relatively small % of our players, may not be our #1 priority?

While it is way too early to even begin discussing the update (seriously put the hours in first, so you know of what you write), I must admit this statement does trouble me. I am north of 2.5K hours in the game, and I only play in custom mode now (DMC). So, while I do not expect #1 priority I do expect attention to this part of TLD (custom mode, challenging game play, ect.). I'll be able to say how this update will effect high level players probably next week, but maybe not. TLD is a deep game and some of the quick criticism is silly.

Thank-you for the free update. Cheers.

It sounds like the game has provided well for you, even as a player looking for more of challenge, and I see no reason to think it won't continue to do so in the future. Just because something may not be a priority, doesn't mean we don't give it time or attention. But the OP's comments seem to stem from a place where they don't really understand what the game is meant to be, which seems worth correcting.

[Fuarian]

Hinterland focusing mainly on Wintermute. That's the main reason why these updates may not seem very substantial to you. However, I do agree with you saying that the custom mode is not fleshed out enough. Sure, there's quite a bit of customization. But I'd like to see even more. You mentioned how adding more items and featured to our "survival toolbox" makes the game easier, it does. So why not allow players to customize which items spawn? Not just a global item spawn rate, but item groups (food, clothing, etc...) or individual items spawn rates should be customizable. Allow it to be customizable per region, so ML may have more food spawns than PV let's say. And furthermore, what about static spawns? In the update video @Raphael van Lieropmentions how unpredictably is what makes TLD great and challenging. And I agree, except with static item spawns and defined animal spawn areas and patrol paths, this unpredictability becomes quite predictable. With more control over item spawning (because resources is the key to TLD) I think that this issue can be easily resolved. 

 

[hozz1235]

@ben91, 2 words: Custom Mode

[TerribleSurvivor]

@ben91 I had a similar problem with the game some time ago where i thought it was simply tedious and repetitive instead of being a challenge. Always getting attacked by wolves is a PITA, having no wolves makes the world too empty and boring. But back then, I didn´t consider other aspects TLD provides for the player. I was tunnel-visioning on the challenge only. 

Frankly speaking, the game doesn't lack any challenge, it isn't even tedious or boring for me nowadays. Today, I even realize on how much of its beauty i missed out on. The freedom it gives you. It's especially the freedom that makes this game amazing. Not being forced into some A+ game strategy to beat the odds is what sets it apart from the many other titles you could play for a challenge (Dark Souls, Competitive Pokémon, Chess, ...). TLD cannot even be considered a "real" game to be honest. It is more like a visual poem, something you are supposed to enjoy while you are playing, not always a challenge that must be overcome. On the contrary, you can simply enjoy the view if you choose to. Or you go on a wolf hunt spree (which can become quite a challenge). You could also try to find some good spots for beautiful screenshots. Whatever pleases you, basically.

Long Story short, the game doesn't send you on a million quests and it is not meant to do. It keeps you busy in its own artistic way. You are the one who has to figure out what you want to do next. Set your own goals, milestones etc. Yes, a 300 days run can be very stale at times but that is probably because you sit in your bunker not venturing out further than 300m away from your base.

By the way, i do not even dislike your post. On the contrary, i like some ideas like the one about a higher variety of challenging elements instead of just plain wolf and item abundance. Better customization of the game would be a very welcome addition too. But if Hinterland has no plans on implementing such features we gotta deal with it. And honestly, the game is in a very good state already, especially since the latest update.

I hope you kinda understand my point of view.

Sincerely

[Sunwolf]

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- the implementation of the customizable game mode was the first and neccesary step to provide such an Option (not only for experienced Players) but it did not really provide the Option for experienced Players to create an intersting Gameplay that was more challenging than the existing difficulties, or create a challenging Gameplay that focuses on harsh weather conditions and rare supplies rather than placing Wolves at every Corner of the map and removing items from the game

This is demonstrably untrue.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- and there is also the Frustration that the developers started the trend (!) to implement items in the story mode that are not available in the Survival mode

The frustration to which you refer is entirely subjective.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- not to Mention all the outdated Systems and mechanics (like the skill System, workbenches, etc.)

This is purely opinion.  Please try to separate your personal opinion from fact.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

These factors unfortunately resulted in a very much boring and unchallenging Gameplay for any experienced Player who was Looking for a challenge and almost indefinite replayablitly like other Survival games can offer.

You fail to provide the groundwork for your comparison between The Long Dark and "other Survival games"...

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

...i like the base idea and implementation of the game, but coudnt enjoy the game for the last months/years due to the lack of interessing/challenging Gameplay and improvements...

Sorry to hear about your personal frustrations.  Please keep in mind that they are personal and not shared by everyone.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

...they only update the game About twice a year, so i was expecting a lot ...

Yes, it's frustrating that The Long Dark was produced and developed by a small, independent studio and not a giant gaming behemoth like EA or Activision/Blizzard.  But just think, were the opposite the case, the game likely would likely either 1) never see any updates, or 2) any updated would come in the form of obscenely expensive loot boxes.  Be careful what you wish for.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- first of all, since the initial implementation of the custom game mode was such a Long time ago and this feature is so important for the fun and replayability of the game, i could not believe that they did not make any improvements...absolutly Nothing to improve one of the most important feature of the game (or even THE most important)

The Long Dark was released in August of 2017.  Since that time, Hinterland hasn't released a single pay-to-play update.  Every single thing they've done to improve the original game has been released for free.  Your lack of appreciation for the free updates that have been released is remarkable.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- and what a surprise … 4+ months was not enough time for them to make an item available in Survival mode that is already in the game (spear)

Perhaps they had other priorities.  You do not run Hinterland.  You have not seen the totality of the feedback they've received from their customers.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

- and the rest of the update?! … a couple of items and some overhauls (while being a great Addition to the game, this adds absolutly Nothing to its replayability or challenging Gameplay)

See above re: opinion.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

it is also frustrating to see that new Things get added to the game that make it easier, but since a couple of years basically Nothing has been added to make it more challenging and create this element of replayability that is so crucial in a Survival game, not only for experienced players

You mean like Forlorn Muskeg, Hushed River Valley, Interloper, and the ability to customize the game to be even more difficult than Interloper?  Is that the Nothing to which you refer?

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

… that is my experience and opinion as Player who wants to Play and love this game, but is just frustrated by the evident lack of interest/competence from the developers to improve the game for this part of their community.

I appreciate your belated admission of opinion, but the "evident lack of interest/competence" is, again, demonstrably false.  Hinterland could well have released the game, shut down all development in favor of a paid sequel or released the updates they've made as minor paid updates, or together as a paid DLC, and virtually no one would have batted an eye as this would conform to SOP in the gaming industry.  Instead, they've worked for a year-and-a-half, financially unrewarded, to make this game better because they (and this is my opinion) clearly love and take great pride in their product.  They've been rewarded with a rabid fanbase and widespread acknowledgement that their product is, and has continued to be, the height of accomplishment in its genre.

 

19 hours ago, ben91 said:

i do understand and made the experience that People can get very Angry when one of their favourite games is criticized, but while i hope that i can create a conversation and Argumentation About this Topic, try to Refrain to argue About how much you love the game and therefore i am wrong, and try to realize that as much as i understand that there are a lot of People who enjoy the current state of the game, there are also People who dont enjoy it and can express their criticism

While I appreciate your opinion of the game, and you're certainly entitled to it, you base your criticism on things that are entirely subjective or are demonstrably false.  Personally, while there are things about the game that have, and continue to drive me nuts (the immersion-killing, brightly-lit breath effect even when no light sources exist, for example), I choose to focus on the fact that I paid less than $20 (black friday sale) for a game I've played in excess of 600 hours and will likely play hundreds more.  Because of this, I can only either hope you find something else that holds your interest, or write you off as a troll.

Edited May 7, 2019 by Sunwolf

[Ape88]

On 5/7/2019 at 10:08 AM, Sunwolf said:

I choose to focus on the fact that I paid less than $20 (black friday sale) for a game I've played in excess of 600 hours and will likely play hundreds more.  Because of this, I can only either hope you find something else that holds your interest, or write you off as a troll.

I don't think I have played nearly that many hours but less than 20 bucks for what gameplay I've managed is a steal! Oh and I actually bought it again when it came out on XBox One.

That's not even taking into consideration the fact that when I first bought the game on Steam, it was still in the stage when Survival Mode was really considered just a testing ground for story mode and only stayed as a feature because so many people enjoyed it.

Maybe it is just my 31 years of life and impoverished background showing but it gets under my skin when people don't realize the value they get for the price they pay for something and complain.

I really ought to buy some store merch seeing as the game was so cheap but the one thing I'd really  like isn't microwave safe and therefore less useful than it could be.

[Guest kristaok]

On 5/6/2019 at 5:52 PM, ben91 said:

ok, how do i make this thread without fanboys getting too much upset and getting instantly deleted/ banned for expressing my opinion/criticism …

lets start with describing the state of the game (Survival mode) for an experienced Player before the recent update:

- while being a Survival game and therefore having a huge potential to provide a seemingly indefinite amount of challenging Gameplay and replayability, TLD absolutly failed to provide such an experience for experienced Players due to the lack of Options to customize the world and difficulty of the game

- the implementation of the customizable game mode was the first and neccesary step to provide such an Option (not only for experienced Players) but it did not really provide the Option for experienced Players to create an intersting Gameplay that was more challenging than the existing difficulties, or create a challenging Gameplay that focuses on harsh weather conditions and rare supplies rather than placing Wolves at every Corner of the map and removing items from the game

Not true at all. Also Hinterland never had to even add the Custom Difficulty Options, most Games do not provide that option.

On 5/6/2019 at 5:52 PM, ben91 said:

- and there is also the Frustration that the developers started the trend (!) to implement items in the story mode that are not available in the Survival mode

- not to Mention all the outdated Systems and mechanics (like the skill System, workbenches, etc.)

These factors unfortunately resulted in a very much boring and unchallenging Gameplay for any experienced Player who was Looking for a challenge

So far the only thing that Story Mode has the Survival Mode does not that I can think of right now is the Bear Spear, and Hinterland said they will try to implement this into the Survival Mode at a later date.

Also I disagree with you when you say the Systems and Mechanics are outdated, I am sorry you think / feel that they are... 

On 5/6/2019 at 5:52 PM, ben91 said:

Therefore it was very interesting to read that there is coming a new "Survival mode update" today. since i like the base idea and implementation of the game, but coudnt enjoy the game for the last months/years due to the lack of interessing/challenging Gameplay and improvements, i was hoping to finally being able to Play and enjoy the game again … i mean after all it is a "Survival mode update" and they only update the game About twice a year, so i was expecting a lot ...

but after watching the Video i was absolutly shocked and thought this has to be a joke.

 

No the Update is FAR from a Joke! I am actually TRULY excited they added the Revolver! I wish they would add more Weapon choices! I am also glad they added the Go - Energy Drink, the Birch Bark Tea, etc. etc. To be honest they technically don't even have to add these things considering the Game is no longer in Early Access. I REALLY appreciate Hinterland for continuing to spend their hard earned money to make this Game better with all these neat Updates, also they didn't even have to do the Redux (which I am truly glad they did)! Most companies will not spend their money to better their Game, they will just take that money and run with it!

On 5/6/2019 at 5:52 PM, ben91 said:

- first of all, since the initial implementation of the custom game mode was such a Long time ago and this feature is so important for the fun and replayability of the game, i could not believe that they did not make any improvements...absolutly Nothing to improve one of the most important feature of the game (or even THE most important)

- and what a surprise … 4+ months was not enough time for them to make an item available in Survival mode that is already in the game (spear)

- and the rest of the update?! … a couple of items and some overhauls (while being a great Addition to the game, this adds absolutly Nothing to its replayability or challenging Gameplay)

 

Why don't you go and try to Develop a Game that everybody will love without complaint, and then come back and complain okay? But seriously they (Hinterland) has already addressed why they have not added the Bear Spear to the Survival Mode. 

I am sorry that the Revolver, the Birch Bark Tea, the Cloth Hand / Head Wraps, the Go - Energy Drink, The NEW Pain Mechanic, etc. etc. mean nothing to you... but I LOVE these additions! I admit at first a few things were hard to get used to like the Vision Distortion while in Pain, but I have grown to love these additions! they are SO realistic! 

On 5/6/2019 at 5:52 PM, ben91 said:

fter the initial shock i though i am going to try the new update... Maybe it is not that bad and i will have some fun. unfortunately i had to realize that this "Survival mode update" didnt only make the game any more interesting or created some sense of replayability, it is also frustrating to see that new Things get added to the game that make it easier, but since a couple of years basically Nothing has been added to make it more challenging and create this element of replayability that is so crucial in a Survival game, not only for experienced players

… that is my experience and opinion as Player who wants to Play and love this game, but is just frustrated by the evident lack of interest/competence from the developers to improve the game for this part of their community.

i do understand and made the experience that People can get very Angry when one of their favourite games is criticized, but while i hope that i can create a conversation and Argumentation About this Topic, try to Refrain to argue About how much you love the game and therefore i am wrong, and try to realize that as much as i understand that there are a lot of People who enjoy the current state of the game, there are also People who dont enjoy it and can express their criticism

 

You have every right to dislike the Game, but I don't believe you have the right to cut down the Team and practically talk as if they are lazy for not living up to your expectations. The Hinterland Team is filled with human beings, they are not Robots / Machines, they have a life too... they have wives, kids, and other things to do then to sit all day at a Computer chair and try to please everyone. Hinterland are doing the BEST they can do! Yes they may be slow at some things, Episode 3 is still not out woopy doo! but they ARE working on it! just like they ARE working on adding this Bear Spear into the Survival Mode. I have FULL confidence in Hinterlands abilities, I KNOW they can and will deliver! but these things just take time. Patience IS a virtue. 

If you are not liking where the Game is headed maybe it's not for you? or maybe you just need a break from it for a while, and then come back to it at a later date? I don't know... 

Lastly I agree not everyone loves the current state of this Game, but for those small VERY vocal few, there are MANY more who just absolutely LOVE this Game! take me for instance! TLD IS my favorite Game! I have been playing this Game since 2016 ish I believe? I also have a friend who has played this Game since the beginning! but anyway I have seen the changes personally! I have seen how Hinterland has made this Game better! I don't know how long you have been playing for, but if you have been playing for a few years like me I don't know how you can't see how far this Game has come. Also one thing you and others who have an issue with the direction this Game is heading need to realize is; Hinterland is an Indie Dev Company, they basically aren't sitting on huge wads of cash like EA... this is also another reason why it may take the Company longer to do things, only recently have they been able to get their hands on even greater technology to better this Game.

So let's please give Hinterland a chance! we all need to put our Faith in them, be patient, and be understanding. 

Edited May 9, 2019 by kristaok

[Guest kristaok]

On 5/6/2019 at 7:33 PM, Failure said:

What are you getting for free? Do you even realize how Early Access works? You buy a game cheaper, because not only it lacks in content, but also it may fail [couple of games I supported were abandoned, money lost], and as it develops, you obviously get updates, that you paid for, there's no "free content" here. Everything was paid for, you paid for it, by buying the game, or at least something that is supposed to be one in the future. The game might be out officially, but in reality, it's still early access, and I doubt that will ever change, seeing their priority are episodes. 

The Long Dark isn't in Early Access... And since it's not in Early Access anything we are given IS considered Free Content. If the Game was still considered in Early Access like you are thinking it is, then it would say so in Steam, but it doesn't so therefore it's not in Early Access. 

Yes I LOVE the Survival Mode, I want to see more added, but I am willing to wait. Also there is nothing wrong with Hinterland wanting to put their focus into finishing the Episodes before they put all of their focus into the Survival Mode, because you have to realize there are people out there who do want to see the Story completed. 

Just like the Redux that was completely free on our end, they (Hinterland) could have just pushed out Episode 3 and left us with the old Episode 1 and 2, which no offense in my humble opinion was not nearly as good as the Redux versions. Not many Companies are willing to push out Content like this, let alone go back and completely redo most of their Game like Hinterland did with the Redux. 

Also like I said above Hinterland is an Indie Dev Team, right now they probably do not have the funds, the staff, the time, whatever that the bigger Companies have. So it will more than likely take Hinterland much longer to do things than other Companies, but I am fine with waiting why? because I believe that I would much rather wait and have something beautiful, then to rush the staff and have something crappy.  

Sometimes it's the little things that mean so much, sadly in today's society we over look these little things. Like lets take the Revolver for instance, some people would be like wow... a Revolver is that it? but to me that Revolver means SO much! because I had made a Wish List not long ago saying I would LOVE to see more Weapon Options! Also the Birch Bark Tree also means SO much to me, because my favorite Tree is the White Birch Tree! and the Go - Energy Drink is neat because it reminds me of my late mom, she always loved to drink those teeny tiny Energy shots! and the Head and Hand wraps which may not mean much to others either, but I like em! they make me feel like I am roughing it like back in the Prairie days! and the Vision Distortion, I admit that was hard for me to adjust to, but now I am absolutely loving it! Also most people hate the Breathing Affect - I know that's been in this Game for a while (it's not really new), but I love it because it's realistic and I hope Hinterland NEVER removes it! Oh and the Pain Mechanic! SO realistic! I love it! phew... I could go on and on, but I better stop!  

So let's all try to focus on these little things and realize just how big they are! they may seem like small additions, but trust me they are not!  

[peteloud]

It is good to read those last few comments and see that other people feel as strongly as I do about the value of TLD.  

I started off with a free copy, but it was so good that I thought that the guys developing TLD deserved paying so I bought it.  If I worked out how many hours I have played, I would be too embarrassed to tell it, but I have well over 2,000 game days behind, all gained in the past 15 months.  I don't work, so I have lots of time.

What does it cost, per hour, to have an enjoyable evening at a concert/theatre/cinema/restaurant/bar? The answer would be several $$ per hour.   The enjoyment that I get from TLD has cost me less than 1 penny an hour. 

I try lots of PC games.  When I get them they look very impressive.  Very soon I find that 90% of them become tedious and I give up with them.  They become tedious for many reasons.  Some of them are superb products in most respects, but just don't suit me.  Recently I returned to Assassin's Creed Unity because of the fire at Notre Dame.  That is the most amazing game I have ever seen.  The graphics, the historic detail, the psychology behind the crowd actions is brilliant. Alas, I found the game play soon became tedious.  What suits one person does not necessarily suit all people.  It does not mean that the game is bad, the person is bad, just people have different interests and temperaments.

Another aspect that I like about TLD is that a great many people commenting in the forum are making serious sensible points, and probably have a professional IT background.

If I don't get all 'n' episodes, perfect in every respect, I don't care one jot.  I am more than satisfied with what I have already had from TLD.

 

 

[Rhett987]

I just want to touch a little bit on the claim that "it is also frustrating to see that new Things get added to the game that make it easier, but since a couple of years basically Nothing has been added to make it more challenging" 
 

In my few hours so far with the update I actually see it as being more challenging and fun with the addition of the revolver the sprain system and the weapon sway. Lets start with the obvious:
Revolver: Very Helpful in scaring off wolves but wolves seem to be more aggressive and willing to start running towards me from farther away. I could be wrong but I imagine they increased the Wolf detection range to make killing with the revolver harder. This is an effect to the game that cannot understate it's value added to the game. This game now feels a little more like PlayerVSWildlife rather than PlayerVSTime. This could be because of my increased willingness to deal with wolves now that I have a revolver but it seems the wolves are harder to deal with than when I played a couple of weeks ago. 
Weapon sway: Hitting shots with the rifle was incredibly difficult to begin the day leading to my death of a bear because of multiple missed shots. The removal of the 'learnable' weapon sway was a good choice because it no longer makes things easier the more you play. This is similar to the system of the added benefits of Coffee or Tea, you can no longer drink 95% and get the same benefit from the other 5% that you could previously.
Sprain system: This is another system to the game that adds difficulty to the game, now shortcuts especially when you are over-encumbered is more of a risk and pain meds and bandages have a bigger purpose. 

While I agree with some of the points you made and I too as a long term player want to see more important things added to the game, But please play the update I think It could change your relationship with multiple systems in the game. I personally have found myself more at war with the wildlife than before. I also believe that adding ways to protect yourself gives hinterland the ability to present more dangers. I really hope more fluffy's can make a return now that you could kill him easily inside of any cave they stick him in. I understand the hope for more custom options and such but you also have to understand that the story mode is incredibly handcuffing. They have to finish that and keep survival going at the same time so I wouldn't be too surprised to see some features not make it over immediately.  

[TerribleSurvivor]

@Rhett987 Nice comment +1. I think your thoughts about adding the revolver in your last paragraph are very intriguing. Improved means of defense against wildlife to cope with greater dangers posed by it could lead to a more complex game. I wonder what they are up to right now

[Guest kristaok]

1 hour ago, micah6vs8 said:

This is a big update. After about twenty hours in since the update (half Stalker, half DMC), I still am far from any conclusions.

Though I am beginning to think that the update increased the overall difficulty.

I do think it's more difficult, because after the Update I did a Voyager Run and literally died by 3 Wolves on Day 7.  

[TerribleSurvivor]

11 hours ago, DarKube said:

I agree but if is the player choose all of the parameters for his game, there isn't any discovering, any surprise ! You control all of the spawns !I'm against an entirely customizable spawn locations.

This is just wrong. You are saying you are against (entirely) customizable spawn locations because it takes away unpredictability? Well, first of all, in Furian's post you quoted he literally said that fixed spawn locations reduce unpredictability (because they are easy to remember)... So where is your point here?

Also, more possible locations with the right abundance parameters can and will lead to more erratic item spawns since you cannot really customize RNG.

Last but not least, it is the same old story: Nobody would ever force you to customize your game more than you want to. If you like playing with the standard difficulties, go ahead! A more customizable game would not interfere with your desires but surely would add to the experience of those who like their "own" way of playing. I already like the custom mode (the only mode i play) and any improvement would be very welcome.

Edited May 12, 2019 by TerribleSurvivor
choppy sentences lol

[Fuarian]

15 hours ago, DarKube said:

I agree but if is the player choose all of the parameters for his game, there isn't any discovering, any surprise ! You control all of the spawns !I'm against an entirely customizable spawn locations.

Not spawn locations, spawn chance.

[DarKube]

20 hours ago, TerribleSurvivor said:

This is just wrong. You are saying you are against (entirely) customizable spawn locations because it takes away unpredictability? Well, first of all, in Furian's post you quoted he literally said that fixed spawn locations reduce unpredictability (because they are easy to remember)... So where is your point here?

Also, more possible locations with the right abundance parameters can and will lead to more erratic item spawns since you cannot really customize RNG.

Last but not least, it is the same old story: Nobody would ever force you to customize your game more than you want to. If you like playing with the standard difficulties, go ahead! A more customizable game would not interfere with your desires but surely would add to the experience of those who like their "own" way of playing. I already like the custom mode (the only mode i play) and any improvement would be very welcome. 

 

16 hours ago, Fuarian said:

Not spawn locations, spawn chance.

Sorry you're right I misunderstood some sentences of the @Fuarian post. Pity the poor lonely little French 🇫🇷 😩 I agree your post.

[TerribleSurvivor]

@DarKube No problem dude. Mistakes are natural

[Vince 49]

I'll keep this short as there has already been a lot said on this subject already.

First, as has been pointed out by others, if your mode of playing represents a very small part of the total population, it stands to reason that that mode will get much less attention in updates.

Second, there have been updates to Custom Mode, although many are subtle.  For example, in the Rugged Sentinel (1.37) version, playing Stalker level, there was always a storm lantern and a broken arrow next to the dead guy just when you entered the lower part of the Carter Hydro Dam.  I like to play Stalker without the rifle, so tried Custom mode, starting with Stalker but removing the rifle.  When I did, I noticed that the broken arrow next to the dead guy was absent.  If my memory is correct, the storm lantern was also gone, along with the hunting knife near the bottom of the stairs to the second dynamo.  When I got an ultrabook, I updated to Vigilant Flame (1.47).  The broken arrow, storm lantern, and knife we back where they were in standard Stalker mode.  These, and many others, aren't in you face changes, but useful just the same.

 

Edited May 15, 2019 by Vince 49
italics

[MueckE]

The thing with TlD is, that it's actually not a survival game. It feels like a survival game when you play it the first time, for a while, but after you've survived a few runs it feels that it's "too easy".

Sandbox was meant to be just that, a sandbox, but players played it like a game itself and for new players it actually is a hardcore survival game. For Hinterland it just was the place to test things. There is nothing wrong with that. Just get used to it that the aspect of "survival" will never come back for you with TlD. Focus instead on the storymode.

After all the years i can assure you that Hinterland will not change TlD to a survival game. Why should they? For the majority of players it is a survival game because they play it a few hours and that's it. Like Raphael said, why should they change it only because a very small percentage of players would benefit from it?

Just watch how new players or players who play just a little struggle even in pilgrim mode. For the majority, that is hardcore survival and if you are honest to yourself, for you it was the same when you started playing.

[LilWolf]

13 hours ago, MueckE said:

The thing with TlD is, that it's actually not a survival game. It feels like a survival game when you play it the first time, for a while, but after you've survived a few runs it feels that it's "too easy".

Sandbox was meant to be just that, a sandbox, but players played it like a game itself and for new players it actually is a hardcore survival game. For Hinterland it just was the place to test things. There is nothing wrong with that. Just get used to it that the aspect of "survival" will never come back for you with TlD. Focus instead on the storymode.

After all the years i can assure you that Hinterland will not change TlD to a survival game. Why should they? For the majority of players it is a survival game because they play it a few hours and that's it. Like Raphael said, why should they change it only because a very small percentage of players would benefit from it?

Just watch how new players or players who play just a little struggle even in pilgrim mode. For the majority, that is hardcore survival and if you are honest to yourself, for you it was the same when you started playing.

I have to disagree. I have played TLD more than 100 hours (probably you have more hours played than me) and I don't feel it is "too easy" playing in some difficulties. Yes, for new players it can be a hardcore survival game, for veterans this game doesn't have 'secrets' (they know all the places, how to do this... etc.). Usually I've always played in Voyageur, now I'm starting to play more in Stalker (which are 'normal' and 'hard' difficulties) and personally I don't feel is "too easy", in fact, I played once Interloper and didn't enjoy it. Some people want a (extreme) challenge but others, instead, want to play 'coexisting' with the Nature, after hours and hours played.

This doesn't mean that they (developers) shouldn't care about the "small percentage" of players that want an extreme survival experience, maybe introducing more custom settings in custom games if Interloper isn't enough for them.

In the end what I want to say is that not everyone enjoy a hard, difficult, tough survival game, regardless if they are new to the game or have spent many hours playing TLD.

Edited May 16, 2019 by LilWolf