Severe Scurvy Anxiety.

[Mistral]

You can run out of matches on Interloper...? There are like 3000 of them

Otherwise I agree!

Edited November 12, 2023 by Mistral

[AdamvR]

Just now, Mistral said:

You can run out of matches on Interloper...? There are like 3000 of them

I'm not sure. I tried it a few times but realized that the suffering/return rate in that setting is not what I enjoy.
It was just what I gathered about seeing many comments overall about the value of matches in that setting - and assumed they are a lot more limited.
I do not even collect all on Stalker...

[James Hickok]

Yeah so i was a bit concerned at first as well - i like to do long runs. Then i started to think about fishing and how it may be used to diversify our diet + plus maybe introduction of new item such as Vitamin - but i would rather like for the rosehips to respawn after some time or like some1 mentioned before - the pine needles would make for a perfect vit C source. 

Good that i have all of the food ingredients stored and not used in my main bases in all of the saves i have in case they will be needed but i dont actually know how oil or salt or flour would make for a vit C source so it must be something else. I also have a fair amount of rosehips at my bases as well since the introduction of rosehip pie. 

Also i dont think this will be something that will kill you in the end. I think it will lower your stats such as health, health regeneration (if on), stamina and maybe walk speed. Maybe an increased infection risk. 

I bet that Hinterland will think of someting for the long runners. 

If not there is always this :  🤣🤣🤣

 

 

Edited November 13, 2023 by James Hickok

[Enigmaecho]

On 11/11/2023 at 1:19 PM, Leeanda said:

The only food I have that isn't from an animal is sardines,I don't eat them on any run.. but all other canned and packet food has been eaten.. I don't really have the patience for fishing and I only hunt if I need the food or hide guts...  most of the meat is ruined but I'm level 5 anyway..   

There might be some bits of food in forsaken but as I can't go there it's not helpful to me.

 Thank you.. I hope your run goes well😊

ok ive been researching and Cattails are high in VitaminC as well so if you havent eaten all those you might be good 😉😛

[Kranium]

Birch bark has Vitamin C. So does animal livers! So what we need is already there, renewables-wise. (it they think of it, I'm sure they have)

 

They could also add being able to make pine needle tea as an option - it has more Vitamin C than an orange, per weight! (IIRC) And IMO we wouldn't run out of pine needles, similar to how we don't run out of sticks.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Kranium

[Mistral]

Another interesting thing will be whether this has a "hidden" meter like cabin fever, or always visible. If it's hidden you have to manage it on your own, until the risk affliction pops up.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Mistral

[Leeanda]

5 hours ago, Enigmaecho said:

ok ive been researching and Cattails are high in VitaminC as well so if you havent eaten all those you might be good 😉😛

Ive eaten about half  of them ,maybe slightly less.  But if they are the remedy then are they going to last ?   We don't know how many you'd need to eat or how often....they're not exactly high in calories lol😁

[piddy3825]

I'm looking forward to scurvy, especially considering I've been living on an almost exclusively all meat diet for the past 8 years!
That being said, I'm curious as to what "element" they might be introducing to combat scurvy.  Maybe it'll be a combo remedy like mixing birch bark and 
rosehip teas to create a vitamin c rich tea.  At the very least, the ole pine needle tea potion or something like that.  And let's not forget about the looting aspect of searching for and finding vitamin c pills in medicine cabinets and first aid kits.  I sure hope it's a multiple approach so as to be more immersive.   

[turtle777]

On 11/11/2023 at 1:19 PM, Leeanda said:

The only food I have that isn't from an animal is sardines...

LOL, vegan sardines ???

[Leeanda]

23 minutes ago, turtle777 said:

LOL, vegan sardines ???

Lol...  good point ,well noticed..    tofu fish doesn't sound very appealing😁.   

Obviously I meant something I haven't killed myself... mainly bears ,that pv farm bear is just such an easy target.

[hozz1235]

Related post:

 

[Sherri]

I'm pretty excited about the scurvy addition. It always seemed a bit silly to me that I could basically camp out in one place and live off a respawning bear forever. This forces variety and exploration which is great.

I trust HL to have a long-game plan in mind.

[Ape88]

It would be nice to see pine needles used as a vitamin c source.

[Third Try]

In real life people do live on a carnaviore diet (like @piddy3825 as well as some of my friends) and many native peoples (especially the more north you go) lived off a lot of it.  The current vitamin C recomendations are based on if you eat lots of starches, which require more vitamin c to digest (if I understand it right), and if you eat fresh meat (not highly proccesed, salted or dried) then you will never get scurvy.  Sailors in the old days would get it from living off wheat and dried foods for months at a time.

  I am a vegetarian, so when @Leeanda said the 'only food not from animals that I use is sardines' I was like "I want some!"  Lol.

[piddy3825]

2 hours ago, Third Try said:

In real life people do live on a carnaviore diet (like @piddy3825 as well as some of my friends) and many native peoples (especially the more north you go) lived off a lot of it.  The current vitamin C recomendations are based on if you eat lots of starches, which require more vitamin c to digest (if I understand it right), and if you eat fresh meat (not highly proccesed, salted or dried) then you will never get scurvy.  Sailors in the old days would get it from living off wheat and dried foods for months at a time.

  I am a vegetarian, so when @Leeanda said the 'only food not from animals that I use is sardines' I was like "I want some!"  Lol.

lol, I really do hope you know that I was merely commenting in context of playing the game...

...although I do love me a good steak!

[UpUpAway95]

7 hours ago, Third Try said:

In real life people do live on a carnaviore diet (like @piddy3825 as well as some of my friends) and many native peoples (especially the more north you go) lived off a lot of it.  The current vitamin C recomendations are based on if you eat lots of starches, which require more vitamin c to digest (if I understand it right), and if you eat fresh meat (not highly proccesed, salted or dried) then you will never get scurvy.  Sailors in the old days would get it from living off wheat and dried foods for months at a time.

  I am a vegetarian, so when @Leeanda said the 'only food not from animals that I use is sardines' I was like "I want some!"  Lol.

I think there is some controversy over how Vitamin and starches interact.  The study I read seemed to be indicating that high doses of Vitamin C block the processing of starch into glucose.

Within the context of the game, however, it is certain now that scurvy is going to be something our character can get.  It will affect his/her stats in some way.  The game will also have a process where it can be cured and also a process where it can be prevented.

[UTC-10]

tl;dr For practical purposes humans do not make Vitamin C however there is some portion of the population that can make enough to stave off scurvy but that is not to say they can remain healthy under all circumstances.  Not that it matters to the game.  

 

That humans do not make Vitamin C is true enough but not complete.  We lack the final enzyme to catalyze the reaction that converts the precursor substrates the process produces into Vitamin C.  But that broken enzyme does not preclude the natural reaction that covert the precursor substrates into Vitamin C it is just that would be at a very slow rate (1/1,000 of the enzyme assisted reaction so effectively not much or nominally non-existent).  Still that would be enough to produce 10-15 mg of Vitamin C a day which was sufficient to keep those lucky people in reasonably good health in the face of a lack of any other Vitamin C source.  

Further up the process there can be a different enzyme that can be broken which precludes the production of the precursor substrate and thereby prevents ANY Vitamin C production at all.  These folks have to get Vitamin C from other sources or they will get scurvy.  

A historical point was that not everyone on the long ocean voyages got scurvy.  Many did and often died but some did not.  

Exchanged a few emails with a Professor who knew about the phenomenon and he said that there was no way to actually experiment to find out who or what percentage of the general population might have this residual Vitamin C capacity due to medical ethics.  It is known that some populations, such as nomadic Arabs in the Sahara, have as a result of their way of life, a long time ago,  eliminated anyone who could not make any Vitamin C from their population. 

🍋✔️

[Even Dark]

On 11/14/2023 at 6:35 PM, Sherri said:

I'm pretty excited about the scurvy addition. It always seemed a bit silly to me that I could basically camp out in one place and live off a respawning bear forever. This forces variety and exploration which is great.

I trust HL to have a long-game plan in mind.

i like this  nothing wrong with this, but you dont need to wait for one bear you just need to stay and eat your collected food ;). you can hunt first all bears and finally eat the meat. 

what i see so far in a 2nd run the scurvy system will not really change anything, you just  have to fish and store some fishes. it shows up to much if you like to explore only. if you eat 5kg of fish then scurvy should not show up for the next 2 weeks......

 and finally you prefer regions where you have a fishing hut or you need to bring fishes to other regions by man/woman power of carry it.

this new system change just 1 thing stop just hunting for food go fishing too to survive.... fishing is the new key to do it but i like hunting more so they better work on a good hunting system  

 

a long survive needs just playtime and knowledge, and have fun to play and the will to survive a long long time nothing else. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by Even Dark

[James Hickok]

On 12/19/2023 at 2:51 PM, Even Dark said:

i like this  nothing wrong with this, but you dont need to wait for one bear you just need to stay and eat your collected food ;). you can hunt first all bears and finally eat the meat. 

what i see so far in a 2nd run the scurvy system will not really change anything, you just  have to fish and store some fishes. it shows up to much if you like to explore only. if you eat 5kg of fish then scurvy should not show up for the next 2 weeks......

 and finally you prefer regions where you have a fishing hut or you need to bring fishes to other regions by man/woman power of carry it.

this new system change just 1 thing stop just hunting for food go fishing too to survive.... fishing is the new key to do it but i like hunting more so they better work on a good hunting system  

 

a long survive needs just playtime and knowledge, and have fun to play and the will to survive a long long time nothing else. 

Im reaching day 90ish on my new loper run and scurvy risk appeared around day 65-70. I decided not to harvest any of rose hips, reishi, acorns, i only make birch tea but i dont use tea on loper anyway only on harder difficulties. I also decided not to eat any of the human food - i gather it all in my main base. So around day 65 my diet switched from mostly cattails to meat and scurvy decided to show up. 

I have cuntered it by eating a few cattails but the next day it came back. At that moment i have hunted all of the game in ML and it needed a restart so i decided to go fishing. I have been fishing for around 2 days and one night and caught quite a number of them on lvl 2 fishing (no lure, no bait). While i was fishing the fish was cooking and they were my diet for the duration. After i finished i hauled the remaining fish to my main base @ ML camp office and stored it near my meat supply. 

After that i didnt have scurvy for a week or more. When it came back i ate 2x fish and it vanished. Atm im after a week in game and still no scurvy risk. It seems like all you need to do i diversify your diet a bit with fish and thats it. You dont need to eat fish everyday - just one or 2 once a week or even more is ok. NO BIG DEAL. Even if your wolrd has no harvestables or food eaten. Should have been implemented in old saves. 

[Even Dark]

On 12/21/2023 at 10:19 AM, James Hickok said:

Im reaching day 90ish on my new loper run and scurvy risk appeared around day 65-70. I decided not to harvest any of rose hips, reishi, acorns, i only make birch tea but i dont use tea on loper anyway only on harder difficulties. I also decided not to eat any of the human food - i gather it all in my main base. So around day 65 my diet switched from mostly cattails to meat and scurvy decided to show up. 

I have cuntered it by eating a few cattails but the next day it came back. At that moment i have hunted all of the game in ML and it needed a restart so i decided to go fishing. I have been fishing for around 2 days and one night and caught quite a number of them on lvl 2 fishing (no lure, no bait). While i was fishing the fish was cooking and they were my diet for the duration. After i finished i hauled the remaining fish to my main base @ ML camp office and stored it near my meat supply. 

After that i didnt have scurvy for a week or more. When it came back i ate 2x fish and it vanished. Atm im after a week in game and still no scurvy risk. It seems like all you need to do i diversify your diet a bit with fish and thats it. You dont need to eat fish everyday - just one or 2 once a week or even more is ok. NO BIG DEAL. Even if your wolrd has no harvestables or food eaten. Should have been implemented in old saves. 

i am on day 160 now i did my fishing eat 2 days fish and scurvy is for the moment all the time present. i read you need daily 20 units Vitamin C, birch bark gives you 6 so daily 4 teas then XD. For the endgame: cold doesnt matter, hunt is just for hides and a bit meat the rest go fishing and search birchbark.

in my opinion fishing is not what the game makes great and if you like to explore and break down stuff you need all the time to hurry up go to the next fishing hut :/. setup the world with fish we can do this but it is boring. if you dont like long survivers, that they eat all there hunted meat, then change the hunt/meat system. 

[Enigmaecho]

On 12/21/2023 at 4:19 AM, James Hickok said:

Im reaching day 90ish on my new loper run and scurvy risk appeared around day 65-70. I decided not to harvest any of rose hips, reishi, acorns, i only make birch tea but i dont use tea on loper anyway only on harder difficulties. I also decided not to eat any of the human food - i gather it all in my main base. So around day 65 my diet switched from mostly cattails to meat and scurvy decided to show up. 

I have cuntered it by eating a few cattails but the next day it came back. At that moment i have hunted all of the game in ML and it needed a restart so i decided to go fishing. I have been fishing for around 2 days and one night and caught quite a number of them on lvl 2 fishing (no lure, no bait). While i was fishing the fish was cooking and they were my diet for the duration. After i finished i hauled the remaining fish to my main base @ ML camp office and stored it near my meat supply. 

After that i didnt have scurvy for a week or more. When it came back i ate 2x fish and it vanished. Atm im after a week in game and still no scurvy risk. It seems like all you need to do i diversify your diet a bit with fish and thats it. You dont need to eat fish everyday - just one or 2 once a week or even more is ok. NO BIG DEAL. Even if your wolrd has no harvestables or food eaten. Should have been implemented in old saves. 

This just reignites my irritation that they kept it out of old saves, starting to feel more like “don’t want to burden existing saves with scurvy” was actually “we didn’t feel like making it work in old saves “ 😑

[James Hickok]

Day 150. Havent seen scurvy for 50 days. I dont drink teas or human food. Just some cat tails now and then when I travel and fish once a week or so. No scurvy risk at all. I have fish stocked at my main base. I fish no lure no bait and I get ton of fish. Lvl 4 fishing actually. Piece of cake as I said. 

[UTC-10]

I wonder if the limiting scurvy to new saves might be a kind of test to see if the mechanic they introduced actually would work as intended when it went live.  It could always be made to go live on existing saves but if there was some serious bug in the mechanic's implementation then maybe better to keep the affect population smaller for the immediate future until they were sure.  

[Even Dark]

6 hours ago, James Hickok said:

Day 150. Havent seen scurvy for 50 days. I dont drink teas or human food. Just some cat tails now and then when I travel and fish once a week or so. No scurvy risk at all. I have fish stocked at my main base. I fish no lure no bait and I get ton of fish. Lvl 4 fishing actually. Piece of cake as I said. 

so the scurvy is not strong in you  for now in my new run the scurvy is allways there with cat tails, bb teas and now fish. 

Edited December 26, 2023 by Even Dark

[James Hickok]

I just got back from finishing signal void and looting FA yesterday. Before i went there i ate fish for the day - i always eat fish for 1 or 2 days before i leave to explore so scurvy does not kick in fast and it seems to work. I was in FA for 9 ingame days, looted everything and when i decided to go back (i still want to explore BI and Blackrock before i start ZoC) and when i was on my way scurvy risk kicked in. When i was back @ ML Camp office (main base) i went fishing for about 2 days and 2 nights. Caught a lot of fish and ate them for the duration so i guess im good to go explore for a week or so without geting the risk. So far it works fine that way. The travois is such a great tool for fishing as well - i can haul those heavy fish in one go from the fishing hut to where i want. So far i find scurvy a nice addition to game - it made fishing a strategy now. I will have to let scurvy develop on purpouse so i can see what it really does when untreated. 

Edited December 27, 2023 by James Hickok