Has respawn logic... changed?

[AdamvR]

Ok, that does it...
I'm suspecting for a while, that the way how wolves respawn have changed in one of these latest updates.
For years I've had the experience, that once you clear up an area, you get some peace at least until the carcasses despawn, (about 4-5 days). 
I could even help it by not (fully) harvesting the carcasses, so they stay on the ground longer.

I have the feel that it is no longer the case, they are coming back almost instantly, while their "previous reincarnations" are still lying around.
I've noticed it first in FA, with the kennel of 4 under the island house still taking their well deserved rest, some new and very vivid guys shown up between them...
There were also other suspicious situations.

Most recently, as I'm entering the Pier in BI:
- there were 4 Timberwolves patrolling the yard. I sneaked up on them with a bow: 3 laying on the ground, one got away.
- took some of the meat, slept an hour or two in the chamber behind the rope, then climbed up with the goodies and starting the circle: there are again 4 T-wolves aggroing from below. (I actually had to drop the meat before jumping on the boat, so there was nothing smelly on me).
I took down 3 with the rifle, one got away again.
I am about halfway doing the circle: there are again 2 whining around. By the time I've reached the end of the peer: 3.

Has anyone else noticed that respawn logic may have changed? or is it just my perception? is this intentional?
Thanks for your insight!

Edited November 21, 2023 by AdamvR
typo

[Leeanda]

I've only noticed it with the bear at PV farm,he seems to be coming back as soon as the last carcass despawns..   but to be honest I think the bears are seriously bugged anyway..

I can't say with the wolves,the last 8;0 I shot I never even found the carcasses.. 

Twolfes at the cannery work differently though.  I'm not sure how or why but I'm sure someone can explain it.

[ManicManiac]

The oddest thing I've seen lately... is a ridiculous abundance of moose.
In the span of one day, I once positively identified three (one in each region I went through that day).

Traditionally... there was only supposed to be one moose at a time that migrated around Great Bear (later there was a dedicated moose spawn in Bleak Inlet).  This made a moose hunt a rather good test of patience and persistence...  These days, I can hardly go more than three days without seeing one, they seem so terribly abundant now. 

I'm kind of hoping this is a bug... but I guess time will tell.

Edited November 21, 2023 by ManicManiac

[LostRealist]

1 hour ago, ManicManiac said:

Traditionally... there was only supposed to be one moose at a time that migrated around Great Bear

Is this really confirmed though? I've heard about that, but I cannot recall ever being able to confirm it at any point in time and I had come to the conclusion that this was a misunderstanding. Afterall, if it was true, what good would a spawn rate setting for custom games be for them? Either way, I haven't experienced any upticks there.

As for the wolves I also haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary. Bear spawns on the other hand are weird at the moment.

[stratvox]

That has definitely not been confirmed. That said I'm definitely not seeing an overabundance of either moose or wolves; my expectations for respawns is basically being met by the game. I play custom, which means it's possible that one of the trad difficulties (ie pilgrim through to interloper) might have a problem with its settings not being the same, rather than that they're not working.

[LostRealist]

1 hour ago, stratvox said:

I play custom, which means it's possible that one of the trad difficulties (ie pilgrim through to interloper) might have a problem with its settings not being the same, rather than that they're not working.

Pretty good point I think. I also play custom.

[ManicManiac]

3 hours ago, LostRealist said:

Is this really confirmed though? I've heard about that, but I cannot recall ever being able to confirm it at any point in time and I had come to the conclusion that this was a misunderstanding.

Fair enough... perhaps that's the case.  In any event that was years ago... perhaps @Admin could shed some light on it.
In either case, I can't imagine that finding three moose in one day is intended behavior... but who knows, maybe it is.

If it's the new normal, then that's fine... I just think I liked it better when moose were rare and harder to find.

[Enigmaecho]

Spawn times seem to be unchanged but damage thresholds are WAY higher now I shot a bear 7 times in the face before it went down, wolves taking two shots to break off attack charges, Timberwolves morale is back to being obnoxiously hard to break

[UpUpAway95]

3 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Fair enough... perhaps that's the case.  In any event that was years ago... perhaps @Admin could shed some light on it.
In either case, I can't imagine that finding three moose in one day is intended behavior... but who knows, maybe it is.

If it's the new normal, then that's fine... I just think I liked it better when moose were rare and harder to find.

I think it might just be your RNG.   I'm not finding them to be particularly more frequent than before, even on files where I've increased their spawn rates to the max.  In fact, in a few different starts in certain regions, I'm getting fewer active moose spawns than ever.  For example, 5 starts in Mystery Lake with moose spawns pushed to very high have only yielded 1 moose.  I've yet to get a moose to spawn in Broken Railroad in my last 5 starts there (and that zone used to be very reliable for me).  I did get one start where a moose spawned in Milton Basin and the adjacent moose in Marsh Ridge also spawned at the same time (or immediately after I took out the one in Milton Basin).

I say - count your blessings and never look a bunch of gift moose meat in the mouth!

[UpUpAway95]

30 minutes ago, Enigmaecho said:

Spawn times seem to be unchanged but damage thresholds are WAY higher now I shot a bear 7 times in the face before it went down, wolves taking two shots to break off attack charges, Timberwolves morale is back to being obnoxiously hard to break

I seldom try to take down a bear with multiple shots if I can avoid it.  I take one long shot (preferably from a location where he doesn't really know where the shot is coming from), check my journal to confirm the hit, and then run off and hide and let him bleed out (checking the journal to confirm when he's gone down) - and then I use the crows to find the carcass.  It can take a day (depending on how good my shot was), but it seldom fails.

Both moose I've killed since I started playing again (i.e. since the QOL update) have gone down in 2 rifle hits.

Edited November 22, 2023 by UpUpAway95

[ManicManiac]

7 hours ago, stratvox said:

That said I'm definitely not seeing an overabundance of either moose or wolves; my expectations for respawns is basically being met by the game.

38 minutes ago, UpUpAway95 said:

I think it might just be your RNG.   I'm not finding them to be particularly more frequent than before, even on files where I've increased their spawn rates to the max.  In fact, in a few different starts in certain regions, I'm getting fewer active moose spawns than ever.

I say - count your blessings and never look a bunch of gift moose meat in the mouth!

Okay, fair enough... I apricate the additional observations.

The tragedy for me then, is that I've been on a "no hunting" sort of a stalker run (as an additional proviso to my personal challenge).  So, of course... that's when the game decides to be overly generous.  

[James Hickok]

14 hours ago, AdamvR said:

Ok, that does it...
I'm suspecting for a while, that the way how wolves respawn have changed in one of these latest updates.
For years I've had the experience, that once you clear up an area, you get some peace at least until the carcasses despawn, (about 4-5 days). 
I could even help it by not (fully) harvesting the carcasses, so they stay on the ground longer.

I have the feel that it is no longer the case, they are coming back almost instantly, while their "previous reincarnations" are still lying around.
I've noticed it first in FA, with the kennel of 4 under the island house still taking their well deserved rest, some new and very vivid guys shown up between them...
There were also other suspicious situations.

Most recently, as I'm entering the Pier in BI:
- there were 4 Timberwolves patrolling the yard. I sneaked up on them with a bow: 3 laying on the ground, one got away.
- took some of the meat, slept an hour or two in the chamber behind the rope, then climbed up with the goodies and starting the circle: there are again 4 T-wolves aggroing from below. (I actually had to drop the meat before jumping on the boat, so there was nothing smelly on me).
I took down 3 with the rifle, one got away again.
I am about halfway doing the circle: there are again 2 whining around. By the time I've reached the end of the peer: 3.

Has anyone else noticed that respawn logic may have changed? or is it just my perception? is this intentional?
Thanks for your insight!

As much as i understand Your point 

more wolves = 

[hozz1235]

18 hours ago, LostRealist said:

Is this really confirmed though? I've heard about that, but I cannot recall ever being able to confirm it at any point in time and I had come to the conclusion that this was a misunderstanding. Afterall, if it was true, what good would a spawn rate setting for custom games be for them? Either way, I haven't experienced any upticks there.

As for the wolves I also haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary. Bear spawns on the other hand are weird at the moment.

Using the fly cheat, I suppose you could quickly scout the moose spawn areas in each zone to confirm this.  Once you find a moose, you would also want to return to that area to confirm it had not de-spawned while you were flying around checking other spawns.

I would think that "only a single moose can exist on GBI at a time" is false though.  Just think, if you didn't know where that ONE moose was, until he de-spawned, you would NEVER find another moose!

[UpUpAway95]

11 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Okay, fair enough... I apricate the additional observations.

The tragedy for me then, is that I've been on a "no hunting" sort of a stalker run (as an additional proviso to my personal challenge).  So, of course... that's when the game decides to be overly generous.  

Yes, of course (lol).  I don't know how the game knows, but I swear it does somehow.  Good luck on your run!

[AdamvR]

@ManicManiac: maybe it was the same Moose travelling with you? and you kept meeting it because you have not killed it in the previous map?
Quite a persistent one, for sure:)

I observed the number of moose to be fine, meeting one every 30-40 days on average (?), which is around what I had before I think...
They definitely did not immediately respawn after shooting...:)

[ManicManiac]

42 minutes ago, hozz1235 said:

"only a single moose can exist on GBI at a time" is false though

I don't think anyone said that... I think you are cherry picking a little bit and taking those few words out of context.  - Either way though, I'm not going to be drawn in to an argument with you about it.  I frankly just don't have time for that.

*****

Now what I did say:

20 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

one moose at a time that migrated around Great Bear (later there was a dedicated moose spawn in Bleak Inlet).

For everyone else, here is the greater context of how it appeared the moose used to work:

On 2/8/2020 at 2:48 PM, ManicManiac said:

I don't claim to know definitively... but the following is what I've personally observed (or what has been posted by Hinterland) about the moose behavior:

There are various possible moose spawning points.  At the beginning of a survival sandbox, spawn points are pseudo-randomly selected from amongst the pool of possible spawn points.  Only one moose will spawn at a time, and that one moose will "migrate" between all the spawn points that were selected at the beginning of the run.  The longest I've seen the moose stay in one location has been 4 game days. 

By this I mean, that it seems the moose will change locations at some interval between 1 and 4 game days - though this duration may have changed in more recent updates, and it's also possible that a longer stay in one location may in truth result from the same location being selected for consecutive intervals.  Once successfully hunted, then the population respawn interval for the moose (at the selected difficulty) must pass before the migration process will begin again.

Ideally, I think I would like it if the timber wolf packs functioned in a similar fashion when they eventually escape Bleak Inlet and start invading other regions  

Now this was the time between 2017 (when the moose was new) and 2020... The admins have never corrected the idea in the past, and up until recently this seemed to be demonstrably the case.   These days we know of at least one dedicated Moose spawn (that is a moose that is pretty much a sure thing regardless of any other moose that may or may not be elsewhere on great bear island.

For having spotted multiple moose in a single day suggests to me that there are just more moose potentially spawning in the game world than there used to be.  That's all I was saying.

I hope @Admin will be able to shed some more light on it.

[turtle777]

21 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Traditionally... there was only supposed to be one moose at a time that migrated around Great Bear

I have never heard of that, and the experience in the game was never as such.

E.g. moose in Milton could exist, and as soon as you climb down into the basin, there could be another moose. If that's the same, its would have to outrun and outclimb you.

-t

[ManicManiac]

6 minutes ago, turtle777 said:

Milton could exist, and as soon as you climb down into the basin, there could be another moose.

Certainly possible, but not something I'd ever experienced before more recent updates.

Again though, I don't claim to know for sure... these had just been my observations in the past and put together with what Hinterland has mentioned about moose behavior in the past.  I've tried to go on a forum scavenger hunt... but have had limited time. 

Again... hopefully admin will be able to shed more light on it.

[ManicManiac]

Granted of course... in more recent years, it seems to be the general consensus that multiple moose are just out there in Great Bear Island now.  I don't question the observations of others that have spoken about their personal experiences.

I acknowledge that on my last two long runs that it could be just ridiculously generous RNG; I've said as much.
Regardless of that... just the number of folks that have spotted multiple extant moose roaming around, that it seems clear that however it may have worked in the past doesn't seem to be the way it's working these days (I don't argue that either).

I do sort of miss that moose seemed much rarer and elusive then they seem to be these days... that's all.