New harvesting policy and interloper

[yoli]

Now we cannot harvest carcasses with bare hands anymore (unless they are found, but not those we kill ourselves), this creates a increased difficulty in Interloper mode, where we don't start with a knife or hatchet. Has this been taken into account by the design team? Interloper has just gotten more difficult with the recent updates.

Edited January 9 by yoli

[ManicManiac]

To be fair... you only need a tool to get harvesting started, after that we can continue harvesting by hand if we want to.

Here is what Raph had to say when I was looking for clarification:

Yes... I think it's safe to say they took it into consideration.
Besides there are still ways to eat without tools... fish don't need any tools to prep for cooking (at least not as far as I know).  Granted, we need at least a hammer or a prybar to get through the ice, and some basic tackle... fair to point out.  I just mean that the fish themselves don't require a knife to gut and ready for cooking.  ...also we can get fish via beachcombing, so we don't even necessarily have to "fish" in order to get fish.  

Cattails stalks, birchbark, rosehips, reishi mushrooms... none of these require tools to gather, and of course the only "tool" the teas need is a recycled can (which the interloper will start with anyway).  There are also a good number of ravaged carcasses (sometimes several in the same region).

Also, it's worth noting that if we get a wolf to hunt for us... we can get nearly an entire deer carcass harvested by hand with minimal loss.  

Personally, I like the new harvesting mechanic.  Before this update... I didn't find that any of the tools were absolutely necessary for survival (as I could easily survive for lengthy runs without them), even on interloper (I once did a "no forges" interloper run, just to prove a point).  
With this update... now a sharp edge is much more necessary if we are going hunt for ourselves.

Edited January 9 by ManicManiac

[xanna]

And don't forget that on Interloper, if you're hunting anything bigger than rabbit and ptarmigan, you must have already been to the forge. You can forge a blade while you forge your bow. So it 'only' affects early game rabbit and ptarmigan meals. I say 'only' because I realise that's still quite a big deal, but with thief strat and ravaged carcasses and cattiails it's definitely not a game-ender. And other changes lately have made loper easier, so I appreciate a bit of balance.

[yoli]

The change is not dramatic but makes the first steps in Interloper a little more difficult. For example I started in Ash Canyon, managed to survive a few days but still haven't found any tool nor bedroll. Hopefully there are plenty of Cattails stalks there, but all the rabbits I catch I cannot use, unlike earlier. No big deal, but I thought Interloper was hard enough as it was (I am talking about the first days mainly).

Edited January 9 by yoli

[conanjaguar]

2 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Personally, I like the new harvesting mechanic.

Agreed for the most part, although I would prefer if a tiny exception was made for harvesting down from ptarmigans.

[James Hickok]

13 hours ago, yoli said:

The change is not dramatic but makes the first steps in Interloper a little more difficult. For example I started in Ash Canyon, managed to survive a few days but still haven't found any tool nor bedroll. Hopefully there are plenty of Cattails stalks there, but all the rabbits I catch I cannot use, unlike earlier. No big deal, but I thought Interloper was hard enough as it was (I am talking about the first days mainly).

I like the change in harvesting - its more "realistic" now and as said above there are plenty of cattails, washed ashore fish, human food in interiors so there is no real need to harvest a deer during those few days when you start. By day 10ish you should be forging anyway unless you have bad luck with Hammer but it easy to find IMO - you just need to fast loot a few regions on your way to the forge.

There are no tools to be found on interloper what so ever. Only craft. 

I wouldnt spend more than a day in Ash canyon if i spawned there. I would go TWM -=> PV -=> CH and then if i have hammer and hacksaw -=> DP if not -=> ML if still not -=> Milton if somehow still not -=> HRV (guaranteed hammer) then back to FM to forge. The whole point in early loper is to run thru regions fast and loot loot loot. 

Also after i craft bow and tools i immediately go to AC for backpack and get back via summit in TWM. 

[yoli]

2 hours ago, James Hickok said:

There are no tools to be found on interloper what so ever. Only craft. 

I wouldnt spend more than a day in Ash canyon if i spawned there. I would go TWM -=> PV -=> CH and then if i have hammer and hacksaw -=> DP if not -=> ML if still not -=> Milton if somehow still not -=> HRV (guaranteed hammer) then back to FM to forge. The whole point in early loper is to run thru regions fast and loot loot loot. 

Also after i craft bow and tools i immediately go to AC for backpack and get back via summit in TWM. 

Thanks for the tips, I will try that

[yoli]

3 hours ago, James Hickok said:

I like the change in harvesting - its more "realistic" now

I am not sure about that. Making it harder to harvest fresh carcass without sharp tool makes sense but making it impossible doesn't imo. I would have preferred a modification where there are attempts to cut open with a stick or a stone (some may be sharp). These attempts would fail often or take time but after a while could succeed.

I made a post about this improvement here:

 

Edited January 10 by yoli

[hozz1235]

1 hour ago, yoli said:

I am not sure about that. Making it harder to harvest fresh carcass without sharp tool makes sense but making it impossible doesn't imo. 

Or, they could have increased the harvest time if harvesting by hand.

[Jalos]

4 hours ago, James Hickok said:

There are no tools to be found on interloper what so ever. Only craft. 

Except the hacksaw, that enough for initial harvesting!

[xanna]

26 minutes ago, Jalos said:

Except the hacksaw, that enough for initial harvesting!

Very very good point.

[James Hickok]

1 hour ago, Jalos said:

Except the hacksaw, that enough for initial harvesting!

You got me there 😁

[Mistral]

I don't mind the change really per say but if you're doing one region -run it makes it less likely you can keep surviving if hacksaw doesn't spawn it. I mean you can sort of cheat it by luring wolfs into killing the deer or rabbits but that's exploitative

Also obviously not realistic considering you can skin rabbits with bare hands IRL

[Mistral]

Furthermore, what would have made actual sense was if they enabled carcass harvesting by hand if you reached level 3 of harvesting skill, to bring it in line with fire starting = no tinder for Fire skill level 3

[manolitode]

I like how they broke my chain of actions routine in early interloper. Gave me a reason to try other methods. Since I can no longer start off with a rabbit stoning spree and cure them fast for hat and gloves, I have to rethink. Very nice.  

[yoli]

17 hours ago, Mistral said:

Furthermore, what would have made actual sense was if they enabled carcass harvesting by hand if you reached level 3 of harvesting skill, to bring it in line with fire starting = no tinder for Fire skill level 3

That would be pretty cool actually, and not to many changes to current mechanics.

[stirfoo]

That threw me off a bit at first but it keeps me moving and eating cat tails til I find the hacksaw and/or hammer. One other difference I noticed is the amount of matches in new random places. Lots and lots of matches. I think once you've put a lot of hours into interloper, it doesn't really matter what changes the devs make, you'll find a way to survive. Thanks for shaking things up and keeping the game interesting!

[yoli]

On 1/13/2024 at 7:36 PM, stirfoo said:

That threw me off a bit at first but it keeps me moving and eating cat tails til I find the hacksaw and/or hammer. One other difference I noticed is the amount of matches in new random places. Lots and lots of matches. I think once you've put a lot of hours into interloper, it doesn't really matter what changes the devs make, you'll find a way to survive. Thanks for shaking things up and keeping the game interesting!

Yes I got much better at Interloper lately, after many attempts. What helps a lot is knowing the maps and where the interesting stuffs are.

[James Hickok]

On my current NOGOA run which is very successful (im on my way to the Summit in deer clearing cave atm with backpack equipped day 26, forging on day 14) i had no problems to switch from eating rabbits. I think that there are more deer carcass in the game and i got my skins, guts and food no problem since the start. Also i confirm i find more matches. 

[yoli]

I am glad the harvesting of fresh material with bare hands is back in update 2.27, very welcome in Interloper! It supposedly produces less food (not by much on rabbits though) but that's ok.

Edited January 27 by yoli