Bow shaking when player is cold in last update

[Quetza]

In the build "escape the darkwalker" 1.86 67831S, when the player is cold, when aimed, now the bow is shaking.
It is not swaying, it is not because of archery level (lvl5 in my game), it is shaking a lot and targeting is almost impossible, rendering the bow useless as soon as cold. 
In interloper difficulty, the player is almost always cold which makes hunting with the bow now impossible.

Why hinterland ? 
A very frustrated player who can't enjoy one of his favorite game anymore.

[Dr. S.]

Yeah, it's like that in the test build, so I've been playing with that for a while. It's definitely an adjustment.

[odium]

does it only shake when the cold meter is in red?  that makes total sense and i would welcome that feature

[Dr. S.]

Yes, only when you're frozen.

[Quetza]

So it was in the test build and probably wasn't intended to be released in the game (yet). 
I expect a revert on that after the event or even before, because that "small" change is making the game harder to another level.
And to be honest, I may not be willing to play the game anymore beacause of it.
 

[Mr. 0]

Rifle is shaking too, its logical that bow is similar (or even harscer, because you need strenght to keep it ready).

Quetza, time to back into rocking rabbits. If you wanna survive.

[peteloud]

While playing TLD I have often thought that there should be a shake element in gun & bow use when the player is suffering from severe cold.  It would be more realistic.

However it is difficult to balance adding realism which makes the game more difficult but reduces player enjoyment.  If a player finds the game too difficult they might give up.  So it might be necessary to to compensate for that extra difficulty by changing something to make it easier.   At the moment I can not think what would be best to change to keep the difficulty/realism balance acceptable.

 

[Mr. 0]

maybe stoping shake after drinking a hot cup of tea/coffe?

[peteloud]

25 minutes ago, Mr. 0 said:

maybe stoping shake after drinking a hot cup of tea/coffe?

Yes,  I think that is a good idea.

[Dr. S.]

4 hours ago, Mr. 0 said:

maybe stoping shake after drinking a hot cup of tea/coffe?

That's how it works now, because anything that raises your core temperature out of the red stops the shaking. So drinking a hot beverage or spending a few minutes indoors or in the back of a cave works. It doesn't necessarily last very long of course, depending on the "feels like" temperature.

[manolitode]

I just fired 10 wobbly arrows at one evanescent deer. But this modification makes perfect sense and it probably didn't take long for the player to grasp why the character started to shake so I think it's a natural addition to the game. We'll have to plan a little more to keep warm when hunting, which means another much welcome layer of strategy. Though perhaps the shake could be just a little less intense ☺️

[Quetza]

Making a change in the game has little to do with its plausibility, it has to relate primarely to gameplay and game mechanics :
Some examples of irrealistic behavior in the game related to warmth : beverages are hot for an hour and cold after, hot beverages never evaporates when close to a fire, the player don't get warmth from doing intense effort (like running).

Making the bow wobbly when cold is a nice constraint for stalker and below level of difficulty, because the player is warm most of the time.

In interloper, the main killer is the cold, and the player is freezing most of the time. Adding more difficulty in sucessfully hit targets, with the only available weapon, will have an effect on : arrows, bow, fuel, matches, and beverages consumption. And of course the grindiness of the game (and archery level).

So in my opinion, this change would only be impactful for interloper players, rather cosmetic for the others.

[Looper]

17 hours ago, Quetza said:

Making a change in the game has little to do with its plausibility, it has to relate primarely to gameplay and game mechanics :
Some examples of irrealistic behavior in the game related to warmth : beverages are hot for an hour and cold after, hot beverages never evaporates when close to a fire, the player don't get warmth from doing intense effort (like running).

Making the bow wobbly when cold is a nice constraint for stalker and below level of difficulty, because the player is warm most of the time.

In interloper, the main killer is the cold, and the player is freezing most of the time. Adding more difficulty in sucessfully hit targets, with the only available weapon, will have an effect on : arrows, bow, fuel, matches, and beverages consumption. And of course the grindiness of the game (and archery level).

So in my opinion, this change would only be impactful for interloper players, rather cosmetic for the others.

It is very possible to play interloper without freezing all the time. Just adapt playstyle using hot teas, good clothes etc. I've played the old dead man challenge where freezing will eat you precious health for good, then one finds out how far you can go without freezing. 

[Looper]

On 10/30/2020 at 7:08 PM, Quetza said:

Why hinterland ? 
A very frustrated player who can't enjoy one of his favorite game anymore

Try to adapt you playstyle. Use teas, warm clothes - light a fire near hunting ground.  The change make perfect sense

[ManicManiac]

The shiver effect on aiming while the player is "freezing" was introduced a while back (with the Rifle revamp).  If the player is starving or freezing, both would mess with our aim.  If I remember correctly: Freezing would induce a "shiver," while Starvation would induce a heavier "sway" (suggesting the character was feeling weak/woozy from hunger)

Perhaps they are now making sure it applies the bow now as well. 

Personally, I like it. 

Edited November 1, 2020 by ManicManiac

[LongJohnNoOne]

Hey everyone, after the update i have this thing happen to me too. But it's not the bow shaking, it's the entire screen instead. It's extremely frustrating. Anyone else experiencing that? makes it impossible to hit anything or even judge distance on the target.

[Quetza]

Fires, hot beverages and warm clothing are already used to their full extent by interloper players, I don't feel there is much to adapt here.
Yes, the challenges and feats are good to know the game better and change the playstyle according to the goal (I've got/done them all). But we are talking about the main game experience here.

How about make the snow shelter more usefull ? 
I barely use it because of the need for cloth in its crafting recipe and because of its insanely quick condition loss (10% a day as I recall ?).
How about removing the need for cloth and increase the stick consumption a little (like 25 sticks to make the shelter and only sticks to repair it) ?
That way, I would surely built them more often to get warm and to cook/harvest the kills.

[Serenity]

With the best clothing you can get to one arrow down in the late afternoon. That allows you to be warm for a long time

[Looper]

On 11/2/2020 at 6:00 PM, Quetza said:

Fires, hot beverages and warm clothing are already used to their full extent by interloper players, I don't feel there is much to adapt here.
Yes, the challenges and feats are good to know the game better and change the playstyle according to the goal (I've got/done them all). But we are talking about the main game experience here.

Ok put it this way. If you survived 100 days + with deadman where theres no health regen at all. That requires not loosing health to cold at all. Whilest hunting. 

So the 5 minutes where you hunt dear in interloper will be no problem.

Further - the game is absolutely packed with meat. Lategame one have no problem with waiting for the right weather for hunting. 

If anything the game really needs lategame purpose and challenges - not more utilities.

[manolitode]

On 10/31/2020 at 10:40 PM, Quetza said:

Adding more difficulty in sucessfully hit targets, with the only available weapon, will have an effect on : arrows, bow, fuel, matches, and beverages consumption. And of course the grindiness of the game (and archery level).

I think that's quite alright to be honest. Interlopers vary a lot in how they play and how they consume the items you mention. But personally, after exploring great bear and settling down, I find there is an abundance of saplings, reclaimed wood, matches and many other non-renewable consumables. On my current run, some 250 days in with 65% explored I have 48 maple saplings in stock and around 150 prepared reishi mushrooms. Also, there is the endless supply of birch bark and sticks out there. These are reasons why I don't see a major issue in the wobbly bow mechanic. Also, if the cold gets too problematic, for you there is always the option to linger in a warmer region such as Mystery Lake. Will this implementation change how lopers play the game? For sure. Will it be harder? For sure. However it seems that with some wobbling experience it becomes perfectly doable to bring down a charging wolf with a flickering arrow.

12 hours ago, Looper said:

If anything the game really needs lategame purpose and challenges - not more utilities.

I completely agree that this is a welcome challenge. Considering the amount of resources in TLD we are prepared for it. That said, it also makes the already hard transition from stalker to interloper difficulty even rougher. If you're still struggling with interloper it is perfectly understandable to oppose this implementation.   

[Quetza]

On 11/2/2020 at 12:27 AM, LongJohnNoOne said:

Hey everyone, after the update i have this thing happen to me too. But it's not the bow shaking, it's the entire screen instead. It's extremely frustrating. Anyone else experiencing that? makes it impossible to hit anything or even judge distance on the target.

THis is another way to describe the change yes.

[Satouthedeusmusco]

Did you know that you shiver when you're cold IRL too? That's the idea behind this.

Basically, don't go hunting if you're freezing. Not freezing should be your number one priority in general since it's what will kill you the fastest.

[Bean]

I’ve found a work-around.  Been playing Loper and the bow shakes uncontrollably when the character is in hypothermia risk and cold meter is red.  This happens very fast on Loper so it made hunting difficult.  
Here’s what to do: 

pick your target, line up the white dot of the reticle where you’d want it to be, then stretch and release IMMEDIATELY. If you wait to aim even a second, you’ll miss.  Just draw and fire at once.  Aiming can only be done beforehand.  

[Quetza]

Ok, so. After few weeks of frustration, I started new games.
Since being cold was not an option during a hunt, I focused on luring wolves and bears near fires and inside caves (with guts on me). It is working great, harvesting close to an already built fire is nice (I usually square a half of the kill, get warm again, and do the second half), harvesting inside a cave is a luxury (see attached image).
A benefit of this kind of hunting is that, travelling is safer when there are no predators anymore in an area. BTW, I found out that wolves respawn every day or so in Mountain town. I also have plenty of cured wolf pelts early on, so I switched to wolf coat, instead of moose coat.

The downside is I get more often close to wolves hence I get attacked statistically more often, and manipulating wolf/bear meat before cooking 5, is kinda dangerous ^^;
Also, hunting that way during a quiet night or at dusk is very dangerous, I lost one character to an aurora wolf and another to an aurora bear, which don't care about your safe space anymore.

Despite losing those 120 and 180 days characters, I found out the game is more thrilling for me that way.
And came the roll back on the feature-bug in the last update.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Quetza
Grammar and typo