Where's Great Bear Island?

[Third Try]

  At first I had always assumed that it was in the Northwest Territory or Nunavut, north of the ocean shoreline.  But there's two holes with this theory that I realized recently.

One: There are no polar bears.

Two: We don't have solar nights or days (except permanent night?)

Three: The ocean ice is only near the shore, it doesn't extend out to the mainland.

All of this means we probably aren't in the arctic circle.  There is also very little reference to the Inuits.  There is no refference to Hudson Bay either, nor Alaska.

Are there any papers, notes, story mode hints of what latitude and longitude we're at?

Red is my original theory (in Nunavut or Northwest), orange is my new one (closer to Quebec or Newfoundland).  Is it possible it's on the west shore in British Colombia?

 

Something else I keep wondering is if there's a map that shows the actual size comparison of various regions, because the world map in game seems to be more of a representation than anything to actually navigate with (maybe it was hand drawn?).

Any idea how big certain regions are?  How far is it from Blackrock to the shore?  How big is Pleasant Valley?

Another big question is this:  Is the world map in-game showing just a tiny portion of a major island or is it showing 90% of the landmass?

Is the entire game just in a little bay on some massive island?

 

If you guys have any theories, please write them down!

[javijungle]

Some time ago I had the same question and out of curiosity I found that a possible setting would be Vancouver Island, which is precisely Vancouver where @Raphael van Lierop is from or at least the headquarters of Hinterland Studios. Although perhaps it is more of an inspiration for the studio rather than a similar landscape.

[artmunki]

14 hours ago, javijungle said:

Some time ago I had the same question and out of curiosity I found that a possible setting would be Vancouver Island, which is precisely Vancouver where @Raphael van Lierop is from or at least the headquarters of Hinterland Studios. Although perhaps it is more of an inspiration for the studio rather than a similar landscape.

I'd always taken Great Bear Island to be a sorta fictionalised version of Vancouver Island, and I'm sure I thought that because I'd read it somewhere back when I started playing, but I can't for the life of me remember where that might've been, or whether or not it was an official source.

[xanna]

2 minutes ago, artmunki said:

I'd always taken Great Bear Island to be a sorta fictionalised version of Vancouver Island, and I'm sure I thought that because I'd read it somewhere back when I started playing, but I can't for the life of me remember where that might've been, or whether or not it was an official source.

That was my understanding too. I read that on the Wikipedia page and the sources seem to be these:
 

Quote

Living on the edge of the rugged Island wilderness inspired me to think about the fringes – of geography, society, community, and also of the games industry itself. Hinterland seemed an appropriate name for a studio that is on the edge of civilization. Our first game, The Long Dark, is inspired by living here and considering how our world is changing right now, and how a sudden disastrous event might shift the power dynamics between humanity and mother nature.

from an interview in 2013, and

Quote

"I was inspired by the physical surroundings I live in and the mythos that exists in the Northwest," explains van Lierop.

from a Gamasutra article the same year.

That's not great evidence; has anyone got an example of Raph saying more directly that Great Bear is based on Vancouver Island?

The flora and fauna all check out for Vancouver Island, and there are a few hits on Google maps for things called Great Bear on the island! The official location is "the Northern wilderness". Is Vancouver Isand considered Northern in a Canadian context?

I'm guessing it's probably not directly based on anywhere very specific.

[UpUpAway95]

I believe that GBI encompasses bits of feel and lore from various parts o British Columbia's Sunshine Coast and the Alaska panhandle.  Various places along the railway feel very much like the White Pass & Yukon Railway that runs as a tourist attraction from Skagway, Alaska to the summit of the White Pass, Yukon.  The Coastal Highway region reminds me very much of the highway that runs north along the coast of the mainland from Vancouver.

[Kranium]

Island off the west shore of BC. Craploads of islands there where the terrain, flora & fauna match.

 

The islands in the Northwest Territories/Nunavut (in the OP's map) don't even have trees. Too far north. Trust me, I've been there. Here's a pic I took last summer on one of my road trips:

 

 

Edited November 19, 2023 by Kranium

[Nalliah]

I don't think Great Bear Island is meant to exactly represent a precise geographical location in the real world. I do agree that aspects of it can be inspired by real world places and things, but to me it seems like a fictional imagination of its creators.

[Sito]

A fictional island off the west coast of BC similar to Vancouver island but probably smaller and more remote from the mainland. Before the event it was temperate with mild winters. The vehicles are not cold equipped and there are solar panels on many of the houses. The island has much of the same features as Vancouver island and even has what looks to be peach or apple orchards which would fit with the climate of south BC with it's temperate rainforest of cedar and hemlock trees. The fishing huts on the frozen lakes and ocean were added later after the event as the remaining residents tried to survive for a time as everything froze. 

As Kranium says, definitely NOT the arctic.

[ajb1978]

Definitely NOT Nunavut, that's mostly permafrost. Great Bear is northern-temperate, as evidenced by the presence of both coniferous AND deciduous trees, plus the presence of perennials such as rose bushes.

[Kranium]

Don't forget the copious amount of explicitly Canadian content, including Canadian flags... so it definitely isn't entirely a fictional place.

[Bloodskye]

Personally, I think Desolation Point is a sliver of the Maine Coast but that's a head canon of mine.

[UpUpAway95]

2 hours ago, Bloodskye said:

Personally, I think Desolation Point is a sliver of the Maine Coast but that's a head canon of mine.

Possible, I suppose - IF GBI is all of Canada and the mainland is a representation of the US and the quakes somehow completely submerged the 49th parallel.  It would be quite the headcanon though.  IF GBI is Vancouver Island, I've wondered if the quakes were movement along the Cascadia subduction zone that pushed Vancouver Island farther north as well as submerging parts of the island itself, making it smaller overall and more isolated.

[hozz1235]

9 hours ago, Kranium said:

Don't forget the copious amount of explicitly Canadian content, including Canadian flags... so it definitely isn't entirely a fictional place.

You can populate a fictitious place with realistic elements.

I would also vote for Vancouver Island-ish.

Edited November 20, 2023 by hozz1235

[stratvox]

I'm going to go with the Haida Gwaii (also known as the Queen Charlotte Islands). It fits very well with the story line and the local setting, esp as there are a lot of people and cities on Vancouver Island making it not very likely as the kind of wilderness setting in the game. Finally, take a look at the southern tip of Banks Island: https://maps.app.goo.gl/W3AnR8xpwZQJGsMC6 

I think Banks Island is definitely the best real world contender for Great Bear Island. It's a long way north from Vancouver Island; I think it's far more likely that Jackrabbit Transport is based on Vancouver Island, and Will was taking Astrid up to Banks Island (GBI) for her "mission".

[UpUpAway95]

34 minutes ago, stratvox said:

I'm going to go with the Haida Gwaii (also known as the Queen Charlotte Islands). It fits very well with the story line and the local setting, esp as there are a lot of people and cities on Vancouver Island making it not very likely as the kind of wilderness setting in the game. Finally, take a look at the southern tip of Banks Island: https://maps.app.goo.gl/W3AnR8xpwZQJGsMC6 

I think Banks Island is definitely the best real world contender for Great Bear Island. It's a long way north from Vancouver Island; I think it's far more likely that Jackrabbit Transport is based on Vancouver Island, and Will was taking Astrid up to Banks Island (GBI) for her "mission".

It's a strong contender.  I'm not sure of it's history of development though.  Was there ever a penitentiary on the island?  I know of the Yellow Giant gold mine (and the disaster associated with it), but it wasn't established until around 2000, IIRC.  Were there mines on the island before it came along?

[stratvox]

22 minutes ago, UpUpAway95 said:

It's a strong contender.  I'm not sure of it's history of development though.  Was there ever a penitentiary on the island?  I know of the Yellow Giant gold mine (and the disaster associated with it), but it wasn't established until around 2000, IIRC.  Were there mines on the island before it came along?

I don't know that the specific history is that important, but that said, mining has been a big big thing in BC since forever. Also, wrt the Pen, here's a pic of the BC penitentiary:

And here's Black Rock: 

However, BC Pen is in New Westminster, a suburb of Vancouver, and definitely not anywhere near the general area of The Long Dark. There are no pens in northern BC AFAIA, so I think we can chalk that up to artistic license and nods to the landmarks in the province. Sort of like how Ash Canyon resembles the area near Golden BC: 

Pretty sure this is going to look at least a little familiar to a lot of people here. Here's a link to a map showing you how to drive from Black Rock to Ash Canyon; as you can see it's not like it is on the island at all

https://maps.app.goo.gl/qMgaozBsQyrWetYd6

 

[UpUpAway95]

1 hour ago, stratvox said:

I don't know that the specific history is that important, but that said, mining has been a big big thing in BC since forever. Also, wrt the Pen, here's a pic of the BC penitentiary:

And here's Black Rock: 

However, BC Pen is in New Westminster, a suburb of Vancouver, and definitely not anywhere near the general area of The Long Dark. There are no pens in northern BC AFAIA, so I think we can chalk that up to artistic license and nods to the landmarks in the province. Sort of like how Ash Canyon resembles the area near Golden BC: 

Pretty sure this is going to look at least a little familiar to a lot of people here. Here's a link to a map showing you how to drive from Black Rock to Ash Canyon; as you can see it's not like it is on the island at all

https://maps.app.goo.gl/qMgaozBsQyrWetYd6

 

I'm aware that the province of British Columbia has had big mining history as well as penitentiaries.  I was asking specifically about what historically has been developed on Banks Island.  The Queen Charlotte Islands are noted to be one of the most naturally pristine areas of the province, which doesn't smack of a lot of development, but Banks is closer to the mainland than the Queen Charlottes, so I don't really know the level of development it had. 

Vancouver Island, however, as all of that - natural areas combined with ample amounts of industry, mining, airports, highways. railways, etc.  That's why I personally favour it as the location and an earthquake event along the Cascadia fault that significantly destroyed the island and ultimately changed it's shape.  As a result, I think that Will's starting point is in or near Vancouver City (i.e. on the mainland side of the strait) and he is an actual "mainlander."

The Ash Canyon bridges remind me of the Capilano Suspension Bridge (North Vancouver); and Vancouver Island has some, too.

https://vancouverisland.travel/2019/03/28/blog-from-way-up-high-suspension-bridges-on-vancouver-island/

 

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by UpUpAway95

[ajb1978]

10 hours ago, stratvox said:

And here's Black Rock: 

I mean ya can't tell me you don't see just a BIT of a similarity....
 

[UpUpAway95]

8 hours ago, ajb1978 said:

I mean ya can't tell me you don't see just a BIT of a similarity....
 

Of course I do and I'm not denying that.  That still doesn't place it anywhere on Banks Island.

I'm not going to try posting a picture, but look up an image of the Victoria Regional Correctional Facility (which is on the island).  It also employs the "castle-like" architecture.

[DaGnome91]

I like the idea of Baker Island too... but my personal feeling is that GBI is purely fictional, probably based on what our British Columbians best friends (aka Hinterland) know and love of the different islands along the Canadian coast. If I had to hazard a guess, that's what I'd go for : a big mix

[hozz1235]

2 minutes ago, DaGnome91 said:

 but my personal feeling is that GBI is purely fictional, probably based on what our British Columbians best friends (aka Hinterland) know and love of the different islands along the Canadian coast. If I had to hazard a guess, that's what I'd go for : a big mix

I agree.  I'm sure HL was inspired by many things when creating GBI, but if for nothing else, likely made it a fictional place. 

Perhaps there could be trademark/permission issues if you exactly replicate something IRL.  For this reason alone, I personally, would make it fictional.

[UpUpAway95]

52 minutes ago, hozz1235 said:

I agree.  I'm sure HL was inspired by many things when creating GBI, but if for nothing else, likely made it a fictional place. 

Perhaps there could be trademark/permission issues if you exactly replicate something IRL.  For this reason alone, I personally, would make it fictional.

You're probably right, but I would like to point out that the Fallout franchise uses many IRL locations and landmarks in their games (e..g from Fallout 3 - Lincoln Memorial,  Capital Mall.  Fallout 4 - Boston Public Library, Old North Church, etc.) - not exact replicas, but at least somewhat accurately placed within the map, despite the map being significantly scaled down.  Now, these are US landmarks and Bethesda is an American company, so perhaps the regulations on that sort of thing are a bit different in Canada; but I don't know why that would be the case.

[ManicManiac]

On 11/17/2023 at 1:43 AM, javijungle said:

Some time ago I had the same question and out of curiosity I found that a possible setting would be Vancouver Island, which is precisely Vancouver where @Raphael van Lierop is from or at least the headquarters of Hinterland Studios.

I was trying to find an old video and I could swear they speak about the wilds of Vancouver Island being the core inspiration for Great Bear Island.

[hozz1235]

30 minutes ago, UpUpAway95 said:

You're probably right, but I would like to point out that the Fallout franchise uses many IRL locations and landmarks in their games (e..g from Fallout 3 - Lincoln Memorial,  Capital Mall.  Fallout 4 - Boston Public Library, Old North Church, etc.) - not exact replicas, but at least somewhat accurately placed within the map, despite the map being significantly scaled down.  Now, these are US landmarks and Bethesda is an American company, so perhaps the regulations on that sort of thing are a bit different in Canada; but I don't know why that would be the case.

True about Fallout (and other games such as Assassin's Creed).  Perhaps those companies sought "permission" from those entities before replicating them.  I'm not about to dig into that level of research

[UpUpAway95]

6 minutes ago, hozz1235 said:

True about Fallout (and other games such as Assassin's Creed).  Perhaps those companies sought "permission" from those entities before replicating them.  I'm not about to dig into that level of research

I rather doubt that they sought permission from the owners of every landmark they've used in the game.  It would be an impossible task even for larger companies.  I suspect there's some allowance for using landmarks that are well known by the general population and that their appearance in general is not a copyrighted thing.  I suspect it's more just that Raph wanted to disguise the island(s) used for his inspiration and gave HL some liberty to deviate from the IRL map of the West Coast.  In that respect, it is clearly a fictional island.

Still, I find the amount of industrial development on GBI and the pre-apocalypse association with the mainland more in line with Vancouver Island's history than the more pristine islands farther north along the Coast - and that's merely why I personally favour a theory about the earthquakes changing the shape of Vancouver Island (or even creating the fictional GBI in that area) and the geomagnetic activity changing the weather over selecting Banks Island simply because it is farther north and has one coast that is somewhat shaped like GBI's.

Terms like "The Great White North" have been used historically to describe all of Canada - so perhaps Great Bear Island is somewhat representative of the entire country as well.  Famed Canadian author, Margaret Atwood, has strongly associated Canadian identity with survival aspects in her book "Survival: A Thematic Guide to Canadian Literature."  A concept I remember well being taught in my Canadian studies classes, although it is considered somewhat outdated today.

From Wikipedia:

"In Survival, Atwood postulates that Canadian literature, and by extension Canadian identity, is characterized by the symbol of survival.^[81] This symbol is expressed in the omnipresent use of "victim positions" in Canadian literature. These positions represent a scale of self-consciousness and self-actualization for the victim in the "victor/victim" relationship.^[82] The "victor" in these scenarios may be other humans, nature, the wilderness or other external and internal factors which oppress the victim."