Mroz4k

I found other references of people, finding moose carcass in Hushed River valley. Where exactly did you find it? The details in the reddit were stingy at best. I was not there on Interloper, I was there in two different Voyager games, and one Pilgrim one - never found it. I will probably make my way there in the Stalker game next. I am pretty sure it is a random spawn, just like other corpses and carcasses. Kind of a "big deal" RNG to be honest, to have an option to get a hide and the guts without a need to actually kill it. It kind of makes sense there would be a carcass of moose in there. There is a cooked moose steak at the mysterious campfire... it had to come from somewhere...

Good point with the route over the Carter lake, rather than going over the bridge. That way I don't have to do that circle. Will go this way on the next run. Maybe it is because I don't really move around quickly, but if you loot the entire Trapper´s (and I guess you would want to, to get the initial gear - since from the start of the game, you need painkillers, a flare for wolves, and at least some firewood and lantern fuel) - then it is worth to make the fire and heat up the can, cause all in all it will take you some 25 minutes that you would spend looting anyways. As long as the fire is burning and the food is cooking while you loot, you aren't really losing any time, just using it productively. As for the boost itself - I suppose you could leave with a hot can, and eat it after first 10 minutes walking outside while it is still hot to even utilize some of its re-heating power, to be really efficient - but frankly, as long as you have the buff for Tomato soup worth of can, you can make it almost to the Carter dam without starting freezing. The carter in itself is a bit problematic - the place may not be warm enough to get warmer - so you are probably looking at some freezing damage till reaching the Signal Hill. I prefer only building campfires at the sites I intent to loot, because while the food is being heated, I can loot in the meantime. I also have a nice little shortcut at the Winding river - with that in mind, all I need is about 15% of temp gauge to get through the Winding river without freezing. The cave between winding river and PV is good for quick re-heating up. I usually get around 10% of gauge while walking through the Carter so I take a little bit of freezing damage at the Winding river. Also, is coal worth picking up? Ideally, you don't really have a fire burning for more than 20 minutes, maybe at the summit, though it might still be better to just make more campfires rather than re-using ones. I guess summit is cold tho, so the coal can help warm the player up without the use of the hot coffee right away.

Interesting route. I have yet to finish a whole game that wouldn't go horribly wrong at some point, so we can't really compare notes on the speed of particular routes, but it is great to see there are some "options" I also like to challenge myself a bit and even try to finish the challenge if the initial start is not favorable (no coffee, evening start). I never even really checked the basement of the farmhouse, didn't know there could be coffee in there - I will make it my first stop when looting farmstead from now on. Also, I don't mind a preferred time to start the game, my start of the game is that I immediately start a fire in the cabin, and heat up a can of food to eat straight away for the buff - this buff is enough to get you almost to Carter dam - assuming you don't take the detour to walk into the Camp office. (honestly, I am really surprised you would go to the Camp office - this is so out of the way for the quickest way through Mystery lake. My route through Mystery lake is to leave Trappers, and go straight through the hills around the hill with Forestry lookout, then reach the tracks and follow the train tracks around the railway car, over the bridge, and to the Dam.) Next time, I will stop by at the trailer to check the coffee, if I don't have wolves there again. In my sandbox experience, a detour through Camp Office can slow you down by at least half an hour, maybe even an hour. How quickly does it take for you to go from Trappers to Carter Dam? My general time is that I leave the Trappers after looting it at 23 20, and I reach the Dam at around 22 20 at the latest. Attached my ML route. The yellow route is the way you should preferably walk it - rather then a straight line, it is better to try and avoid the elevation as most - because walking into a hill slows you down once again. So, while the route is technically a bit longer, it is actually faster to try and avoid the elevation if you can help it. Also runs the lesser risk of a sprain that way. The green indicates the checking of that trailer you mentioned may have the coffee. With that in mind, I fully recommend the stop by the Signal hill for the lootz. The thing I like about Signal hill is that you can walk in there, immediately start a fire and put a can of food for re-heating up on the barrel, and loot the signal hill, then eat it - all in just 20 minutes tops because of how small Signal Hill is, and because all the loot you need from it lies on the ground there - so you don't really have to loot any containers, save maybe the First aid kit. On most runs, you will find Snow pants, rifle, expedition parka, coffee tin can and adrenaline injection or two in there. Not to mention a possible re-heatable can of food, too. Since the new "route" I just found from the Signal hill down, you can be back on the Pleasant Farmstead run with just a 10 mins delay at best, re-heated with the warm core bonus and significantly better clothes. Farmstead is a mandatory stop, for sure - because of the cooking spot there. That said - if you want to reach TWM on a good time, you need at least 2 tins of coffee and 2 injections, or 3 tins of COOKED coffee and 1 injection, as you said so yourself. So I don't see much of a point to even check the "bunker" on the way to TWM, because by then, you would have walked past the Farmstead and the coffee you would find in the bunker would be uncooked - unless you would want to stop and cook it slowly on two-three campfires. Which I see no point in - since that is pretty significant stop. For recording, OBS is free to download recording software for your computer. But it can be a bit more difficult to initially set up - still, there are YouTube tutorials to help with that. I am definitely not going to record my gameplay as TLD is now quite strong game graphic-wise for my PC to have a recording running simultaneously.

Gave the challenge a couple of more tries today. All ended horribly wrong. The 1st try started off pretty well - got most of what I needed with the start. No coffee, but some bullets, tomato soup that I instantly heated, and a gas canister. However, one thing I didn't get was painkillers. You can guess what happened. I sprained an ankle 1O steps away from the cabin. So I kept wobbling, eventually made it to Carters after a short encounter with a wolf that got scared away by a flare. Took a small detour by accident cause it was foggy, and I lost my way in the hills between Forestry lookout and Trappers. Couldn't find painkillers ANYWHERE. Wobbled all the way to Signal hill and nothing still. Gave up after - because not even the signal hill had coffee or painkillers in it. The 2nd try had the worst loot possible. Just nothing of use to start with. I somehow made it to Carter but was so cold and in so bad shape it was pointless to keep going. The 3rd try is just the spiciest. Starting loot was nice enough, but NO flare. Of course, I see 4 wolves on the way to Carter - one of them cut me off at the bridge and forced me to a struggle. No blood loss or even sprains, surprisingly - but 50 % condition lost. Heartbroken. Clothes WRECKED. Losing temperature like crazy. Made it to Carter, found 2 flares, decided to check the prolonged path for the scarf it spawns there... but losing more condition through the building. Only total of 1,2 liters of water in the toilets. Made a campfire by the door to Carter from the Winding riverside. Heated two cans of food I found. The boost in temp got me through to the cave - also made 4 torches. At the pleasant valley by the deer stand, I started freezing again. Another wolf. Popped a flare and built a lantern fuel book campfire just to be sure. Scared it off. Sprinted to the signal hill just to be sure. Made fire in the barrel with 2 firs on top of a book, with lantern fuel. Looted inside. 1st can of coffee, Expedition parka and snow pants. Luck is turning! Blizzard starts outside. Found can of peaches - cooking at the barrel as I loot the rest. No more painkillers - only 2 painkillers left. Rifle and 13 bullets in total. Total of 2 adrenaline shots, 1 from Carter, 1 from Signal Hill. I pop the hot peaches and make my way to the farmstead. It is not blizzard weather but really close - luckily it is a side wind so it is not slowing me down. At the orchard, a bear steps in my way and is clearly aggroed on me. I sprint-navigate around, luckily didn't trigger aggression mode. I make it to Farmstead - 34% condition left. No coffee in the Farmstead. My heart is broken, again. To make me even more miserable - no painkillers either. At this point, I aborted the attempt. This challenge is pretty brutal to try and speedrun. Things I learned: It is necessary to start a fire in Trappers and heat a single piece of canned food to get the temp boost to make it to Carter without freezing. Make a fire, put it on, and then loot the place. It is absolutely necessary to stop by the signal hill if you want almost every game start" to be a viable try. The coffee that spawns there and the TOP quality clothes that can be found just lying around without looting containers make it a worthy stop. Plus, you can almost always pick up a rifle here which is a good wolf deterrent. Almost always you will find an injection here. All in all, a powerful stop on the way. Also, if you go downhill to the right from the hole in the fence at Signal Hill, you will soon get to a place where you can pretty safely mountain goat down to the bottom and go straight to the farmstead - so if you are really fast at Signal hill, this route may even be faster then the walk around that the old video uses. As of now, Signal Hill is going to be on my Always to visit lists of places. Farmstead is always going to be the destination thanks to its 6 spot cooking spot and extra water.

Even a simple thing like the wind, blowing in your face as you go can greatly impact the time it takes. To reach such good times, you have to get really damn lucky, with the coffee spawns, animals, and weather, too. And so many things can go wrong... Dont think the today´s game one can really beat the time in the vid - the changes since have made it very difficult to get anywhere real fast. Walking is much faster in-game time wise rather than running around and then resting. Even fatique-wise. But it makes you spend more IRL time, too.

Oh, dont you worry about that at all At some point, the game will turn from "survival is the game of life" to "in order to keep on living, I will need to do this, this and this, over there, in here, in that other region. The only difference between fetch and gathering quest kind of game I can see is that you will have to correctly determine what thing to do first, and how to adapt when the circumstances change - on your own, without a quest kind of a prompt. But no worries, it is not that difficult The biggest danger in this game is usually routine, which gets boring and prompts most players to take silly risks. To that there is a simple solution - rather then trying to mechanically hoard which is the usual instinct of most players, remember to "live" within the game, too - take your time, think on things, admire the beautiful surroundings and just enjoy yourself and you will be fine.

Welcome to the forums! I too enjoy reading your stories - keep em coming! Looking forward to more. Ah, the "crash landing" - I think I can explain that. When the crash was imminent, you jumped out with a parachute. There may be a "crashed plane" location somewhere at the map that you will eventually discover... There is no sign of the parachute, either. Which I think is a bit of a shame, really... Hinterland could have added like a parachute prop that would forever mark the spot where you "crash" landed in the sandbox would feel more immersive. Maybe they will add it one day... For the time being, you will have to be content with an explanation that once you landed, you took of the backpack with the chute when a strong gust of wind caught onto the chute and blew it away before you could realize what was happening.

Yea, this is an idea people sometimes come with - but you are right, it would make the game more simple, in a way. Especially on interloper, it would allow people to create their own clothes when they cant find that type anywhere. Which would reduce the challenge. I dont think the idea of "knitting" is bad per say, I am still hoping that the Hinterland will eventually bring in some sort of animal like bighorn sheep, which has a fur that is basically a wool - could be used for crafting of some of the "undergarments" - like crafted underwear, socks, etc - because that wool could be converted into a line which could be used for knitting. But again, that is years from possibly being added into the game, I fear. I doubt they will be adding the animal similar to bighorn sheep into the game any time soon. Which is a shame - if this sheep could only be found at TWM or at high places in Hushed river valley, it would add to the immersion of the game, and would force the player to travel to these specific locations simply because of these animals.

I am usually one to write long essays, but this I can sum up in a single phrase. Living in harmony with the nature.

Nice. Yea, the weather can mess it up allright. Also, I did notice something in that try... the first try I started freezing some mid-way to Carter´s - on my second try, I made a fire right away and cooked a can of tomato soup while I looted the rest of that house. This turned out very well in my favour - even with poor clothing I was able to make it to Carter´s without freezing too much. Sounds like a worthy thing to mention. I watched the video. I doubt it can be beaten - since that was before the clothing update which changed the cold mechanics way too much. While it is certainly advantageous that you can now cook more then one Item at a time, the cold and the fact that clothing after the clothing update have been scaled down in effectiveness way too much means that the cold is a lot bigger problem in this version then in the previous one. Still - one has to keep trying, eh? Gotta try and beat that score. Also, found your shortcut - it is very useful indeed! It saves you a bit of time, but more importantly takes away some of the animal danger of going to the top of the mountain. By the way - I would argue that stopping by the Radio is still very much worth it. If not just for the possible coffee, there is usually some high-end clothing in there. On my second try, I found expedition parka and snow pants, along with the best boots. Also, since running aint much of use in the challenge, I reccon it may be better to try to get the best possible clothing, because the cold is what slows you down the most. Also, gotta pick up all the painkillers Im gonna find from now on. And looting is also worth it - just not in places like Carter or farmstead - best to just go for the things you find on the ground. The farmstead can spawn coffee in the cupboards, but very rarely and looting all of them takes a lot of time. So not gonna do that on the next try. I think that if I didnt have to deal with the headwind the whole pleasant valley part of the map, and with the damned fog at TWM, and if I didnt do that stupid stuff, I might have had a shot at reaching it below the 24 hour marker. Guess it depends a lot on your luck with the weather, and loot. This challenge has kind of got me into the mood of trying to speed run the other challenges. I did the whiteout challenge prep in like 3 days which I think is pretty fast in itself, but I remember of people who did the Hunted challenge in some 13 hours, and that was before the Winding river connector, back when the challenge came out... that might be fun to try and beat, too

Well, I didnt die, but I have made a number of very, very poor choices and as a result, am very close to dying on that try. Was below 24 hours, too. Turns out that looting the plane takes a lot longer then I anticipated - despite the fact that I tried looting only selected cargo containers to help my progress. I didnt take enough painkillers with me, and all of sudden suffered 5 sprains in a row. For that reason, I wasnt able to rope down from the TMW. I tried to mountain goat down and suceeded - but fell a few times and lost most of my durability on clothes, and plenty of condition. Also sprained everything. For that reason, I was unable to scare off a wolf which took a bite out of me, despite defending with a knife... and I ended up at 10% condition and with blood loss. I fixed it up with one of the two stims I found at the plane, but right now I am at the cave to the left of the TWM rope, on poor condition and with three sprained limbs. Scaling down also took considerably more time, so right now, I am below 24 hours already. I will give it another try some other time. Seems like everything just turned against me. I was constantly battling headwind, temperature drains, etc.

I see. So a lot of it depends on the start. Well, I gave it a try of my own. First attempt ended very, very poorly... I didnt die but couldnt climb up the rope to TWM and didnt have enough coffee to make it. My second try is currently ongoing as I am writing this post. It is going pretty well. I only found one set of coffee at the Farmhouse, and none at the Trappers or Carter dam, but I took a stop at Signal house and I got a can of coffee in there. Plus some really, really nice clothing loot, and a rifle which I found is neccesary to keep the wolves at bay. I did suffer one unfortunate turn of events so far. I started ascend to TWM at night, and sometime around the hut, a thick fog fell. So, I got desoriented, and ended up walking to the Engine through the Echo ravine, which is quite the detour. Almost got eaten by a bear, too. Damned fog... Anyways, I just made it past the first rope climb in TWM and I ran out of coffee. Which is fortunate - now I have two stims to use for the next two rope climbs - after that, I will be at the top. I also have the hacksaw, so I will be able to loot up on some extra coffee up there. I noticed that a gas canister spawns at Trappers, or in Carter at the beggining - if you do write up your guide, be sure to mention that - lantern fuel as accelerant is invaluable. Also, seems you imply that it is impossible to climb up the TWM with less then three cans (15 cups) of coffee - well, I just made it past the first climb with only 2 cans, and with two stims, I should be able to make it to the top. I am not making a lot of good time - I doubt I will be able to make it under 24 hours. I have I have around 7 hours left till the 24 hour mark. My way is probably not the fastest, but it works a bit, despite the lenghty detour. Going to post once I finish. Hopefully I dont die... that would be embarrasing. I took quite a bit of cold damage just now, trying to power through the first rope.

Hello again, @Goodzilla. Congrats on that impressive time of less than 21 hours! Happy that my map helped - the "mountain goating" tactic can save a lot of time. I will study your new path at the blue line thoroughly - I am impressed, you found it while I never did and I make it my mission to get to know the regions throroughly, just in case I ever get lost in them. So good work! Just curious - how do you achieve the process of "not sleeping"? How do you build fires? Do you cook meals like cans to eat and warm up? Do you keep your needs like hunger and thirst full, or empty so you can "pop" more coffee at any time? Do you sprint a lot, or do you never sprint to preserve your fatique. What weight are you trying to keep in your inventory? I am curious because your tips could come in very useful in the normal game one day... I confess that I find it difficult to keep fatique up, especially with all the rope climbing there. Here are some things I might reccomend, I am sure you know most of them already:

In this thread, I learned that HRV is hiding a Moose carcass. I immidiatedly set off to find it in my Custom "somewhat" realistic Voyageur level casual game. I had just finished looting it before so I figured if I make it back right away, it will still be there. I think I looked around the Monolith lake fairly well, yet I cant find this Moose carcass anywhere. I thought I saw a moose carcass on my first ever run through HRV when I spawned there as Pilgrim, but I remember not checking it out closely. Anyways, it would seem that the carcass does not spawn every time. What a shame. The rest of the deer carcasses are still in this region - so I see no reason that the moose one should be gone. It just probably never was there. Still, even on reddit some people reported finding a moose carcass in HRV, so the chance should be there.

I gave up snares after the stone hunting option came along. Not because I would consider snares useless... but because I figured out stone throwing was easier. I soon observed that if I used snares in the grooves with 5 rabbits, for each "caught" rabbit there in the 12 hours later, one would dissapear out of the area. So, whether I used the stones or snares, the amount of rabbits caught per groove was the same. Considering I could get all the rabbits into my backpack fairly easy with the use of stones, snares just kind of became obsolete. But from what you are saying here, it would appear that snares can produce more rabbits per groove then stone throwing. If that is the case, I will likely return to using snares again.

I fully support this tiny addition to luxury. Dont have a problem with CTS (yet, a knock on wood) - but I do admit that sometimes the TLD makes my fingers sore of all the pressing down. Auto walk would be a nice addition.

First of all, congratz on steadily improving your personal best. Maybe I can help you optimalize your route to make it better. Dont bother looking for the red path - you wont find it. But you can connect on it - by going up the blue one, then at the top you can climb over a small cliff and connect onto the red one without having to walk all the way around the blue one. It is possible with a bit of parcour - you will end up somewhere by the entrance to the burned ridge cave. I can maybe help you optimalize your climb up the TMW. I know how to do it in some 3 ingame hours, all the way up and down. The trick is in using some cheesy spots where you can both climb carefully down a mountain in a spot that was not meant to provide a "path" down, or up. Red line indicates the walking path. Purple interrupted shows where the map can be climbed down by crouching and carefully dropping down at almost no fatique loss. Orange interrupted shows a secret passage by a fallen tree where you can scale the mountain up without having to walk around it entirely. You will need to pop an emergency needle to climb the last rope. Also, you want to drink up a bit of coffee before the other rope climbs - the fatique reduced buff will help you preserve some energy. I may try this self challenge as well some day. Sounds like fun. Last time I did this it was before the Winding river was even implemented, the only way to do it was to go through the Coal mine.

Thank you for the kind words. I think its more of a curse - I love writing too much and be too much detailed at times, and I think I often overwhelm potentional readers. On another forum I was a long-time member of, they used to joke that I make walls of text bigger then the wall a certain american president wanted to build during his election campaign, if you catch my drift

I have been to Hushed in three different games already. I see no reason why people say it has limited resources. Unless you are talking about clothing, there are enough resources to last there for a long time. On Voyageur, there are hardly any predators around. In fact, I doubt you will run into more then one bear, and some three to four wolves on that mode. I imagine Stalker is a different experience, still I dont think its a particularly dangerous location animal-wise. So, your biggest issue with be natural elements. Wind, for the most part. There are, however, plenty of caves around. If you spend some 30 days living in the Hushed, you will learn its layout pretty well, at least well enough so that you should always be able to find your way to the middle "spire", from which you can easily navigate yourself into any part of the map. Someone also made a Whiteberry-toarta style map of Hushed. Dont remember the author name, but you have my gratitude. I separate the map into four different sections based on height. Here is my written description of how I orientate myself in Hushed valley region. Also, pay attention that I mention some extra loot locations in my description, so spoilers warning:

This is not really a story of my experience with 4 Days of Night event, more like my story of why I dont have a story of 4 Days of Night. If you dont wanna read about my misfortunes, dont bother to read further Warning that a lot of salt was spilled over the last three years. Lets start with my first try. Two years ago, I had a Lenovo Ideapad gaming laptop. The Halloween was coming in, and the 4DON event was hinted. I have prepared myself mentally, for what I believed would be a fun spooky time... Then, a computer virus happened from installing a freeware for doodles that a friend of mine from different forums suggested. I have learned my lesson to never download from a download server again... a real shame that I didnt realize the website wasnt the official releaser of that doodle software... The virus made it impossible to run anything on my laptop, till I was able to purge it. Eventually, I purged the virus from that laptop. But it had already been too late... the event was over. Next year, I told to myself. A year passed. The Haloween was drawing in near... and the TLD update came out! Aurora was here, I think... and a new graphics update. Not sure if it was the aftermath of the havoc, unleashed by the virus, or just extensive use and aging out... but my old Lenovo gaming laptop could no longer handle TLD with its new fancy graphics. I sobbed a bit, and cursed my laptop for the old bucket of bolts it was... little did I know I would drop it on my way out of a university lecture some two weeks after the event ended, and essentially sealing its fate as it passed out into a silicone heaven... Today, I have an old "working" laptop from second hand - from Fujitsu. Despite being outdated and intended for work, it can run TLD quite well on lower graphics. This Halloween, I knew it was time... this year, I SHALL PLAY the 4DON! Finally! Then, the newest update to Windows 10 happened. This was some two weeks before the event took place. My computer died, and there was nothing I could do... but to reinstall it. It took some three tries, but a friend of mine helped me reinstall the PC in time for the event. The Halloween was coming in, and I was looking forward to it. On the day of the launch, I turned my laptop off and went to work. I arrived late at night and decided to start it again. Windows shows up. "Repairing C:drive" - 1%, 4%, 15%, 46%, 70%, 100%. Initiating. Finally, the screen is on! I open up web browser to check my emails before I decide to run TLD. It takes a long time, finally the browser opens, and crashes... Turned out that awful windows update loaded up again and messed up my laptop a second time. Couldnt reinstall it again, didnt have the USB stick for it and had no way of making a new one. Had to wait 5 days to meet up with my friend again to have it reinstalled... I have not given up hope yet. I will play the 4DON next year!

I will take the side with the OP on this. It is kind of discouraging. Some of us have known about the event but due to the nature´s whims were unable to get it done. As much as I would have loved to play the infamous 4 days of nights, right before that event took place, my laptop crashed out (thanks again, latest Windows update, that was the second time this month I had to reinstall everything). By the time I could get around to it, fix it, and with tight work and studies schedule, the event was over. I swear I am cursed or something. Two years ago my laptop was compromised by a virus and couldnt run a game without crashing. I had it fixed later but before the last year´s event came the update with Aurora and graphical revamp, and my former laptop wasnt able to run it. This year the Windows update killed my new laptop and put it out of commision for this year´s event. I wonder what it will be next year. The way my luck goes, I wont be able to play TLD on the event next year again but only because the TLD aurora event will happen for real, and there wont be any Aurora to power up my laptop during the Halloween next year, I bet. I kindly congratulate you all for obtaining the badge this year. I do hope that the unlucky ones will be able to re-gain it next year . And having it sort of as a "hidden" thing till then would make it more exclusive to the people who already have it, I reccon.

What probably happened to you is known as a "graze" shot. These happen on occasion if you hit the animal by simply "nicking" them with the projectile. If this happens with an arrow, the arrow is not stuck in the animal, but continues on and buries into the ground, or is repelled away if it lands on hard surface, like ice, for example. If you hit a graze shot, you will: get the skill point for hitting the animal. The animal will act as if it was hit, it will flee, and a particle of blood appears. The arrow flies away. (not sure about this) - the animal loses HP as if it were hit. Most importantly: the animal is NOT bleeding. There is no "blood trail" left behind the animal. once the hit animal escapes far enough from you, it will stop running away and starts acting normally again. It is very easy to hit graze shots if you are used to shooting at animals that are facing you head on, or butt-on. It is just a matter of hitting too high or too much into a side.

There are most definitedly reasons to explore it. In fact, I make it my priority to get there early on if I can. But, for the sake of spoilers, I will hide my reasons under a spoiler.

Hello, everyone! Can confirm this is my experience most of the time as well. Seems that there is a chance, some bug that resets the animal if you go indoors, wait there, and then go outdoors again. Also, though I am not sure if that is the case anymore, there used to be a bug that sometimes, during changes in weather, the animals will despawn and respawn again later, cured of their injuries. This used to be really common with Aurora, but my experience is that if the weather goes into the "blizzard" mode while you are inside, or outside in a different zone, the animals outside in the zones around seem to despawn. This can be useful to know as you dont have to worry about animal attacks while moving around in blizzard - at the same time, if you had a bleeding animal, it may be despawned this way. But it would help if someone were to confirm this. My observations in the game have not always been accurate. I usually wait around a campfire or inside a car for that animal to bleed out.

Bow drills. I dont like that idea. Sadly I am in a minority. Reason why I dont want it is because it would be unbalancing. However, I dont mind them if some core elements are kept - Level 4 firestarting at minimum, tinder is mandatory regardless skill, and requires completedly windless options - even if you were in wind protected area, it would not be enough if the wind was blowing around it. Windless, or no bueno. It would also take a long while to start a fire this way, and even with high fire starting skill, the chance to fail would be rather high. It wouldnt really need to have a low durability - I guess the bow and the spinner both have pretty long life, especially if used properly - the desk it what goes away quickly - but in this case, the "desk" would be the "fuel" part of the fire, like cedar or fir wood, and it would be consumed by starting the fire. So I dont think the durability needs to be that low. I am only going to mention the Flint and steel, which is far more reliable and renewable way of fire making in the TLD conditions, and would actually add something new to the game - since it could be forged.