ThePancakeLady

Another thing to check... see if you can talk to any of the other survivors laying on beds in the Community Hall. The ones who told you to find someone, and you came back from the plane crash w/o ID's to give back... may re-trigger the quest? (Not sure, didn't have this issue in my 2 playthroughs so far, and haven't gotten this far yet in my third playthrough yet.) Will Father Tom talk to you? (yes, grasping at straws here...)

15 hours ago, alunasmoon said:

does anyone know if the timberwolve attack on pilgram mode just wanna be sure before i explore

 

No, they don't. They run from you, like every other animal (except the Moose).

@jeffpeng I could see them using the news screen, when the game is lauched for the first time, to give new players that option, or advice. Sure.   A little:

"Hello! We are so glad you decided to try The Long Dark. We here at Hinterland suggest new players ease into the game by starting with Wintermute Story Mode, which is not permadeath, like Survival Mode and the various Challenge Modes are. It gives an introduction to the game world, the lore and history of Great Bear Island, a great narrative driven experience, and will help you learn some of the basic mechanics of the game, with the ability to use previous saves, if you make mistakes, or feel that you want to go back and give something another try, to improve your skills in the game. We currently have [X]/5 Wintermute Episodes completed, with (whatever episodes are still in development) to release in the near future. For more information about The Long Dark [Click Here (link to these online forums)]. Thank you again, and welcome to The Long Dark!"

(...with a pleasant screenshot behind the text, possibly Grey Mother and her rifle, lol.)

That could be a nice usage of that news page that they added, it can be ignored or dismissed if a new player chooses to, giving the player the choice to take the advice or not. 

The only issue I see is that some of the mechanics are not the same in Story Mode, as they are in Survival mode and the Challenge Modes, like skill boos and leveling up skills, crafting and unlocking new recipes, Cartography and the way the maps are different between the 2 modes. But folks on the forums here and on Steam are generally willing and happy to help with teaching newer players how these things work (if they ask civilly), allowing for Community building to continue. 

Would that be acceptable? (and tagging @Admin here, so they see the idea, since this is not in the Wish List subforum, and they can talk amongst themselves, and decide if such a thing would work for them.) A whole lot more time and labor efficient for them, I would think, than creating a whole Demo/Tutorial to add to the existing game, and no hand-holding involved.

38 minutes ago, Morrick said:

I was about to suggest that Hinterland should add a separate Tutorial, selectable in the main game menu, that puts players in a special sandbox where they learn the basic game mechanics. Heh. 

If that is additional work for Hinterland, they could make brief video tutorials each covering the most important stuff, giving some basic advice, without spoiling the fun of discovery too much.

The game was always advertised as "no hand-holding". The early versions of the game, when it was Sandbox Mode only, only one experience mode... you were thrown to the wolves, and has to learn things for yourself. It was thrilling, challenging, frustrating (and can still be experienced that way through the Time Capsule versions...), and you learned things "the hard way", learned from each death, and developed your own strategies.

We jump to now. Loading screens have hints on them, little bits of tutorial, if you read them. Wintermute has a tutorial built in, if you read the more detailed information the messages give you. There are guides and walkthroughs on Steam, online, video guides posted by streamers. One of the first streamers I watched before buying the game years ago was @Willowest. Who was calm, explained what she was doing and why. Other streamers such as @accurize2, @GELtaz, @Hadrian, @Atheenon and others, taught me many things, in much the same way. All with their own playstyles, that taught me that many things could be done, in different ways, for different reasons. The same goes for the vets here and on Steam who openly and happily share their knowledge with new players who ask for help and guidance.

The "tutorials" are out there for people who want them, want to find them. How would Hinterland add a tutorial that covered everything? All of the different ways we can choose to play the to game? If they skipped any single thing, or method, or strategy- would they be chastised for forgetting to tell us something? IMHO, the way they have done it feels best, for me, for this kind of game. "Forcing" or allowing us each to figure things out, talk to each other to get tips and tricks, developing our own individual playstyles.  I disagree that they should have , or still should, add a "full tutorial" to Survival Mode. Players helping players builds a stronger Community, a group that comes together and helps each other. Instead of some communities found on Steam, fr example, where the "community" is not united, but rather exists for infighting, "gitgud" threads, and "n00b hate" threads. It would be so difficult to cover it all, and do it right, in a way that satisfies *most* players. And so easy to to it wrong, and invite anger and attacks from people who thought they did it wrong. 

TL;DR: I think the game is as it should be, with no tutorial, but with a strong, curated community who helps each other on the forums, creating guides, walkthroughs, videos... in the way it has been done already. The TLD Community is one of the most helpful, friendly, outreaching, and welcoming Communities because of this. Just my 2¢. YMVMV.

Enjoy your holidays, everyone at Hinterland, and everyone in the TLD Community.

Here's hoping for much love, peace and relaxation, good time spent with family and friends.

Wishes for a Happy and safe Winter Solstice to all.

See you in 2020. 

🌛🌕🌜

Just now, ajb1978 said:

Oh man this made my whole week.  Finally!  Now I've grown quite attached to that guy, so I don't think I'm going to delete this save...maybe ever. But I am going to take him back to the Bleak Inlet and see if we can figure out if there really is a workshop shortcut, or if the "shortcut" was just referring to the rope climb down from the lookout and everyone just took that to mean something else.

Send postcards, lol. 

Congrats @ajb1978! I know that has been something you have been itching to get done for some time now. 

Well done!   

On 12/15/2019 at 8:29 AM, Morrick said:

(I hope I'm not spamming this thread too much with my screenshots…)

Lol! You cannot spam this thread too much with your screenshots. That is what this thread is for. 

Please keep them coming!

Thanks for the quick fixes Hinterland. 

Always appreciated, but more so now, while you folks are still working hard, while many of us are already on Holiday break, resting, and spending time with family and friends. Here's hoping you all get to take your much deserved holiday vacations soon as well,.

Wishing everyone at Hinterland, and in the TLD Community a peaceful, relaxing, joyous Holiday Season, whatever holiday(s) you celebrate. 

And Mother Nature says "Hello"... it just started snowing here, and emergency alerts coming across my cell phone, for snow squalls and whiteout conditions. Appropriate timing, lol.

I have no issues with 0% raw meat and fish not despawning. We can cook it back up to 50%, which, without Lvl 5 Cooking still puts it in to the "risky to eat" category of food. But store-bought foods and cooked meat and fish should be inedible or despawn. I would be good with that. IMHO, food in this game is not that rare, even in Interloper, if you make snares or fishing tackle, make a bow and arrows to hunt, and make it a priority. The strategy of killing a bear or moose, and e leaving the meat in a stash to cook back up after Lvl 5 Cooking would still be viable, but the strategy of killing everything, harvesting it in small pieces, and cooking everything to spam you Cooking Skill up quickly would be less viable.  Heck, even if they made Cooking Skill level up by weight, instead of by piece cooked would improve the Cooking Skill level-up system, IMHO. Cooking Skill is currently one of the "easiest" and fastest skills to level up in any experience mode. Perhaps a bit too easy. Granted, i do not play Loper often, so my perspective on it may not reflect how it works in Loper very well. But, my husband and daughter, who both are Loper vets are always chuckling about how easy t is to spam-level that skill up, and be able to eat anything in the world afterwards. I've never died from hunger in any any experience mode. I can't say i recall seeing many players griping over dying from starvation either. But many who use(d) the starvation method of rationing and extending food/calorie supplies, myself included.

11 hours ago, jeffpeng said:

On 12/12/2019 at 7:34 PM, ThePancakeLady said:

Unless we could harvest from unused flares, red or marine.

That's the only way I can think of it. And actually turning a flare into a flare shell ..... that's a pretty hefty tradeoff. Flares are you only option to get a protective fire going in a storm. Also your only chance of illumination in a storm if you don't have a storm lantern (which I usually don't since it's too heavy for the two times I use it every three weeks) Really ... I'd actually think twice before sacrificing one of those for a flare shell. So I don't see that upsetting the balance in Interloper. Good suggestion.

Indeed. And flares (marine in particular) are still a defense against wolves, both Timberwolves and our regular block-pelted adversaries. Also darn handy if you are going through a cave or mine, and have little lantern fuel, or only low quality torches. And, AFAIK, still a good defense/weapon against Old Grumpy Bear(s). Having them be harvestable to craft flare shells, say 1 flare = ingredients for 6 flare shells (with empty flare shells needing to be harvested after use, or possibly as rare finds in the world- you shot the bear with a flare, and it took off, now go find it to get meat, guts, bear skin... and your empty flare shell.). It would not be OP, and there would be a few tough choices to be made by the player as far as how they use both flares and the flare gun. Require a hunting knife or hatchet to be used for harvesting the flare. The process and method may not be completely IRL "realstic", to simplify it for a game mechanic, but... lots of stuff in this game are already simplified in that way. 

The only thing I would like to see changed with Food Poisoning, is to make eating 0% ruined food a 100% guarantee to give you FP. At all Cooking Skill Levels. Being able to do so in this game just makes no sense to me, at all. You could still get the calories (to maintain Well Fed), but you should be sick as a dog in return. 

1 hour ago, RossBondReturns said:

Funny I've never not had a rope spawn at Destroyed Lookout...didn't think it was random.

 

I've had no rope spawn at the Destroyed Lookout, in Pilgrim, Voyageur and Stalker. It isn't a guaranteed spawn. Though, in my games, if that rope is not there, the one going down into Raven Falls Ravine usually is. We'll see if that holds true this time or not.

1 hour ago, muoz said:

Has anyone know if the Revolver is now spawning in Interloper?

1 hour ago, RegentRelic said:

Forty Canadian dollars is a pretty low price for a nearly endless prestige in the long dark community.

Not sure exactly what you mean by that, or are trying to imply. If it were not for the Kickstarter backers, this game may never have happened. 

13 minutes ago, TROY said:

With the Timberwolves, it has NOTHING to do with defending territory, they will chase you across the entire map unless you kill every single one of them. Its ridiculous.  I gotta totally with the OP,  these are way over the top. might as well have zombies in the game as these things.

 

It has everything to do with it. The release notes/Dev Diary for Errant Pilgrim even says they "...will defend their territory to the death.".  

https://steamcommunity.com/games/305620/announcements/detail/1720868778918967576

"NEW REGION: Bleak Inlet

A wind-swept coastline reveals an abandoned industrial facility -- an aging Cannery that holds some useful secrets. But finding your way to it is a two-stage affair, involving accessing the region from both the Raven Falls ravine, and Forlorn Muskeg. But watch out! Vicious Timberwolf packs have moved into this region, and will defend their territory to the death."

It has everything to do with territory, them being territorial, and defending their territory.

Tying the Feat progression to Challenge modes only is not sensical, IMHO. 

This "solution" would require players who do not want to play Challenge Modes to, well, play Challenge Modes. Which may seriously decrease their enjoyment of the game. 
I've played all of the Challenges except Archivist and the new one. And to be honest, i don;t care to play those 2. Not my "joy" in this game. I love Survival Mode. I love Story Mode. Challenge Modes I only played to get the Steam and XBox One achievements/trophies.  I would likely not have played them at all,  if it were not for that. Yes, I learned a great deal from each one. I gritted my teeth and played Hopeless Rescue 13 times before I finally beat the timer. Not my thing, did not fit my playstyle, did not make me want to keep playing it (them) again. Sense of Satisfaction? Yes and no. I was frustrated by not being able to play the way I enjoy playing, just to get that achievement (and yes, I like getting achievements in games I play, very much...), satisfaction at having finally gotten it over with and never having to do it again.

Getting upset with having to play standard vanilla modes to earn Feat badges is exactly how I feel about the idea of being told I have to play Challenge Modes to earn them. I don't play vanilla modes because I feel pressured into doing so, or feel any "stigma" attached to using the Custom Settings Toolbox. I've used it. I prefer the vanilla mode settings. Plain and simple.

And again, I will reiterate... 

On 12/14/2019 at 10:45 AM, ThePancakeLady said:

I would have no problems with Hinterland allowing Feat progression in Custom Settings, but I also understand why they don't allow it.

On 12/14/2019 at 10:45 AM, ThePancakeLady said:

And I would likely quit playing the game if I could not play standard vanilla Stalker or Voyageur, with the click of 1 button, and instead had to go through the custom settings toolbox each time to set every setting to match the standard templates for either. 

I like that I can set my experience mode with one click, at the set-up for each new save. I would not like having to go through the Custom Settings Toolbox each time just to select a vanilla experience mode template, or duplicate one (meaning I better screenshot or write those settings down so I don't forget what they are for any of the current 4 vanilla experience modes), using more clicks to get there, that was available with one click before.  It's a little thing, but, it's my little thing, and I like it how it is right now. The less clicks, the better for me.

Started a new run, to get my survivor kitted out a bit better before heading back into Bleak Inlet. Started in ML, and 2 long-lasting Auroras within the first week. 

The game just looks better and better with each update.

Even when you see the glowing freight train of hate and hunger coming to get you (which might explain why I saw no wolves?)

2 hours ago, Valuable Hunting Knife said:

I'd fancy my chances against a timberwolf pack with a hockey stick for defense. More melee weapons!

I had the same thought, and was disappointed we cannot interact with them, even to harvest them for reclaimed wood. 
Not a *huge* hockey fan ( Go Penguins!  ), but I have seen some of the damage done by players swinging those things at each other.

Should at least break morale faster than throwing stones, lol.

6 hours ago, MarrowStone said:

Methuselah most definitely is a figmant of imagination but him being In the gas station before you climb down was a bug. Either way, he still beat you down there without a rope. 

Methuselah being in the Orca station isn't a bug. It's where you first meet him in Ep 1. He's supposed to be there, to give some of the narrative/back-story for Story Mode. You then meet him again after the climb down to leave Milton (when the rope breaks on you). He shows back up again in Episode 2. I see him as some sort of cryptic messenger, or "guardian angel" or a guide. He gives clues about what is happening, but is intentionally vague, so the player has to decide how they are going to act/react, and determine their own moral or immoral character (personality). Will's attitude and comments about and to Methuselah show a loss of spirituality, or change in it, in modern society. 

That's my take on it. YMMV.

They were supposed to have fixed the bug that has Timbers not hunting anything with the latest update, v1.67. Don't know what platform you play on, so don't know if you are an XBox player (they said the patch is delayed until Monday for XBox One),  GoG I have no idea if they got it yet. It hit Steam much earlier today, not sure about PS4.

Reminds me of the Moose. Territorial to a fault. Moose will stand below you, as you are perched on a fallen tree above the, raining gunshots or arrows down on them, until they die. 

Not the first animal we've had in the game that will defend its territory, to the death. Just saying...

1 hour ago, peteloud said:

I was trying to see it from the point of view of a new  purchaser of the game.  We old hands, with thousands of game days, who love the game and spend our time posting comments here, have  forgotten what it is like for someone who has never seen the game.

1 hour ago, peteloud said:

If Hinterland wants to expand its sales it must make the game more attractive newbies, such that they greatly enjoy it and encourage their friends to buy it.  Alas, we old hands have paid our money, Hinterlands needs newbies and new sales more than it needs us oldies

We were all newbies once too. Yet, here we still are.

And those of us that are "old hands" now, all learned the game the hard way, harder perhaps than it is now for new players, with the many QoL additions, added tools, clothing, cooking items, and other things that have been added such as the Custom Settings Toolbox, and Accessibility options. 

It never was a game that was supposed to be easy.It never was supposed to be a game that everyone would like, or learn in an hour. It is, and always has been a bit of a "niche" game. As, IMHO, it should be. And Hinterland has managed to have great success with it so far. After as many years as it has been out, I doubt they are expecting to see a huge increase in sales numbers. They may be looking forward to wrapping this game up. getting the last 2 Wintermute Episodes shipped, and moving onto a new, fresh IP. While still supporting this one, for those of us that love it, new or vet players. 

I don't think Hinterland was ever just chasing the money, or sales. I sincerely hope they never do, and that they keep designing the game the way the want it to be, to fit their vision for the experience they want to create for us. I seriously hope they never decide to make the game hand-holy and easy to learn, just to attract "newbies". I hope they will move on to create something new, that attracts those of us who love this game, and I hope that new IP will pull us in like this game did.

I have a run going right now where I have snared a fe. I'll have to go back in and see if it has updated at all.

1 hour ago, stratvox said:

I'm mostly a bow player rather than using rifles, but I suspect that I'm in the minority for preferring that.

Nah, I am too, so is my husband (who plays Loper almost exclusively, vanilla settings, no custom to add a rifle). My son and daughter use both, depending on which region they are in.  I play a nomadic style, traveling a lot, and the bow is just lighter, with craftable ammo (arrows). Though I do use the revolver if/when I find one, to scare wolves away. Not for hunting, though. I don't trust it's limited firepower so much. And I don't play Loper. Never liked it, just not enjoyable for me. 

I like your ideas about future crafting of quality tools like hatchets and knives, rather than improvised ones. Good for Stalkers (like me) and Lopers, even Voyageur, if they have a really long run going.