is it just me or...?

[GuardianCreature]

so i start a new game-voyager dificulty-and ive only gotten about 30 days in but my run has been crazy, there's near constant blizzards, i was attacked by green eyed wolves 4 or 5 times when there wasnt an aurora and the wolf sensitivity is through the roof because ive been chased after over a dozen times when they shouldnt of even noticed me.

then-i set up my bedroll to catch a quick nap near the engine in timberwolf-and a freaking bear rips into me, bears have never spawned there the entire time ive been playing. i thought it was just a 1 time glitch so i patch myself up and go about my day, end up shimmying my way down a cliff and set up my bedroll on a tiny little ledge AND THE BEAR FREAKING SPAWNS ONTOP OF ME!!! LIKE WHAT THE HELL I WAS ON THE SIDE OF A CLIFF. 

force shutdown my game so i wouldnt loose progress or a campfire/life, yeah i know it's kinda cheating BUT SO WAS THE BEAR. 

ANYWAY, has anybody else had issues like this? am i just supper unlucky? i know they did a wildlife revamp awhile ago but this is the first time ive really noticed anything.

just wanna add, i wasnt carrying any meat, no guts no fish no nothing. i had zero smell bars

Edited July 1 by GuardianCreature
common question

[Laxgoalie]

There are long existing animal AI issues that are yet to be addressed. If you are talking about the engine area near Andre's peak, there is the possibility that the bear from below pathed up the rope if you have deployed it. There is also a path that does not require a rope to reach that area from below but is a pretty long walk for that bear. Bears climbing ropes has been a long standing issue especially in Broken Railroad/Hunting Lodge but has been reported elsewhere. Regardless of pathing issues, it sounds like you are sleeping with something that would tend to attract a bear. Are you sure you are not forgetting to drop meat or guts prior to sleeping? Meat pies count too.

Aurora wolves persisting into the day was a really old bug that was squashed a while ago, but has resurfaced. It is especially noticeable in the Blackrock Prison complex.

Sounds like neither the aurora wolves or climbing bears are going to be addressed any times soon as HL is likely busy fixing the new cougar issues. In the meantime, I'd recommend not sleeping in the open. Also, think about pulling up a rope if that is what is separating you from a bear and you are doing something stinky. When I harvest the moose in BR, I routinely pull up the rope behind the Hunting Lodge to prevent the bear from "climbing" up there.

[Leeanda]

I had the bear turn up at the lodge not so long ago and I wondered how it got up there.. I read everything that comes onto the forum and this is the first time I've heard of the climbing bear issue..

Also I have had the daytime aurora wolves,mainly at the cannery and BlackRock though ,that has been around since episode 4 came out I believe..

Definitely best to file a report.. the more people do then the better and more info for the team to work with..

[xanna]

I once had the Desolation Point bear chase me up the steps as I was fleeing into Hibernia. Got to the door in time, but I swear it was on the steps behind me.

I also had a bear wake me in the cave just below the Summit climb in Timberwolf Mountain. That area is only accessible by ropes. Weird thing was that it didn't do any damage, and then just disappeared. So all it did was wake me and scare the bejeezus out of me.

 

 

[Mroz4k]

Drop the smelly thing in your backpack.

Scent of the animals can sometimes be riddiculous. Never heard of bears, climbing ropes, but they certainly stalk like wolves that catch scent. The way it works is, if they catch a scent, they will zero-in on that spot and go inverstigate. Even if they need to walk riddiculous distance, as long as they arent disturbed (aka wolf sees a rabbit and chases instead) they can go half a region to check that one spot. And, if once they reach it, they catch another scent again, they will follow that once more. Effectively chaining behind.

Also, have you made fire before resting? Wildlife, even bears, can attack you if you sleep outside without fire, even if they cant reach that location normally. For example, it is possible to get mauled by a bear in cave on top of Timberwolf mountain summit, even though no predators can be found there normally.

Edited July 1 by Mroz4k
Mispelling

[xanna]

6 minutes ago, Mroz4k said:

Wildlife, even bears, can attack you if you sleep outside without fire, even if they cant reach that location normally.

Well. This explains a few things!

I have a couple of times slept without a fire because I thought the area was safe from wildlife - the example below the summit is one time. I also lost my last main run due to a bear being where I thought a bear could not be.

More caution needed!

[ManicManiac]

1 hour ago, Mroz4k said:

if they catch a scent, they will zero-in on that spot and go investigate.  Even if they need to walk ridiculous distance, as long as they aren't disturbed (aka wolf sees a rabbit and chases instead) they can go half a region to check that one spot. And, if once they reach it, they catch another scent again, they will follow that once more. Effectively chaining behind.

Yes indeed, which I find super useful...
We can use ourselves as bait to lure a bear (or wolf) into an ideal spot for us to harvest.  I once coaxed a bear to follow me from Clear Cut all the way back to the Camp Office, and was ultimately able to drop it right in front of the porch.  

Taking advantage of stalking behavior is a wonderful way to take control of where a confrontation takes place.

[[[ Please forgive the very brief sidebar...  ]]]

Edited July 1 by ManicManiac

[Pencil]

I wonder if the ninja bears are back 😂

An update or two ago, TMW seemed to always have bears that had really weird movements. I don't even know how to describe it but they could glitch down or up ledges while turning, since they swung very wide when turning around. I thought it was patched but I wonder if that's what was going on there. 

I don't think any wildlife changes have been made yet. Probably just bears being bears in this case lol. 

[exeexe]

have you visually seen a bear climb a rope? Is there a video of it somewhere?

[Veskaida]

21 hours ago, GuardianCreature said:

there's near constant blizzards,

What Region(s) are you/were you in?

Blizzards and other weather in The Long Dark is partially randomized based on Game Mode and Difficulty. Yes, it is possible to have multiple blizzards in a day on Voyageur, or even multiple clear days on Interloper, it's just unlikely: but the longer you play TLD (or the "luckier" you get) the more likely these probabilities are to happen.

21 hours ago, GuardianCreature said:

i was attacked by green eyed wolves 4 or 5 times when there wasnt an aurora and the wolf sensitivity is through the roof because ive been chased after over a dozen times when they shouldnt of even noticed me.

Aurora wildlife has a much higher detection radius than their non-Aurora equivalents. They can see and smell from extremely far away, especially if you have smelly items, have Blood Loss, or if the wind is blowing unfavorably.

21 hours ago, GuardianCreature said:

then-i set up my bedroll to catch a quick nap near the engine in timberwolf-and a freaking bear rips into me... bears have never spawned there the entire time ive been playing... end up shimmying my way down a cliff and set up my bedroll on a tiny little ledge AND THE BEAR FREAKING SPAWNS ONTOP OF ME!!! LIKE WHAT THE HELL I WAS ON THE SIDE OF A CLIFF. 

Yes, there can be a bear which lives on the plateau south of The Engine/Andre's Peak in Timberwolf Mountain.

Black Bears are associated with a nearby Bear Den, but these Dens have variable spawns based on game mode and randomness. Some bears are "guaranteed" and always live in a particular cave/area, but other bears/dens are randomized.

This may change in a future patch, as well as possible Bear (and other wildlife) patrol areas during the upcoming "Wildlife Refresh" in Tales From The Far Territory: Part 5.

21 hours ago, GuardianCreature said:

i know they did a wildlife revamp awhile ago but this is the first time ive really noticed anything.

No, the Wildlife Refresh has not yet been released, though a "Loot Refresh" was released in the "Tales" update Part 1 from December 2023. I believe the Wildlife Refresh it is still schedueled for release with the "Tales From The Far Territory: Part 5" patch, which Hinterlands has said is releasing in 2024.

Edited July 2 by Veskaida

[xanna]

12 minutes ago, Veskaida said:

I believe the Wildlife Refresh it is still schedueled for release with the "Tales From The Far Territory: Part 5" patch, which Hinterlands has said is releasing in 2024.

Do you mean Part Six? Part Five is with us already (no wildlife refresh yet)

[xanna]

8 hours ago, Pencil said:

I wonder if the ninja bears are back 😂

An update or two ago, TMW seemed to always have bears that had really weird movements. I don't even know how to describe it but they could glitch down or up ledges while turning, since they swung very wide when turning around. I thought it was patched but I wonder if that's what was going on there. 

I don't think any wildlife changes have been made yet. Probably just bears being bears in this case lol. 

Not to mention the ones that flew straight up into the sky...

(Not my video, I just searched youtube for an example)

[Mroz4k]

11 hours ago, xanna said:

Well. This explains a few things!

I have a couple of times slept without a fire because I thought the area was safe from wildlife - the example below the summit is one time. I also lost my last main run due to a bear being where I thought a bear could not be.

More caution needed!

 Trust me, I have also learned this in a painful way!

This is not to say that it is neccesary to always have a campfire! The odds of an attack by wildlife why sleeping grows exponentionally the longer you sleep. So, if you only take 1-2 hr nap, you can quite safely get away with sleeping without a fire. Even 4 hours are relatively safe, though there is some risk involved, there. 

It is good to remember that fire timer gets somewhat prolonged in enclosed location like outdoor caves - so 5 hr fire will often last for 7 hr of sleep with some time left on it. It is also quite safe to sleep with like 7 hr fire for upwards of 11hr of sleeptime with relative safety, even after the fire runs out. Finally, bearskin bedroll will be safer option if one intends to sleep without fire. And speaking of bears - while they are not afraid of fire per-say, sleeping by fire will not spawn one. It is, however, important to drop smelly things before sleeping, because any wildlife passing by can use it to zone-in on the sleeping survivor. Nasty thing to wake up with a wolf, biting your face

11 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Yes indeed, which I find super useful...
We can use ourselves as bait to lure a bear (or wolf) into an ideal spot for us to harvest.  I once coaxed a bear to follow me from Clear Cut all the way back to the Camp Office, and was ultimately able to drop it right in front of the porch.  

Taking advantage of stalking behavior is a wonderful way to take control of where a confrontation takes place.

A mark of a true master hunter  
This is a very good idea, if one has nerves of steel. I mean, who wants to drag the 50kg of meat along when that meat is willing to go on its four right to its last destination, eh?

24 minutes ago, Veskaida said:

What Region(s) are you/were you in?

Blizzards and other weather in The Long Dark is partially randomized based on Game Mode and Difficulty.

Regions matter, too, because some have higher rates of certain behaviour. Pleasant valley is, for example, much more prone to blizzards than other zones. I also believe that Forlorn Muskeg tends to feature foggy weather more often.

27 minutes ago, Veskaida said:

Black Bears are associated with a nearby Bear Den, but these Dens have variable spawns based on game mode and randomness. Some bears are "guaranteed" and always live in a particular cave/area, but other bears/dens are randomized.

Really? If this is how it works, I must have missed it in the years when I was a bit less active with the game.

The way it used to be, and still is, I think, is that certain locations can feature a bear den, and that is where the bear spawns - but this is determined by the game on generation, and these dens are marked with yellowed out skeletons of wildlife as "active bear dens". Which is why its best to quickly spray tag it with DANGER and than hightail it out of there

 

[Veskaida]

43 minutes ago, xanna said:

Do you mean Part Six? Part Five is with us already (no wildlife refresh yet)

Yes, my bad 😆still living in the past; it's been almost a whole week, ok?!

Wildlife Refresh is unreleased, but Hinterlands has said it is dropping later this year.

[xanna]

1 minute ago, Veskaida said:

46 minutes ago, xanna said:

 

Yes, my bad 😆still living in the past; it's been almost a whole week, ok?!

Lol, and what a week! 😁

[Veskaida]

1 hour ago, Mroz4k said:

Really? If this is how it works, I must have missed it in the years when I was a bit less active with the game.

The way it used to be, and still is, I think, is that certain locations can feature a bear den, and that is where the bear spawns - but this is determined by the game on generation, and these dens are marked with yellowed out skeletons of wildlife as "active bear dens". Which is why its best to quickly spray tag it with DANGER and than hightail it out of there

Yes. There are variable and fixed locations for Bear Dens in a region, active Bear Dens are usually (but not always) they are marked by bones in a cave if active.
🦴🐻🦴 But be careful,  some dens which are active have no bones, and there is a cave with bones but no bear (ever). 🦴Sad, lonely bearless bones. #BonesWithoutBear #SoSad #RIP

e.g. in Pleasant Valley on Interloper

Spoiler

• 7 Bear Spawn Points
• 2 fixed Bear spawns points
• 5 variable Bear spawn locations (Dens)
• 3 variable Bear spawns

Bear spawn points never change after worldgen (even when a bear dies), but two runs of the same game mode may have different bear positions.

There is also a:

Spoiler

 "chance to spawn" mechanic for 'some' Bears, where there is an RNG call every 24 hours (70% chance) to see if that bear is active. If it is active, it will spawn in it's den and patrol, if not it woln't exist in the gameworld till the next RNG call where it passes the check. Other bears will always spawn (provided they're not currently on a death timer).

If you're interested in more information about Bears in TLD, I'd highly recommend the video by YouTuber/Twitch Streamer "BladesTLD", where he gives an excellent breakdown of bear mechanics and strategy.

Edited July 2 by Veskaida

[ThePancakeLady]

22 hours ago, GuardianCreature said:

i was attacked by green eyed wolves 4 or 5 times when there wasnt an aurora

I am just going to go back to this bit for the OP.

At the start or end of an Aurora, there may be no lights in the sky. The sky may be somewhat off-color (I  have noticed a very specific olive-greenish color at the very start of Auroras before, with no Northern Lights in the sky showing yet), there may be a slight glow along the horizon that you don't see clearly because of terrain or buildings in your line-of-sight. If you aren't in a building with electric lights that will start flickering, or a computer that will turn on during an Aurora, or you are in a region like HRV with no man-mad buildings at all-you may not know that an Aurora is active *until* you see glowing green eyes from Aurora Wolves or a green glowng bear coming at you. 

So I never count on seeing the rainbow of bright colors in the sky to determine if there is an Aurora if I am out and about in the evening, night, or wee hours of the morning before the sun is up. I look for other signs, and if I have a flashlight I will see if I can turn it on before I head out- they will power up at the very start of an Aurora. If I can turn it on, I need to be ready for Aurora wolves, timberwolves and bear if I am outdoors or headed outdoors to travel or perform tasks. Signs of an Aurora can be vey subtle at the very beginning and end, but the Aurora critters will be full-on and have their Aurora buffs and behavioral changes already going.  Wires in the building where they can become live and electrocute you may be active but not throwing sparks or buzzing yet. It doesn't hurt to have a flashlight stashed at your base(s), either indoors or outdoors, to use them to check if an Aurora is in effect before you leave a place where you are safe(ish).

[Leeanda]

Good point @ThePancakeLady...  

There's still a bug though ,in some areas..I've seen them at gone noon ,once or twice all day..until I killed them 

[MrWolf]

On 6/30/2024 at 10:28 PM, GuardianCreature said:

i was attacked by green eyed wolves 4 or 5 times when there wasnt an aurora...

Aren't wolves' eyes green at night anyway, regardless of the aurora?  The wolf's body glows green during an aurora but I think the "normal" wolves I've encountered at night have a green eye glow.  Does their eye glow change depending on the light source (torch or flare) maybe?

[xanna]

Yeah, I thought wolf eyes flash green at night anyway, regardless of aroura activity. If the whole body glows, and/or there's a sigil on the body, that's definitely an aroura wolf; if it's just the eyes I don't think so.

I had an aroura wolf in Forlorn Muskeg the other day. I was forging through the night at Spenny's and saw it run off towards the water when I was done. Aroura all night but bright daytime when I saw it.

AIUI, aroura wolves are different wolves than non-aroura wolves. They have to spawn in when the aroura begins and spawn out again when it ends. I think sometimes they can't despawn if you're in the world with them, ie not indoors or sleeping or something else which enables a despawn/spawn.

Conjecture that you see aroura wolves in the day if you are out in the aroura and don't go through a loading screen before the sun rises. But then wouldn't we see it a lot more often? Hm 🤔

[ThePancakeLady]

3 hours ago, MrWolf said:

Aren't wolves' eyes green at night anyway, regardless of the aurora?  The wolf's body glows green during an aurora but I think the "normal" wolves I've encountered at night have a green eye glow.  Does their eye glow change depending on the light source (torch or flare) maybe?

You know, that could be right. I'll have to pay more attention when I am out and about at night, since I come across wolves fairly often in Stalker. But I play an "Avoid & Evade" playstyle, and don't often let them get close enough that I can see the whites (or greens) of their eyes, lol. I'll have to do a "Pet the floofy critters" Pilgrim run to see  this now. And yeah- the green body glow is a much better tell for Aurora critters.

[Veskaida]

Something else to consider is Hinterlands is clearly changing TLD's animal AI behavior behind the scenes; my guess is they are overhauling systems in preparation for the upcoming Wildlife Refresh in Part 6 of TFTFT. So this behavior OP describes could also be a bug related to these change(s).

There's been at least two patches in the last 6 months which have modified black Wolf behavior:

• Sometime at/around December 2023 wolf behavior changed to a new AI memory priority and pathing system. This introduced a number of bugs, such as a wolf which is pursuing the player walks behind a tree, losing line-of-sight of the player and either de-aggroing or fleeing upon seeing the player on the other side of the tree.
• v2.29: Wolves no longer seem to fully operate in the old "tandem" system. Multiple Wolves will now stop much quicker and alternate their tandem/attack behavior, e.g. if 2 black wolves are engaged on the player and one flees, the other will attack considerably faster than v2.28.

[Leeanda]

I don't think I've seen anything to indicate that they're changing things,,behind the scenes..   yes some wolves are acting differently sometimes but that could be due to the zone wolves having a slightly different way of acting..  it could be a number of reasons ,including just bugs..

We can't say what htl have and haven't done ,behind the scenes..

[Veskaida]

Might be a difference between platforms too, and yes, like you said certainly could be bug(s). I play TLD exclusively on Steam and almost exclusively Interloper sandbox vanilla.

Biggest changes with mob behavior I've seen are what I mentioned in the "December 2023" post, namely with black Wolves over the last 6 months, especially with them being more skittish and/or losing aggro for seemingly trivial reasons:

• black Wolves seem to drop aggro when losing LOS of the player, even for a fraction of a second
  • if there's a doodad between the wolf and player (e.g. tree)
  • significant height difference or terrain geometry (e.g. you walk up a hill, and the wolf drops aggro)
  • oddities with their detection radius: both myself and several streamers I've watched have been able to get MUCH closer to wolves than I've ever seen before in ~10 years of TLD, literally arm's reach from the rear ~45° of a black Wolf, basically just outside their Struggle hitbox without aggroing them!
  • black Wolves seem follow Poisoned Wolf-like behavior to "ignore the player" if the player is within X of a lit campfire, or is in/on non-pathable geometry (player standing atop a boulder the wolf can't climb, etc).

Noticed this in both new TFT regions and some of the oldest regions in the game, so I don't think it's an issue with e.g. new nav pathing in TFT regions. My guess is during the Poisoned Wolf development cycle, some new behavior patterns were added retroactively to black Wolves: I think that explains the oddities and timeline the best.

[Leeanda]

The intended behaviour for anything should be the same no matter which platform you're on..  if they are different then it must be a bug.

My point is that unless htl state something has been done then we can't assume it has ,but we can speculate..