Water Water Water

[nicko]

Why not have small, large, medium, x-large storage vessals?

x-large - could be a 200 litre drum,

large - 20 litres - common office container.?

medium - ?

small - as is or new shape like a military style canteen.

 

Edited September 4, 2020 by nicko

[ManicManiac]

I think because the increment of the water bottles is fine as is.  Besides, in the inventory it gets treated as one item anyway.

Raph has discussed ideas for a fluid/liquid management system (largely involving points discussed about how the game handles lantern fuel specifically), but so far I don't think how the game handles drinking really needs to be overhauled.

Edited September 4, 2020 by ManicManiac

[DPHG]

2 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

Raph has discussed ideas for a fluid/liquid management system (largely involving points discussed about how the game handles lantern fuel specifically), but so far I don't think how the game handles drinking really needs to be overhauled.

Yes, would be useful from my perspective to be able to refill a jerry can with lantern fuel from other fuel bottles.

[Patriot]

I would argue that one could construct water barrels at various locations in case you find yourself dehydrated and without the ability to light a fire or lacking a can or pot. However, if you were to build it outside that water would freeze. If you built it inside I'm unsure of the ambient temperature. I'm sure in some places it might be fine.

[UTC-10]

There is nothing stopping a character from making and dropping a multitude of water bottles in a given spot.  I look at the Camp Office floor, on some of my sandboxes, and sometimes wonder, "did I make that much water" 🙂.

I really don't have an objection to the idea but there actually is no problem to be solved with this as a solution as far as water goes.  I would like to see more places with wood-burning stoves have a wood bin for wood (or whatever else we'd want to stuff in them 😀).

Now being able to fill/allocate between jerry cans and lantern fuel bottles would be nice as it would marginally help management, but that idea has been around a long time. 

[Patriot]

6 hours ago, UTC-10 said:

There is nothing stopping a character from making and dropping a multitude of water bottles in a given spot.  I look at the Camp Office floor, on some of my sandboxes, and sometimes wonder, "did I make that much water" 🙂.

You are correct. One can do that, and I normally do. However, from a RP perspective that's a problem. If the ambient temprature is freezing then the water ought to freeze. Not to mention where are these water bottles coming from? That too is a mystery.

[sonics01]

23 hours ago, Patriot said:

You are correct. One can do that, and I normally do. However, from a RP perspective that's a problem. If the ambient temprature is freezing then the water ought to freeze. Not to mention where are these water bottles coming from? That too is a mystery.

https://sectionhiker.com/how-to-keep-your-water-bottles-from-freezing-in-winter/

It should be OK to assume that characters in this game are using these techniques. Upside-down the bottle, keep water inside the snow in the night, wide-mouth container, and keep water container close from the body, day and night, to prevent freezing even during hiking. It would not need to depict all these tricks to prevent freezing in this game, we can just assume this. 

Edited September 6, 2020 by sonics01

[sonics01]

The water container idea has been discussed in this forum in the past. I think water container can be a factor to increase the difficulty, which I would like to enjoy.

However, this will bring major change to water-mechanics and would influence on thirsty balance and fire/match/fuel balance of this game, which will take some amount of work not only for water but also for other features in this game. Because players will not be able to hoard a lot of water, they should make a fire more frequently to make water. This will be critical in interloper as the match will run out faster than current system. Too many things are needed to keep a balance of the game to introduce this idea. So, I don't think HL will introduce this feature. They are already busy with other works, IMO they believe that the water and thirsty balance are good enough, and even if they are interested, ideas like this will be in low priority, which means indie studios like HL would hardly seriously consider this idea. 

 

 

However, from the pure thought experiment point of view for the modding possibility, this is an interesting idea and will make this game more challenging. For Stalker and below, we could introduce man-made liquid containers such as military-style canteen or plastic bottle, for rare chance, as a lootable item from the map. For Interloper, we could force players to craft their own improvised canteen or other types of the improvised water containers, big to store and small to carry, using some materials.

Humans, before the era of modern technology, relied on animal leather and animal bladder (cured/dried to use) for the water container. Wineskin, Bota bag... Native American Indians also used similar types of liquid containers based on goat or buffalo bladder. Google "animal bladder leather water container". I think these types of water containers can be introduced in TLD by modding. 

https://www.tienda.com/learn-about-spain/botas.html

Something like this.  

This requires introducing some new resources which can be found from wild animals and nature. Animal bladder (should be cleaned, and then  cured/dried to craft), and craftable light rope (crafted from dried grass). With bear hide or moose hide or a lot of wolf hide with sewing kit/fishing hook and crafted light rope, we could make a "big" water container. With the cured/dried bear/moose/deer/wolf bladder and craftable light rope and sewing kit/fishing hook, we could craft a various size of "small" water containers, with different water amounts and weight. Moose or bear should have bigger bladder, and wolf should have smallest bladder... "Big" containers should be heavy with larger capacity, and "smaller" containers should have carriable weight with smaller capacity. 

I guess the weight of leather/bladder-container should be heavier than man-made ones to carry the same amount of water. That part will increase the difficulty as well.  

With this idea, primitive fire making (hand-drill and bow-drill) should be accompanied as well, because players should make a fire to make water more frequently. Plus, on top of water purification tablet, other natural purification methods (which does not require to make a fire) like 

https://unchartedsupplyco.com/blogs/news/purify-water-in-wild

these should be introduced as well so that players can access to water without making a fire and boil the water. From that link, I think water filtration using soil and sedimentation system could be possible to be introduced in TLD, in more simplified form. 

If I make "hardcore mod" or if someone makes such "hardcore mod", I wish to see these features. 

Edited September 6, 2020 by sonics01

[nicko]

Well I still think a 20L water container would be great for houses. This would save having x20 1 litre water bottle laying around the place.

[odium]

i would love to see an overhaul to the liquid management system as a whole, but it would have a major ripple effect through the entire game balance and would take significant time and effort to do.  given a choice between new water management or a new map, id take the map of course!  water management would add a huge amount of immersion and realism though, which i would love, but the strategies of dropping 30-40 L bottles at each location would disappear, adding big challenges to travel and base building

[oplli]

Just now, odium said:

i would love to see an overhaul to the liquid management system as a whole, but it would have a major ripple effect through the entire game balance and would take significant time and effort to do.  given a choice between new water management or a new map, id take the map of course!  water management would add a huge amount of immersion and realism though, which i would love, but the strategies of dropping 30-40 L bottles at each location would disappear, adding big challenges to travel and base building

i think that what would be the best way to do it is keep the system we have right now but adding two thing:

- those 20 to 100L tanks of water in inside buildings. those tanks we would not be able to take em in our inventory unless they are empty so we can move em. those would work    like the toilets we would take water out of em but we will also be able to refill it up so we will no longer have those millions of water bottles laying around. with this system we      will only be able to carry our usual water bottles and having big water supply tanks. i would love to see that many buildings dosent have a toilet so it would be a logical        alternative to find water. 

- adding a perishable water system. think about it, everything in the game can "perish" so why the water is the exeption? especially the water in plastic bottles beacause it makes the plastic transform in microplastics. so why dont we have a alternative of reusable water bottles for carrying water around when exploring and those big tanks of water to slow the water from perishing when we stock big quantities of water?