Bows - Saplings

[nicko]

Short: We Need More Bow Saplings

I am on a sandox run about 175 days thereabouts. Anyway I am currently at TW Map.  I didn't take a rifle this time, thinking there might be an easy find in the cabin or there abouts. Wrong.

Anyways I sort of expected not to find a rifle very soon, therefore I brought along as many arrow head(stuff all) and shafts as I could. Managed to find more saplings for shafts awesome, and also maybe 1 or 2 max. saplings for bows.

Now this is my grief surely there should be more saplings to make bows?

I think I am down to one bow and one bow that is down to 38% then I will have no hunting bows:(.

Also I see we cannot repair  or harvest anything from bows ATM. I sort of see why, usually when a bow is broken it's un repairable for good, so maybe we get some fire wood and guts if harvested?

I think it wouldn't hurt the game to much if more saplings for bows where spawned on all maps. what are your thoughts?

Just saying no rifle we need other hunting tools Guess I could fish all day long. But to me bow hunting is way more FUN.

[Dirmagnos]

We just need ability to make bows from regular wood, one made from saplings would just be better. Same goes for arrows. Plus alternatives for bows, like spears.

[Boston123]

What do you mean, " regular wood"?

Like, firewood? 

Normally, you carve a bow from a section of a whole trunk. 'Sapling" bows actually tend to be rather shit, as they break easily due to the stress put on the back due to the curved growth rings.

[nicko]

I just think the maps need more bow wood - be it whatever tree or sapling.

[3rdbrother]

Maybe we could allow new saplings to grow in various locations after long periods of time, let's say maybe a couple hundred days or so to portray the 'growing' part.

Despite how the growing of saplings in the middle of winter seems very unlikely, they could allow it, considering how there are an endless number of animal wildlife that keep there numbers no matter what. (speed mating?)

Still, I do feel that there are plenty of different ways to get food while only the bow sparingly, and I do feel that there are already plenty of saplings in each are if you know where to look around. 

[elloco999]

17 hours ago, 3rdbrother said:

Despite how the growing of saplings in the middle of winter seems very unlikely, they could allow it, considering how there are an endless number of animal wildlife that keep there numbers no matter what. (speed mating?)

Those animals migrate into our maps from somewhere outside the gameworld. Trees can't do that

I'm no expert on growing trees, but I don't think a sapling large enough to make a bow out of would grow in a few months, more like a few years.

Personally, I don't feel like we need more saplings for bows. In the end, this is a game and it's more fun if the resources are limited instead of abundant. Also I think bows last plenty long already. In my current game (voyageur) I'm at 60 days or so and my only bow (found at a hunting blind at 48%) is now at 36%. I have so far fired 2 bullets so all other hunting has been with the bow. At this rate, considering the amount of saplings that are spread out over all the maps, I estimate I could survive at least a thousand days using bow hunting as my only source for food.

I do think that if bow crafting is made a skill and bows crafted when your skill is low turn out lower quality/ condition (as suggested in another thread), this should be compensated with more saplings.

[nicko]

fair enough, but I was thinking longer term play. I'm at 200 just now but did manage to find a couple more saps to make a couple more bows. Will see what happens next.

[continuity]

6 hours ago, elloco999 said:

Those animals migrate into our maps from somewhere outside the gameworld. Trees can't do that

I'm no expert on growing trees, but I don't think a sapling large enough to make a bow out of would grow in a few months, more like a few years.

 

Actually I don't think bows are typically made from saplings, rather you would take a fully grown tree and take dozens of "staves" from it that are then set aside to cure for a year or so.  So assuming you have a suitable type of tree (hardwood) growing in the area you could make thousands of bows....

But then there is the consideration that we're not talking about a decent well crafted bow here, we're talking about an improvised POS that breaks after a few uses, so there is that...

From a design perspective, I feel like TLD isn't supposed to be a sustainable survival situation, so having limits on resources makes sense, hence limited rifle ammo, and limited saplings etc..

[cekivi]

On 2016-08-15 at 1:16 PM, 3rdbrother said:

Still, I do feel that there are plenty of different ways to get food while only the bow sparingly, and I do feel that there are already plenty of saplings in each are if you know where to look around. 

Welcome to the forums @3rdbrother! And good point.

[Scyzara]

There are more than 20 maple saplings on all maps alltogether, even on Stalker mode. That's quite enough in my opinion. Adding more saplings would likely take away the joy of finding them.

[Dirmagnos]

Too bad we dont have water/ocean. Ive been playing Stranded Deep on and off for a while and there is a feature that stuff occasionally washes up on shore.

Maybe add ability to fish out various light junk when fishing. With like 5% chance.

[Wastelander]

3 hours ago, Dirmagnos said:

Too bad we dont have water/ocean.

Well, that could be a good alternate use for ice-fishing holes.

3 hours ago, Dirmagnos said:

Maybe add ability to fish out various light junk when fishing. With like 5% chance.

New way to get boots?

[Dirmagnos]

1 minute ago, Wastelander said:

New way to get boots?

Yes, all left ones, all size 36. 8)

[Wastelander]

1 minute ago, Dirmagnos said:

Yes, all left ones, all size 36. 8)

Well, dried leather is dried leather, I neither care where it comes from nor how many fish call it their hometurf  

[cekivi]

5 hours ago, Dirmagnos said:

Too bad we dont have water/ocean. Ive been playing Stranded Deep on and off for a while and there is a feature that stuff occasionally washes up on shore.

Maybe add ability to fish out various light junk when fishing. With like 5% chance.

See latest roadmap additions

[Boston123]

Note:

It is possible to make bows from saplings, it is just more difficult than making bows from a straight section of trunk. You have to very careful and "de-crown" the growth rings on the back of the bow, so the are parallel down the length of the stave.

My current selfbow is made from a birch sapling. It draws about 50lbs at 20 inches.

[cekivi]

3 hours ago, Boston123 said:

My current selfbow is made from a birch sapling. It draws about 50lbs at 20 inches.

Is 50 lbs lethal? I was under the impression that hunting bows were usually 80 lbs and up...

[Boston123]

8 hours ago, cekivi said:

Is 50 lbs lethal? I was under the impression that hunting bows were usually 80 lbs and up...

If you want to get technical, any bow is lethal. Higher poundages just let you make more accurate shots from farther away.

My state (Massachusetts) requires a 45lb bow at the minimum, regardless of the draw length, and that counts for everything from deer to black bear. 

Native American bows have been found as low as 25-30lbs, with reed (aka light in weight) arrows and very small stone points. They were used to take down deer.

Just like with firearms, shot placement is almost infinitely more important than the poundage of the bow. I could be using a 120lb bow, and if I shoot a deer in the stomach, all that poundage isn't going to do jack-all. A reed arrow lodged in a lung, or through the heart, after being fired from a 25lb bow, will be lethal within seconds.

All higher poundages do is allow for a (generally) flatter trajectory, with faster travelling arrows, meaning so long as you can actually use that poundage to the proper effect, you can make more accurate shots from greater distances. You can "make up" for lower poundages by using heavier arrows, heavier/wider heads, shorter arrows (so the arrows travel faster), or smaller fletchings (again, faster, due to less drag, but accuracy suffers)

I personally have used my bow (50lbs) with  short (travel faster) reed arrows (light in weight), inch-wide heads (heavier, wider cutting surface), with small fletchings (less air drag, so faster arrow), to put down deer. SO long as you make the shot within 20-25 meters, and get the arrow through the lung or in the heart, it will go down.

Again, and I cannot emphasize this enough: shot placement is far more important than raw weight. Of course, this is coming from the guy that wouldn't take a shot on an animal past 25-20 meters AT ALL, and that at the best of times. The closer you get, the "easier" it is to make accurate shots, and the easier it is to place arrows where they have to be.

I generally prefer faster, lighter-weight arrows, because I make my shots from close range, as close as I can get.  This is assisted by the fact that I can actually use my 50lb bow to its full potential (duh, because I crafted the draw weight and length to my frame and form ), as opposed to struggling with some 80lb monster.

Of course, I am always talking about wooden selfbows, without any "draw/hold-offs", aiming reticules, etc.

[cekivi]

Interesting. I'm more familiar with compound bows (just target shooting - not for hunting) that usually have higher draw weights since they have the pulley systems to  compensate.

[Vinceofpyrenees]

That's a problem in TLD. Many items cannot be used in all functions like in reality. Before having more new items, id' like to have : 

1) Broken bows could be used as firewood (at least)

2) Reishi for starting fires

3) Old mans beard for starting fires

4) I surely forget others....

[dbldrew]

On 8/18/2016 at 4:00 PM, cekivi said:

Interesting. I'm more familiar with compound bows (just target shooting - not for hunting) that usually have higher draw weights since they have the pulley systems to  compensate.

in regards to hunting deer the higher draw weight is more for a flatter flight path of the arrow. so if you have 20 yard sight and a 30 yard sight both sight pins will be very close to each other. So for instance if you are off on what you think the deer distance is (if not using a rage finder) and you think its 20 yards away but its closer to 30.. the arrow will hit lower but still be hitting the vitals. where a slower arrow would miss.

 

just for reference i hunt with a 60lb draw compound and i put the arrow through both sides of the deer and bury it in the ground on the other side  (with a 2" dia broad head) 

in IL they just dropped the min weight down to 40 lbs 

[Thurman Merman]

On 8/17/2016 at 0:19 AM, Scyzara said:

There are more than 20 maple saplings on all maps alltogether, even on Stalker mode. That's quite enough in my opinion. Adding more saplings would likely take away the joy of finding them.

Agreed.  I've cleaned all maps on my current Stalker run.  I'm not at my home base, so I can't count them, but just on TWM and PV alone, I know I found at least 11 (as well as a bow in one of the caves).  I'm on Day 119 - no way I'll even craft 11 more bows before I die or get bored.

[nicko]

yeh yeah ok I have found more bows so lock this thread?

[Scyzara]

As you wish.