suggestion Firebrands should return

[Ghurcb]

Of all the changes that were made to the game, the removal of brands makes the least sence to me. I'm a relatively new player. I started playing around the time of Steadfast Ranger update, so I never really experienced using firebrands outside of a few short Time Capsule sessions. That also means I'm not nostalgic about them. Still, I think the brands should be reintroduced to the long dark.

For those who don't understand what I'm talking about, here's a screenshot.

 

Back in the days, you could pull those out of campfires. Brands were, basically, torches but worse. 

"Why would we need torches but worse?" One word. Balancing.
Or maybe you could call it otherwise. Anyway. Do you know that it is possible to craft a torch using 3 sticks, cloth, and 0.1L of oil? I don't.
Because there's no need to craft torches. You can take them straight out of a campfire!

Sure, the condition can't get above 50%, but even this way it is crazy OP. A single torch gives +3°C, but to make it you only need to throw one stick into a campfire. That means, you can throw a bunch of sticks into a fire, extract them as torches, pile them up in the same place, and this pile would give you way more heat, way more quickly. And then you can turn each one of them back into a stick. What sort of magic is this?!

But I don't really care about this little exploit. What I care about is the fact that players never craft torches. Not to mention, that pulling a torch out of a campfire, instead of a burning piece of wood, is not particularly realistic.
If instead of torches you got the firebrands, all these problems would be fixed.

I don't know the specific details of how much heat firebrand gave or how long they burnt. But I think it should be +1°C for 30 minutes (~2 irl minutes). That sounds perfectly fair. You shouldn't be able to throw it, just brandish. The brand would weigh 0.15 kg and once it's burned, you can turn it into a piece of charcoal. Also, if you drop it on the ground, it is immediately extinguished. And you can't re-light it.

I think, that's a great idea. What's your opinion?

Edited June 11, 2022 by Ghurcb

[Leeanda]

Forgive me but why?   What's wrong with just torches. 

[ManicManiac]

@Ghurcb
I can understand the sentiment.  For me though, (if I had to pick) I think I would just bring back the brandishing mechanic rather than resurrecting brands themselves:

On 11/2/2018 at 10:53 AM, ManicManiac said:

- Would you considered bring back the brandishing mechanic.  Maybe a quick-tap right click could brandish and a right click+hold to throw?

  
Best of both, I figure...

 

[Ghurcb]

1 hour ago, Leeanda said:

Forgive me but why?   What's wrong with just torches. 

Torches are great! Too great, in fact. It seems unfair, that you can make a torch by throwing a stick into a campfire (and then take the stick back). It also makes the crafting recipe pretty much useless.
And it makes no sence that you can pull a literal torch that you can relight with a single match out of a campfire, instead of just a piece of burning wood.

Torches are OP, brands would make more sence in terms of realism, and serve as a cheaper version that isn't as good.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Ghurcb

[Leeanda]

I have made torches in the past ,before I knew you could pull them out of fires.  And there are usually plenty lying around too. To be honest though I only use them these days if I can't find a lantern or I'm low on fuel. ( Can't be bothered to fish and cook for hours on end).   At least they can be harvested or used as blizzard markers . I know you can with sticks too but they're a lot less noticeable. 

I just can't see a need for them, sorry.    

I should add that all animals should be afraid of fire,and in this game they're not so the realism is not really an issue.

[UTC-10]

So long as the fiery brand mechanics were modified.  The use of them for brandishing against predators was not unreasonable though...

They could not be lit (if blown out or extinguished) from a match or fire, could not be burned in a fire, harvested or otherwise disposed of other than by littering (if dropped outside they tended to not re-spawn like harvested carcasses).  They did not go into inventory so could not be carried through a transition.  As an object their presence, especially dropped inside, could interfere with something from being put down or placed and since they could not be disposed of they would accumulate.  

They were a substitute for pulling a torch from a fire but other than for the specific use as a fiery deterrent to predators, their negative sides made them rather less than utilitarian and more detrimental/problematic.  Making brands just like torches would have negated the reason for them and added to the programming of the game.  The permanency of brands would likely be found to be cluttering up the game world so they probably had to go, but that would be a dev decision.  

 

[ajb1978]

2 hours ago, UTC-10 said:

The permanency of brands would likely be found to be cluttering up the game world so they probably had to go, but that would be a dev decision.  

Easily rectified by having them disappear when placed into a container, same as burnt out flares.

Edit: Ooh, or save up a few burnt out brands and craft them into 1 charcoal, just to give them some utility. And because players like me HATE wasting anything. I save my empty spraypaint cans in the hopes that at some point in the future, they will have a purpose...

Edited June 13, 2022 by ajb1978

[florpman]

16 hours ago, ajb1978 said:

Easily rectified by having them disappear when placed into a container, same as burnt out flares.

Edit: Ooh, or save up a few burnt out brands and craft them into 1 charcoal, just to give them some utility. And because players like me HATE wasting anything. I save my empty spraypaint cans in the hopes that at some point in the future, they will have a purpose...

smort

[UTC-10]

The devs would "need" to do something about fiery brands if they were to bring them back.  They were like empty spray cans and ruined survival bows in that they could not be disposed of.  At least the spray cans and bows could be taken outside and dropped somewhere...  maybe a park ranger might come along and cite you for littering.  Joy!  Signs of returning civilization at last! 😉 

 

[Ghurcb]

On 6/13/2022 at 7:40 PM, Leeanda said:

I have made torches in the past ,before I knew you could pull them out of fires.  And there are usually plenty lying around too. To be honest though I only use them these days if I can't find a lantern or I'm low on fuel. ( Can't be bothered to fish and cook for hours on end).   At least they can be harvested or used as blizzard markers . I know you can with sticks too but they're a lot less noticeable. 

I just can't see a need for them, sorry.   

Actually, torches are VERY useful.

For one, a torch is like a multi-use flare. Is a wolf bothering you? You can light the torch, throw it at the aforementioned wolf, and then extinguish it. But if you use a flare, it will keep burning until it's empty, even though often a few seconds is more then enough.

Not only that, but torches outperform lanterns in both fuel and weight efficiency. Assuming that you actually crafted the torch using 0.1L of oil, it will burn for 1.5 hours. A lantern burns 0.25L of oil per hour. Torch provides a 2.7 times more efficient use of oil. A full lantern weighs 1.8kg. It's a much as 6 torches weigh, and together, they can burn for 9 hours.

I'm telling you, torches are OP. The only downside is that they don't burn in the wind, which is rarely an issue.

[Leeanda]

I'm just making it clear that I meant I can't see the need for firebrands not torches.  Apologies for the confusion!!  I just don't have too much use for torches either but they at least have more uses. 

As for flares I hardly if ever use them.. torches and lantern for light , wolves not an issue on pilgrim and torches work for them anyway.  

Flare gun?   Great!  🙂

Edited June 15, 2022 by Leeanda

[ManicManiac]

@Leeanda

Agreed, torches were/are objectively more versatile/useful than brands ever were.  I suspect that folks who miss brands, likely really just miss the old brandishing mechanic (and perhaps would like to be able to wave the torch around franticly like we used to with brands in order to fend off wolves).  

Personally I'm happy with the torches as is... but as I mentioned before I can understand their sentiment.

[Leeanda]

1 minute ago, ManicManiac said:

@Leeanda

Agreed, torches were/are objectively more versatile/useful than brands ever were.  I suspect that folks who miss brands, likely really just miss the old brandishing mechanic (and perhaps would like to be able to wave the torch around franticly like we used to with brands in order to fend off wolves).  

Personally I'm happy with the torches as is... but as I mentioned before I can understand their sentiment.

I'd be quite happy with wafting torches around!😁.    Personally I'd do it just to make patterns in the air. Bur if it worked enough to make a difference I suppose it would have some value.   Having said that wolves seem to be getting less afraid of fire lately so it could soon be a moot point. 

[conanjaguar]

I haven’t been with TLD long enough to remember the firebrand. However, swinging torches and/or flares at wolves seems a great way to deter them from charging.

[ajb1978]

3 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

I suspect that folks who miss brands, likely really just miss the old brandishing mechanic (and perhaps would like to be able to wave the torch around franticly like we used to with brands in order to fend off wolves).  

I miss brands because it was just more realistic. (Although I DON'T miss having a pile of burnt out brands in the corner.) I would personally like brands to make a comeback, but behave more like the torches we currently have. Burn for a few minutes, throw them to scare off wolves, light a fire with one. But once it's burnt out, it's burnt out. You can't just put it out and relight it later.

I'm as guilty of exploiting this as anyone, but lighting a fire and pulling out a half dozen actual torches is just silly!

[ManicManiac]

@ajb1978
Fair enough, I wasn't trying to speak for anyone specifically... it was just a generalized guess.
(a supposition, if you will )


Also, I see what you mean.

Edited June 15, 2022 by ManicManiac

[Glacia]

Firebrands was a very realistic feature, much more than the current torches.

However, i think the biggest problem is torches are OP!

Yes, you can play the game without caring every mechanic and just chilling doing what you want. But if you want to improve and have the best results (Essential for interloper), you MUST use torches. As stated by @Ghurcb, there is even torch exploits and torches are more efficient than other resources.

As an interloper player and enjoyer of the game mechanics, i think take torches from campfires is unrealistic and unbalanced; making torch crafting useless.

¿Firebrands again? I don't know.  But i think before doing anything like this, the game should balance torches first!

Also (I don't know if it still works), there is a mod who nerf torches.

[Darthmoe]

I actually agree with this so long as way of cleaning up the trash from burned up firebrands is also implemented maybe they just vanish.  

No, I am not nostalgic for the old brandishing mechanic although I would not be opposed to some sort of return as well.

People who don't understand the concept don't realize how powerful torches are.  They can fend off wolves, they are more resource efficient than lanterns, they produce warmth, pretty sure they still produce extra warmth if you are in car (actually that is fairly realistic), and they can save you a fortune on matches.   

I feel that the return of fire brands at least has merit in Stalker and Interloper.

 

[Ghurcb]

On 6/26/2022 at 3:09 AM, Darthmoe said:

I actually agree with this so long as way of cleaning up the trash from burned up firebrands is also implemented maybe they just vanish.  

I think you should be able to burn brands in a campfire (but not start it with one) and turn them into charcoal. Those would be reasonable ways to dispose of them.