UpUpAway95

4 hours ago, rancid0 said:

i once stood in a fire and burned to death on a 1100 day interloper run

Ouch.  Good on you for living that long though.  I really don't see myself wanting to take any individual save beyond the 500-day mark though.

59 minutes ago, Tilt said:

Yes this feature would take development resources. But the end result would be a game that has infinite longevity and that highlights the exploration aspect. Maybe detaching a team from the story mode to work on this in parallel, since it's independent from the story mode would be something to consider.

Focus on exploration with procedurally generated maps are a perfect match to survival sandbox games. The Long Dark is such a game. It adds replayability, it adds to the sense of wonder that people get from new games, it keeps the game fresh at every playthrough and would be a great benefit considering the type of game TLD is. It would be an investment well worth the cost, in my opinion.

I think that detaching a team from story mode IS the equivalent of "disrupting story mode."   The time for revisiting this sort of idea is not now... but AFTER the story is completed.  Then, as I said, I could see a possibility of adding on a gateway (perhaps initiating from Jackrabbit Transport's hangar) that could start various ongoing survival adventures in procedurally generated game worlds.

1 hour ago, hozz1235 said:

I don't know if I'd go that far to get some excitement!  I think I would have a meltdown if I lost that save.

There are many ways to suicide.  My 500-day guy jumped from TWM.  When I get bored with a save on the easier difficulties, I seek out ways to terminate it and start a new one.  Right now, my saves at higher difficulties aren't ever lasting long enough that I get bored with them.  Maybe someday I'll "git good" enough where I'll actually last long enough to get bored with one of those saves and then I'll consider it a real privilege to have that character jump from TWM as well... and after that, there's always an assortment of custome challenges as excuses to start new runs.

11 minutes ago, Tilt said:

I don't think it's safe to say we can rule out procedurally generated maps for the current game.

Here are some reasons:

1) It's been done on many games, so it's definitily doable.

2) It wouldn't need to disrupt the story mode. People who favor the story can continue playing just the story if they want. This would be an added benefit to the game.

3) It would add infinite longevity to the game, which is exactly the same thing that happens for sandbox games like Minecraft and No Man's Sky. Minecraft has recently achieved the spot of most sold game of all time and it's been launched over 10 years ago. It wouldn't get this far w/ static maps.

4) Exploration is probably one of the most fun aspects of the game. But exploration only lasts so long as the maps are unknown to the player, after that the game becomes much easier even on interloper difficulty simply because the player already knows where to go, what to do and what to pick up. It becomes a game of finish the list and not of exploration.

5) TLD already has many interesting features that would combine well w/ procedural maps. For example the charcoal which is used to make maps would become even more valuable and a vital gameplay mechanic whereas now it's pointless after the player already knows all the maps.

6) Creative Director Raphael van Lierop mentioned in an old post that it's important for the players to have the "coming home" feeling of revisiting a known place in the map. I agree. But this isn't lost w/ procedural maps. After the player explores an area, and sets up a base, he'll always get that feeling after coming back to his base that he knows, even on a procedurally generated map. Again, similar to great games such as Minecraft etc.

I really hope game devs see this post. For the good of this great game and its longevity.

 

The reason I believe it would disrupt story mode is that it would change the focus of the staff.  The maps are currently being crafted for the story mode and I don't think, at this stage in the the development, that focus should change.  Once the story is done, then I see a place for it and it would be a fitting continuation for the game world.  What I see as being required is for survival mode players to step back and be patient.  No matter what Hinterland adds to survival mode, the players will always want "more and new and different" and will continually claim "boredom" with whatever is already there.  The players are insatiable in that regard... but I personally want to see story mode completed before we get into that never ending "Minecraft' model of additions and updates.

I don't really see switching the entire game over to procedural generation being feasible or even beneficial at this point in the game's development.  The regions are being designed to work with the story mode and the story is close to being three-fifths finished.  I would hate to see making such a change disrupt the story production at this stage in the game.  Surely, the focus has to be on pushing through with the current generation until the story is complete.  After that, then perhaps I could see them adding a procedurally generated map area along the liens of Raphael's hiighway idea where the player could continue the story beyond the end of the story... a place where, at the end of the story, Will and Astrid can restart the road of the rest of their lives together.

2 hours ago, Senitschnig said:

Ok, maybe the wolf was reseted because I slept for several hours?

Thank you for your advice  I will try it the next time

The progression bar will register a "hit" as long as your arrow/bullet connects with that animal's hit box.  It doesn't guarantee that the animal has been sufficiently hurt to go down.  The next step is to check for a blood trail.  If you have a blood trail in the snow, generally the animal will eventually bleed out.  However, if you go inside before the animals actually drops, it may sometimes reset and there will never be a "kill" registered for it in your log.  Of course, sometimes your own condition will take priority and you'll just have to risk losing the kill to go inside to warm up and rest... but it is worthwhile to consider heading for whatever outdoor shelter might be in the area instead (cave, hollow tree, niche in the rocks, etc.)

When a bleeding animal actually drops, the kill will register in your log.  Once you see a kill register in the log, it is then safe to go inside and rest.  However, if you wait too long to find the corpse, it will despawn  eventually.  As it lies there, the condition is decaying rather rapidly and the corpse despawns when the condition reaches 0.

My list (includes some variations on iems from the OP's list).

1) Release all 5 episodes of Wintermute (I'd give top priority to this).

2) Ability to read books and craft in 15-minute intervals.  Crafting can currently be done on this short timeframe, however, there is some sort of accounting bug in the interface.  I can request to craft for, say, 4 hours on a project that takes a total of 10 hours with sufficient daylight, food and supplies to go for that length of time.  While it appears that I am crafting for the full time, the time remaining on the project is often not equal to the total time minus the time I just spent crafting.  For example, I just crafted a moosehide satchel for 4 hours out of the 10 and had 6.25 hours remaining.  This should be corrected and the two interfaces (reading and crafting) made consistent with each other.

3) Insert a warning when about to eat raw meat AND correct the issue that causes the interface to sometimes remain selected on an individual item even when closed.  That is, sometime when you first open the interface, you need to click once to get into the individual food items and sometimes that first click will cause you to eat an item since the cursor fails somehow to return to the left column icon set when the interface was last closed.  Ninety-nine percent of the time, assuming I need to click to get over into the foods section when I don't is the reason I wind up accidentally eating raw meat.

4) Derease animal bleed out times.  This would certainly be helpful.

Shutting down the Xbox overnight relieved the condition.  I guess it was a cache issue.

I have no other way to describe it... my crafting interface just broke.  When I try to move from my inventory to craft, I don't get any sort of crafting display.  All that happens is I get blurring around the edges of the screen, similar to how it looks when there is pain (but in this case, there is definitely no affliction at all in play).  Has anyone else experienced this and is there any way to fix it on the Xbox One?

ETA:  I was in the middle of crafting my moosehide satchel when it happened.  Everything was normal for my first 4-hour session.  Then I stopped to have something to eat in game and simply couldn't get back into the crafting interface after that.

15 hours ago, Ankster91 said:

I have been getting into tld survival now that I’m done with Wintermute and from my time browsing the forums and playing the game there seems to be certain super good loot in specific areas. I’m on a custom “pilgrim” mode and I’m interested in finding new loot. So: what are some high tier loot items that I might not find that y’all know about. I’m sorry if this seems vague or slightly confusing. 

Also are any items set loot? Like I’ll you find it there 100% of the time?

thanks

There aren't a lot of different items... that is, there isn't a long list of "legendary" type loot, so I agree with Frozen Corpse, that a better way to enjoy this game is to truly explore each area of the map you're in as you go.  Try your hand at hunting each sort of animal (and hunting wolves on Pilgrim is a bit more challenging than you would think since they run away from you rather than attack).  Some of the best clothing is what you can craft yourself from the various animal hides.

As far as I can tell, there is really only one item that is guaranteed to be there 100% of the time... and that is the distress pistol at the bottom of the Ravine... and you'll have to find the mountain rope in Mystery Lake to get there (and that rope spawns in different locations or may not spawn at all... meaning you'll have to steal one).  Although it is an important item in stalker mode, you won't need to fire a distress pistol at all in Pilgrim mode.  Rifle and pistol spawns move around, but you will generally (repeat generally) find a rifle in PIlgrim mode in each different zone of the map, other than the transition zones.  The best overall weapon is the bow since you can craft both the bow and arrows (once you have a heavy hammer and can use one of the three forges in the game).  On Pilgrim, the heavy hammer is often found at or near the forge, but not always.

Throughout the game, you are in constant need of food, water, and wood for a fire.  Matches are precious, so finding a magnifying lens is important (although there are sufficent matches in Pilgrim mode to go for a long, long time if you're not lighting them frivolously).  There are several places where you can find a magnifying lens,  but again, they do move around among those places.

12 minutes ago, Admin said:

The Hotfix has now been released on consoles. Players should start seeing it within the hour, if not already.

I'm updating on Xbox One as I'm typing this.  Thanks, such fixes are always a pleasant surprise.

I'd like it if they added an actual solitaire minigame.  The rub that I see is determining in advance the amount of time that would be spent so that one wouldn't wind up perpetually burning things on the stove.  With the "pass time" dial, you can desigante that you're going to pass a maximum of X hours and then interrupt it if you want to actually pass less time in the end... while the sound of cards shuffling causes you to imagine that Will/Astrid is playing solitaire.  If you're actually playing a hand of Klondike though, I'm not sure how they would work in that sort of maximum time for it to take... arbitrarily set that one hand of klondike takes 15 minutes of game time?... don't know.

1 minute ago, stratvox said:

In ghudless mode, you get no names at all. When you pick it up, you see the little 3d revolvable model, but no name, no condition, no mass, no calorie count... nothing. That's why the visual cues are crucial; you can only see the actions you can take (take = rmb, eat = space, leave=lmb) and the model for the item.

It's actually really interesting how it makes you handle what's happening... you're only cues for condition are the little sayings and sounds you get from the guy (e.g. "The guy who drank is own pee doesn't seem so crazy right now" means "you're about to start losing condition due to thirst so drink some water moron"). I think the menus could also use some re-working in hudless mode to make them more copacetic with with the hudless philosophy of how you experience the game... and it would be to take certain classes of information away from you.

 

I understand that... all I'm saying is I hope they don't eliminate the name cues in the process of reskinning the appearance.  Leave the name cues in if one is playing with the HUD on.  People who want to go with just the visual cues can then do so by turning the HUD off.

21 minutes ago, stratvox said:

I have tried playing with the HUD turned off, and in fact those kinds of cues are crucial in order to make that viable; right now if you're playing hudless you have to take it and look at it in inventory to know what the condition is because there are no cues at all when you pick it up. I'd prefer it to be the other way around; you can look at it and get a general idea of what the condition is, but even looking in inventory won't actually tell you. Turns eating things into much more of a lottery for the player...

...and I can say that playing hudless is quite cool, but the inability to get a handle on item condition that's not super precise (looking up the condition in the inventory screen) by looking at it makes hudless playing not really tenable in the long term. And that's unfortunate because, as I said, playing hudless is very cool indeed.

However, with the HUD on, I hope they leave the name indicator in place (e.g. New vs. Dusty vs. Banged Up, etc.).  I like being able to just scroll over a bunch of food I've dropped in a pile and have some indication which piece of food I want to pick up... without having to pick up each and every piece to look at it in the close up view to judge the visual condition of each can.

47 minutes ago, Rashad82 said:

I am gonna guess that a lone wolf encounter (easier) will always have a place in the game, as will multi-wolf (much harder).  

Hinterland is probably thinking about how many of one vs the other they want in what difficulty mode, and/or when the harder packs start spawning? (Immediate vs late to challenge an established run.)

This would be my guess as well.

I'm anticipating that you'll only first contact timberwolves in TWM and HRV and then, I believe, they will be able to transition (follow you) into other zones of the map.  They also may make it such that timberwolves will only spawn at the higher difficulty levels, allowing reticent players to still get used to some wolves in the game by dealing only with the easier "normal" variety.  Who knows, they may even introduce a custom setting, allowing players to eliminate normal wolves and keep timberwolves in their own game and/or adjust the relative spawning rate of each.  We also don't know regular the current wolfhide clothing will be craftable using timberwolf pelts or whether there will be something entirely different that can only be crafted with timberwolf pelts.

Also, we currently have both moose and deer in the game and they've managed to balance both the differences in their behavior and in their spawn rates to make them both feel essential to the game... at least I'd hate to imagine TLD without either one of them.

1 hour ago, stratvox said:

The problem with this is that lamp oil is a significantly better accelerant for lighting a fire than gasoline is in the real world.

It's not a problem.  My post was not about realism.   I'd be just as happy if they eliminated accelerant completely and gave us an equivalent spawn of more lamp oil.  Accelerant only has the one use in the game, which quickly becomes a non-issue as fire starting gets leveled up.

18 minutes ago, hozz1235 said:

After I posted that question, I kind of regret it...

I understand it could be used as Accelerant but gasoline is very "combustible" (i.e. burns/explodes quickly).  Yes, could be used on a torch, but I wouldn't expect it to last long.

Have you ever used gas to light a campfire IRL?  In my experience, the fuel tends to quickly burn off w/e substance you put it on.  Perhaps if you could let it soak into some tinder, that might be better.

While I was being a little facetious with my "accelerant, of course" post, I honestly don't see why gas pumps couldn't be an alternative accelerant source in this game... which, as we are frequently reminded, isn't focused on being entirely about realism.  I would envision just being able to get so much of the standard current accelerant out of the pumps in much the same way we currently get so much potable water out of toilets.  To rebalance things, lamp oil could be made exclusive for using in the lamps and for making torches; that is, using lamp oil as an accelerant would no longer be an option in this game.  In that way, accelerant would become an absolutely finitie resources; whereas, lamp oil can be obtained infinitely by fishing.  That accelerant would become finite shouldn't be an issue since the odds of a fire starting increase through leveling and accelerant really isn't needed to improve on those odds when the player has fully leveled the fire starting skill.

12 hours ago, loriaw said:

I'm fine with leaving appropriate items in appropriate places even though odd things here and there wouldn't bother me at all. When I started playing this game ~ as regions were added ~ the degradation didn't begin until you entered that region. While the change makes sense, it also means I spend the first 30 days doing nothing but scavenging. After that there just isn't much left to do beyond grinding out days. 

The game I play with random loot is the same one I've got 4787 hours into. It is modded into a recreation of this game with harsher weather, almost no loot at all, more night than daylight, and more blizzards. I play with Requiem or on Legendary (Legendary if I use Alone and Lonely which remove cities and towns and npcs), Frostfall, Campfire, Hunterborn, Realistic Needs and Disease, Realistic Animals and Predators, several weather mods, etc. Most of the survival mods allow for setting loot to minimum amounts (12 pounds vs. 80-120 pounds of meat from large animals), along with high level loot mods to remove/lessen item spawns. In addition to making several of these play nice together, I've modified several in Tes5 and/or the creation kit to adjust things a bit more. Without houses and bandits to loot, there isn't a lot left but plants and animals, and harvesting animals requires a fire. There is no run to point A, B, C etc., only take what you find and craft something to get keep you alive another day. 

The difference is that I CAN craft things to do that, there are no mechanics that cause storms to eat my clothing or the animals psycho. A bear or a sabre cat at level 1 when I'm all squishy will do me in … but if I can make it to level 15 or so I at least have a chance. I play without perks and just the basic skill tree. I also play with all sorts of stews, teas, cured meats, bread, butter and cheese (if I can keep the cows safe) ~ and I can plant and harvest items in a few limited locations. I travel with two tents; one for rain, one for snow. Fast travel is disabled, frigid water will kill me, and if I freeze I die ( and start over) … same as in this game. A few pluses are that I can catch and tame a wild horse if I want (modded), find an orphaned wolf pup and raise it (if I can protect it and feed it until it is grown), develop my skills and build a campfire that won't blow out, and so on.

The first pelts/skins I harvest are generally ruined. Then they are of poor quality. The same goes for crafting. Failures then low quality items that gradually get better. Most food that IS found lying around or in a barrel or sack is moldy and will make me sick. Staying clean is a must ~ and a challenge in freezing temps. There are no magic pills for illnesses, and if I run out of food or firewood I'll die (and so will my wolf pup until he is grown and can hunt for himself). I turned an RPG into a true survival game by combining the mods, editing some, and creating two to complement the rest. 

As for finding quality loot in 'easy' places, I've already said that could/should be addressed, although I'm not sure that it matters all that much. Even if you find a moose satchel in the Camp Office, you may not find decent clothing, tools, medicine, or other supplies until you go through two other regions. One play through may set you up in your starting region … another may have you frantically scavenging over half the island. As I've said ~ to me what matters is actually being able to survive based on my own skill vs. rng. For my tastes, there is already too much loot on any level in TLD, and what few skills that are addressed would have most people dead or dying before they ever got to level 5. 

All I can really say is to each their own ~ but I'd bet good money that many experienced loper players would be seriously challenged with my setup.

One premise being suggested by this thread though is that randomized loot would "force us" into doing more exploring.  I disagree and have pointed out that it also has a chance (being random) to discourage exploring.  If you do find a moose satchel in the Camp Office, you're not likely to be inclined to go looking for another.  Same with the distress pistol (which is another set spawn in this game).  If you find one in the Trapper's Cabin, you're not likely to be inclined to worry about getting a rope to go down into the bottom of the ravine.  Since the rope is a reasonably consistent spawn at the destroyed lookout, you may not be inclined to go up there to try to find it.  The pattern will most likely change from planning routes to get to the tough areas to find specific gear to just hitting all the easy places first and, if randomly lucky, not bother looking for anything else.  I don't think that's necessarily better than making plans to hit the more difficult places in the game early on in order to acquire specific choice loot.

The issue with the loot tables right now is merely that there aren't enough different ones made yet.  With 10 different ones, the loot on them will appear to be more random.  Instead of a 1/4 chance of finding something that defines what one of four loot tables you're on, you'll only have a 1 in 10 chance at the outset and you'd possibly need to find 2 or more items before you could narrow down your game to a single loot table (that's even if you've obtained a spreadsheet and are following it).  As I said, I would expect that more will be added just to accommodate new items and new regions being added to the game.  The devs can decide for themselves, but I personally (just me and my little own opinion) really don't see a need to change the rationale behind their loot system.

3 hours ago, jeffpeng said:

As I said: Easy enough to do, but hard enough to do well 😉

I would consider this to be the most realistic approach. I work a lot with algorithms (as you might have guessed) and introducing a human factor (i.e. putting a ghost into the machine) is always positively notable.

There is a threshhold at which randomness becomes destructive. For example being struck by lighting is probably a very exciting and surprising experience. However most people would chose not to have it since it involves a lot of pain and often dying quite a bit. What I am saying is: being greeted on the porch by a bear when leaving Grey Mother's might be as irritating as being jumped from a stack of a dozen wolfes hiding out under the bringe to the dam, or dying from thirst because the first set of matches is 3 maps away. Such instances would happen very rarely, and mostly likely so rare that most people never experience them, but those that do will feel cheated out of an experience that is supposed to be (somewhat) fun. The community backlash for such a thing is too great. It's already very much possible to have stellar bad luck and just spawn next to a bear gnawning on your face in a remote corner of HRV (which happened to me, and I lived to be 300 days old ... but I cannot say I was particularily happy with my start)

So of course you would employ mechanisms to mitigate this: bears would be excluded from camping players on porches, wolf populations would be limited to a certain density, and every map would have at least one sort-of easily accessible source of ignition. But then of course you would think about how to further streamline these mechanics to offer a great and compelling experience to the vast majority of your audience. Before long wildlife has set spawn points and areas they can roam in relative randomness, and key loot is organised so the every game is viable and balanced, and it is made sure that it is placed properly so that it is actually accessible. Whambam! You created The Long Dark as it is today.

I'm not saying TLD is handling everything perfectly as it is. Nobody is, even the devs are (as they are being devs and I want to claim to know a bit about how developers tend to think about their own software ... ) very aware that there are glaring issues in the game, some of which have good answers, some of which, as this one at hand, do not. I honestly think that, even if that means a lot of work and subsequent playtesting, expanding the set of loot tables is the most sensible thing to do so late into the lifecycle of a game as complex and as reliant on good balancing as The Long Dark. What the number is here I don't know. 10 feels like a good measure. I can memorize maybe one or two more, 6 more would overload my brain to the point where I can maybe make educated guesses, but certainty vanishes.

Thank you Jeff.  This is basically what I've been trying to say.

3 hours ago, loriaw said:

So keep clothing in dressers and food in cupboards. It honestly makes zero sense to find anything edible in ovens, frig/freezers given the rate of decay for any other food item (particularly when canned goods in the same kitchen are at 14%). As for TWM, I want to know if that plane was hauling a shipment from the Goodwill store or new goods ~ because anything being shipped should be in better than average (as compared to other ingame loot) than what I've found up there. Think about it. Why is there an entire container of various shirts/sweaters all at 40% or less condition? Why is there a container with MRE's at 26%? I go there for coffee/tea, whetstones, rifle rounds, and matches/firestrikers. 99% of any clothing is turned into cloth and canned goods less than 60 % I just leave where I find them. I'll snag the MRE's if they are above 75%, otherwise I just snack on the while I'm there and leave the rest. 

I absolutely appreciate the nature of a totally random loot system. The game I play most has one and I love it. On the other hand, I don't depend on loot in that game because I hunt, plant stuff, and I can craft just about anything/everything when/if I need it … and the weather is worse. If the best one can manage while surviving is depending on loot they find, they aren't going to last all that long; and the same applies to defense against predators. In all honesty, I don't expect much more in the way of new loot as far as TLD. We're still stuck with beans, peaches, and tomato soup after more than 4 years. 

I read your earlier posts (I had not read this entire thread, but I finally caught up on it), but again, I don't really expect any major changes in this department. A lot of the loot is hand placed (per Hinterland's comments), and the rest is all done by rng. They don't seem all that interested in changing that. That is sad, because in the long run, it is a self-limiting aspect that more and more people are going to grow disenchanted with. Knowing what I do about game mechanics and modding, I suspect they severely limited themselves right at the start and that is why so many things can't/won't be changed now. I'm not even sure that if they ever open the game up to modding that it will change because that will also be limited by how they set up the mechanics. 

The bottom line ~ for me ~ is that skill matters in a survival game. A LOT. If my skill can't improve, and counts for squat against an rng deliberately set to failure it starts to feel like I'm beating a dead horse so to speak. I've been fighting against that for almost two years now. The elements that made the game stand out have been shadowed by the never ending list of punishments and limitations (and those HAVE grown since the game was first out in EA). My 'vision' of survival has diverged quite a bit from the devs. I can't enjoy 'stasis', which is why almost ANY change that makes it worth covering all of the map appeals to me. 

Finding a fish in an oven makes a lot more sense than finding a heavy hammer there.  I can certainly head canon an explanation - Perhaps some person walking to the coast used the house and tried to use the oven to cook a fish that was caught long after the original family of the house abandoned it.  Perhaps they are only an hour or two ahead of Will/Astrid.  As for the sweaters in TWM being at 40%, I usually don't get up there until later in my game (nearing day 500) so my head canon is that they've been sitting there deteriorating while I explored all the other areas of the map.

What's the game you play that has 100% random loot... without at least placing some choicer loot in places that are more difficult to get to?  I play at lot of FO4 and loot is certainly not totally random in that game.  Even drops aren't totally random since they change as the player levels up.  I played TW3 and loot certainly isn't totally random in that game (I go to this place for the Cat armor, that place for this particular sword, etc.).  I'm currently playing RDR2... again, it's not all random loot but has numerous placed items that are always there.  Even Minecraft isn't toally random since certain things only spawn in certain biomes.

If you make, say, the moose satchel a truly random spawn, it means it could spawn in the Camp Office.  If you find it there, then what is the point of even trying to go up to the signal tower... for your upteenth hatchet (if you're not in loper) and some food?  Right now, it's spawning in a place that, guaranteed, it's going to take some effort to acquire it.  Knowing it's there, doesn't make that journey any easier (and I have a feeling timberwolves are going to make it a lot harder soon).  I really don't have a problem with it not being a random spawn.

Addendum:  If someone stacked the odds in any way with any sort of algorithm in a slot machine, the odds of winning are no longer "totally random."  They're being manipulated.  If Hinterland can (and wants to) write an algorithm that ensures 1) choice loot only spawns in hard to get to locations; 2) disperses choice loot so that the player cannot totally equip themselves in a single zone; 3) ensures that the containers and places in which we find certain types of loot make some semblence of sense; and 4) don't litter the game world with an excessive amount of "random" containers, they can do that... but I'd still then that it's not "totally random" loot.

5 hours ago, loriaw said:

I've played 2307 (edit to add ~ I just opened Steam to check, and I've got 100+ hours more than the 2200 I thought I was at) hours. I've owned the game since 2015. I've watched probably upwards of 100 videos on just Stalker and Interloper play ~ and they all run from point A to B to collect their beginning supplies. Every. Single. One. Of. Them.

They do that because they can't survive the initial days without doing so. 

When Hushed River was released, I started a new game spawning into that region ~ blind ~ and the first week (of game play) was GLORIOUS. Absolutely glorious. It was tough and a bit nerve wracking and all brand new. I could see that blasted trail of smoke (occasionally), I had no clue where anything was, and it was the hours I already had in the game that gave me the skills to live long enough to start finding items that helped. It was similar to the first time I spawned into Mystery Lake and had no clue what to expect or where anything was.

Now ~ I know my way around the place. Sadly, I also have a pretty good idea which areas are worth the effort, which aren't, and can traipse straight up to get my moose pack and head on to other locales and loot. 

If you can't see the difference, perhaps you'll start to get an inkling when you get to 1000 or so hours of play time. Or not. Your mileage definitely seems to vary.

In a post farther up the thread, I have alreayd indicated that I have played more than 1000 hours in this game... that's, BTW, WAY more than 100 hours (which is also what I stated).  

Fact is, you don't represent everyone who has played more than 100 hours in this game.  Different people like different things.  I happen to like loot that makes sense where it can be found and being rewarded for getting someplace not so easy to get to by finding better quality loot in that location rather than throwing it all up into the hands of the RNG gods.  I would hate to randomly find all the good stuff in my starting zone... which would not encourage me to explore further.  I'd hate to climb Timberwolf and only find a tin of sardines and a bunch of empty crates; whereas, I don't mind finding that tin of sardines on the counter in a Milton House (even though I predict finding it there 90% of time) because that house wasn't as tough to get to in the first place.  Knowing that sardine tin is there, does not prevent me from searching all the cabinets in the house.  I don't run to the Ravine and only pick up the distress pistol either.  While I'm down there, I'll still check the other loot locations near there and on the way to there.  If you find yourself just beelining to get to the good stuff, then you CAN decide to change how you play the game.  The loot system isn't preventing you from doing that.

You don't seem to appreciate the nature of a totally random loot system... which BTW very, very few games ever have.  I did say early on in this thread that they could afford to have more variations of the locations where the essential or most desired stuff is located.  That makes things less predictable without going to totally random loot.  I suspect that will happen anyways as more lootable items are added and more zones are added to the game.

13 hours ago, loriaw said:

That's ok. There are several random containers that absolutely are always there. There are loot drops that always have the same thing (in various quantities) all over TWM. I've played every map region literally hundreds of times since there was ONLY Mystery Lake with a Fluffy in the Dam, and maybe 15 rifle rounds total (on a good day), the wolves were solid black, and you could run without ever getting tired. There are harvestable plants that have been in the same exact location since the beginning. Most remain fixed in each region as the maps have been added ~ the only real exception being several maple/birch spawns. Corpses have been random from the start (or within a few updates, can't really remember), although the lack of women/children is far more odd than their randomness … or that people actually use them as containers. 

I'm not arguing with you, but at this point I'm going to point out that your reasons are based only on your play style ~ with absolutely no consideration for any other person who plays this game. As for not wanting to find shoes in a frig, I've found the most bizarre things in unlikely places … and given the locations people tend to hide things/stash things when they don't want them found, it really isn't all that bizarre (no more bizarre than the long johns/matches/accelerant combo in tubs, or crowbars behind toilets (which seriously brings up mental images I would prefer to never have experienced).

The bottom line is that starting a new run in any mode means a player with more than 100 hours or so pretty much just runs from A to B to C getting what they need. There is no 'hope I find this' or 'I need this and have no idea where I might find it'. Thanks to achievements, the best little house in Coastal is forever burned down; random loot would mean we'd actually have to hunt for stuff every single game ~ and what you think would be inconvenient, others would find amusing. In any case, it would be preferable to the just 'going to the corner store' that everyone knows the location of imo. Just as you place your particular playstyle above others, others place theirs above yours. Upvoting something in no way guarantees that it will ever become a reality, but I at least try and upvote things that benefit the most possible players. If it were up to me, Interloper would not exist (as an example). I'd have much preferred more content and immersion over grinding my teeth and clenching my knuckles with more regularity than a CPR session. Real survival is nothing like that if you survive the first few days. I'm also aware that Anything added now that adds content and immersion completely screws over loper players (and most Stalker players to some extent) because they don't have the time or the resources for either. I can say that the more things added that cater only to the hardest two modes, the less interest I have in any part of the game. 

Addendum:  Bet everyone who has played more than 100 hours in this game is gonna love it (if they do implement 100% random loot) after they spend a bunch more in game time working their way to the top of TWM... only to find a crate full of driving gloves or worse, a bunch of empty containers and maybe a tin of sardines.

12 hours ago, loriaw said:

That's ok. There are several random containers that absolutely are always there. There are loot drops that always have the same thing (in various quantities) all over TWM. I've played every map region literally hundreds of times since there was ONLY Mystery Lake with a Fluffy in the Dam, and maybe 15 rifle rounds total (on a good day), the wolves were solid black, and you could run without ever getting tired. There are harvestable plants that have been in the same exact location since the beginning. Most remain fixed in each region as the maps have been added ~ the only real exception being several maple/birch spawns. Corpses have been random from the start (or within a few updates, can't really remember), although the lack of women/children is far more odd than their randomness … or that people actually use them as containers. 

I'm not arguing with you, but at this point I'm going to point out that your reasons are based only on your play style ~ with absolutely no consideration for any other person who plays this game. As for not wanting to find shoes in a frig, I've found the most bizarre things in unlikely places … and given the locations people tend to hide things/stash things when they don't want them found, it really isn't all that bizarre (no more bizarre than the long johns/matches/accelerant combo in tubs, or crowbars behind toilets (which seriously brings up mental images I would prefer to never have experienced).

The bottom line is that starting a new run in any mode means a player with more than 100 hours or so pretty much just runs from A to B to C getting what they need. There is no 'hope I find this' or 'I need this and have no idea where I might find it'. Thanks to achievements, the best little house in Coastal is forever burned down; random loot would mean we'd actually have to hunt for stuff every single game ~ and what you think would be inconvenient, others would find amusing. In any case, it would be preferable to the just 'going to the corner store' that everyone knows the location of imo. Just as you place your particular playstyle above others, others place theirs above yours. Upvoting something in no way guarantees that it will ever become a reality, but I at least try and upvote things that benefit the most possible players. If it were up to me, Interloper would not exist (as an example). I'd have much preferred more content and immersion over grinding my teeth and clenching my knuckles with more regularity than a CPR session. Real survival is nothing like that if you survive the first few days. I'm also aware that Anything added now that adds content and immersion completely screws over loper players (and most Stalker players to some extent) because they don't have the time or the resources for either. I can say that the more things added that cater only to the hardest two modes, the less interest I have in any part of the game. 

I disagree.  I'm a player with way more than 100 hours and I do not just run from A to B to C getting what I need.  I don't choose to play that way and, IMO, you don't have to choose to play that way either.  I've stated my reasons for not upvoting this idea and 'I'm not arguing with you, but at this point I'm going to point out that your reasons are based only on your play style ~ with absolutely no considertions for any other person who plays this game."   Spare me your trite lectures, please.  Hinterlands can do whatever they feel is best and decide for themselves whether such a change is worth the time and effort it would take them to change their entire loot system in the game in order to implement it.

Not really in favor of it.  Managing the time one has to spend out in the weather, as well as your fatigue, hunger and thirst is a major part of the strategy of this game.  Having to harvest animals wherever they fall is one of the main challenges the player has in this entire game.  Being able to just move entire animal corpses into your base to harvest would, IMO, break the game entirely.