Ketosis risk

[SteveP]

Those who live in the North know the importance of having fat in the diet. A diet which is exclusively high protein but without fat or carbohydrates can develop ketosis. The foods in TLD that have fat include salmon, trout, fish, and bear meat. Deer often have healthy reserves of fat however rabbits will have insufficient fat reserves. There should be some fat on a wolf especially on the ribs however there might not be much especially depending upon how much food the wolf is getting. The same can be true of deer which are not getting enough food. The amount of fat varies in fish varies depending upon the time of year and the availability of food. Salmon and trout could have as little as 0.3% or as much as 14%. The Composition of Fish

The using up of the bodies fat reserves is exacerbated by heavy exercise, which would be typical of TLD.

It just adds another risk to the game, if we need one.

To cure ketosis, you need to eat some carbohydrates or fatty meat. Being sick with ketosis probably makes you weaker. It might affect your brain function first since glucose is essential for brain function although the body can break down fat to provide glycogen (gluconeogenesis).

[oldsoldier181]

Of course, you can also figure in rickets, scurvy-pretty much any vitamin deficiency related illness.

[Boston123]

Actually, rabbits do have fat, it just tends to be separate from the meat. Animals like salmon and deer tend to have fat "marbled" in the meat, which means by eating straight meat, you still get adequate fat.

"Rabbit starvation" happens when you don't eat enough fat, period. It doesn't happen with just rabbit meat. It is just that the fat that rabbits do have tends to be cooked away with 99% of wilderness cooking methods.

Part of the problem is that in TLD, and in most wilderness survival situations where you are eating rabbit, you are roasting your food, usually over a fire. That means that whatever fat is on the animal will burn off in the fire. The sizzling sound we hear when cooking meat (all meat) in TLD? Fat, burning off the meat.

This is why

1) I make broths and soups whenever I am in the wilderness. and carry a small cookpot just for the purpose. By boiling food, you 1) basically guarantee that your food will be safe to eat, as it reaches the boiling point during the cooking process, and 2) ensure that whatever fat and nutrients can be found in the meat get consumed. Sure, when you boil meat, fat and bones, some of the fat/nutrients will leave the medium, but unlike roasting, they just go into the broth. By drinking the broth, you make up the difference. Not to mention that making soup both makes unpalatable food taste better -AND- stretch out your supply.

2) I eat -EVERYTHING- on the animal when I am in the wilderness. Not just the lean muscle meat, but also the offal, the fat, the blood, bone marrow, etc. The heart, the liver, and the kidneys are all perfectly delicious, and -very- nutritious as well. You can avoid many vitamin-deficiency-based diseases by eating offal. Boil the bones to make broth, and crack them open if they are large enough for the marrow. Take the blood and mix it into stews for some added nutrition, or mix blood, fat and shredded meat into intestines for sausages.

In TLD, we are basically "doin' it wrong" with regards to eating.

[Dirmagnos]

Considering that there is far more parasites and bacteria in offal that in meat and also boiling is not as effective at killing them as roasting, im not so sure that i would go for it instead of regular steak prepared over an open fire. Not to mention that fat is not completely lost during roasting. Not to mention that in preparation for winter many animals put an extra effort to accumulate more of it. Eating boiled guts instead of properly prepared meat in fear of highly unlikely condition(but likely contracting one of many other illnesses) - no thx, not worth it, imo.

[Scyzara]

Considering that there is far more parasites and bacteria in offal that in meat and also boiling is not as effective at killing them as roasting, im not so sure that i would go for it instead of regular steak prepared over an open fire. Not to mention that fat is not completely lost during roasting. Not to mention that in preparation for winter many animals put an extra effort to accumulate more of it. Eating boiled guts instead of properly prepared meat in fear of highly unlikely condition(but likely contracting one of many other illnesses) - no thx, not worth it, imo.

Bacteria, worms and viruses (at least the ones you might come across inside an animal's body) don't care whether you boil or roast them - as long as you heat them above 80°C for at least 10-20 minutes, they die/denaturate anyway.

A meat core temperature of 80°C is btw. the suggestion for infants, pregnant women and immunosuppressed persons to make sure really each and every germ has died - for immunocompetent adults like the game characters even a meat core temperature of only 65°C would most likely be sufficient not to get sick.

I often bake different kinds of meat (including pork, beef, deer and rabbit) at temperatures between 60-65°C in the oven for several hours when I have visitors and no-one ever got sick - the immune system of healthy persons is usually able to deal easily with those very few germs that might survive the low temperature cooking procedure.

Problems may only occur if you roast or cook the meat not long enough so that its core temperature stays below 60°C (or 80°C respectively if you want to be absolutely on the safe side).

Eating a soup that has boiled for an hour or more at 100°C is perfectly safe, even if you use ebola-infected bats and plague-infected rats as ingredients.

From a caloric point of view, I agree to Boston 123. Consuming as much fat as possible with the broth is probably a good idea in a survival situation.

[selfless]

Just a cautionary note on the off topic discussion: Tons of bacteria and other organisms reproduce through spores that are designed to withstand incredible environments. Botulinum is one nasty bug that does not disappear no matter how long you boil it. Its why pressure cookers were invented, to get foods up to 120 degrees C to completely ruin it so food could be preserved without salt or acid or drying.

But it does take a while for those bugs to recover afterward. Consuming freshly cooked food should see them out of your system before they are able to become active once more. Cooking meat you found on the forest floor then waiting a week to actually eat it will still probably kill you...

[cekivi]

Protein poisoning is a real risk in the wilderness but given that frostbite, scurvy, and a host of other diseases/complications that can and do occur in the wild are not being modeled I think we'll be OK without it. It's just one more thing to keep track of that doesn't really change the game much beyond making cooking more of a hassle.