Choose What to Use as Decoy

[WanderingPalm]

I would love to be able to choose what I drop as a Decoy. The way the mechanic currently works is that you drop the Smelliest wolf-edible item in your pack (choosing the lower condition one if two or more have equal Smell). This means that instead of dropping, say, that rancid slab of Raw Venison you've been carrying for exactly that purpose, you instead drop your freshly caught 12lb fish. Or instead of dropping a small chunk of Raw Rabbit, you drop your other, totally unharvested Rabbit Carcass.

Someone else (I'm sorry, I don't remember your name) has suggested that you be able to craft an appropriate item into a specific item called a Decoy/Bait, which would take priority over other items when you drop one--the weight of the initial item would equal the weight of the Decoy produced, so it would serve the same function, except that your crafted Decoys would always be the first ones deployed.

...Also, I would love to be able to catch bunnies and keep them alive, then release them as a Decoy to catch the wolf's attention. But I realize that that's just wishful thinking.  

[Prestermatt]

1 hour ago, WanderingPalm said:

Someone else (I'm sorry, I don't remember your name) has suggested that you be able to craft an appropriate item into a specific item called a Decoy/Bait

That was me.  Thanks for taking this to the official Wish List!

[Prestermatt]

1 hour ago, WanderingPalm said:

Also, I would love to be able to catch bunnies and keep them alive, then release them as a Decoy to catch the wolf's attention.

I wonder which is more cruel: wringing the fluffy bunny's neck right away, or keeping it alive (crammed into the backpack?) just so it can have a last, mad dash ending in a wolf's jaws.

A moving decoy would be interesting, though.

[Lrrr Ruler of OP8]

1 hour ago, WanderingPalm said:

...Also, I would love to be able to catch bunnies and keep them alive, then release them as a Decoy to catch the wolf's attention. But I realize that that's just wishful thinking.  

If you harvest the meat and guts from a rabbit, and leave the pelt (because you already have so many) the corpses still work as bait haha. Silly wolf. 

Definitely agree that this should be a thing. You should either be able to drop items from the radial food menu, or "add items to bait radial"

[Mroz4k]

This should not be just limited to decoys, but to the quickdraw buttons in general. I would like to see a "permanent" setting where you could choose which items the player draws/drops with the particular button. Works for the number 1 as light sources and 2 as weapons... for example, I prefer bows to every other weapon - so I would like to have set bow to be my first weapon drawn if I have one in my inventory, not the rifle. Same thing for torches which I use regularly.

I am sure that a lot of people would have set rabbit carcasses and guts to be on the end of the decoy priority list despite being powerful baits, only because they are so rare.

I dissagree with carrying bunnies around while they are still alive. While it may sound practical when encountered by a wolf, it also seems pretty cruel and in the end it would not be so practical, because the rabbit would be constantly struggling to break free - so that means damaged items in your inventory, possibly a bitten-through hole in your backpack... Trying to bind them would be pointless because they would not be stunned by a stone for too long... this does not sound very realistic. Unless you had a solid, heavy grain bag to stuff the rabbit into... but those would get wet and super heavy real fast, and even that the rabbit would eventually escape.

[Prestermatt]

4 hours ago, Mroz4k said:

I dissagree with carrying bunnies around while they are still alive. While it may sound practical when encountered by a wolf, it also seems pretty cruel and in the end it would not be so practical

Definitely.  To clarify my previous post, when I said "a moving decoy would be interesting", it was in the theoretical sense, not that I thought it would actually be good in the game.

Now, a bunny that I could tame and keep in a hutch in my base and feed rose hips too... hmm...

[WanderingPalm]

On 8/20/2017 at 4:12 AM, Mroz4k said:

This should not be just limited to decoys, but to the quickdraw buttons in general. I would like to see a "permanent" setting where you could choose which items the player draws/drops with the particular button. Works for the number 1 as light sources and 2 as weapons... for example, I prefer bows to every other weapon - so I would like to have set bow to be my first weapon drawn if I have one in my inventory, not the rifle. Same thing for torches which I use regularly.

I am sure that a lot of people would have set rabbit carcasses and guts to be on the end of the decoy priority list despite being powerful baits, only because they are so rare.

I dissagree with carrying bunnies around while they are still alive. While it may sound practical when encountered by a wolf, it also seems pretty cruel and in the end it would not be so practical, because the rabbit would be constantly struggling to break free - so that means damaged items in your inventory, possibly a bitten-through hole in your backpack... Trying to bind them would be pointless because they would not be stunned by a stone for too long... this does not sound very realistic. Unless you had a solid, heavy grain bag to stuff the rabbit into... but those would get wet and super heavy real fast, and even that the rabbit would eventually escape.

Absolutely agree with all of this. For controller-playing people, I would be happy with being able to set the order of items used when I bring out a light source, since I can't hotkey things (although we could do it the way FFXIV does, where all buttons have a different purpose when you click them while holding down a specific button -- like how holding the Fn key on your keyboard works.). In addition to this, I would love to be apply to specify things like what weapon to use in case of a wolf attack OUTSIDE of the panic-inducing combat. Yes, I know that I have time to select what I want at the beginning of a struggle, but even after wrestling with one wolf three times over the course of ten (real world) minutes, I cannot get my body and brain to accept that fact. Just let me tell the game to use my axe by default. So yes, I am all for letting the player designate item-priority.

As for the bunnies, I'm actually surprised people talked about it. I knew it was completely unreasonable and unrealistic, but it made me chuckle. Really I was thinking of the game Don't Starve, which has rabbit ear-muffs that are shown as using two live bunnies, which I always thought were then strapped to your head, then combined it with the idea of decoys in The Long Dark. Absolutely a joke suggestion on my part! I just wanted to share that mental image.

[Mroz4k]

I am pretty sure you are supposed to choose what to use each time, to punish players who are indecisive or slow and dont select on time. At the same time, the time to choose your weapon should be shorter, to fully simulate the fact that you need to act fast or at least anticipate the struggle in the first place. 

[Prestermatt]

4 minutes ago, Mroz4k said:

I am pretty sure you are supposed to choose what to use each time, to punish players who are indecisive or slow and dont select on time. At the same time, the time to choose your weapon should be shorter, to fully simulate the fact that you need to act fast or at least anticipate the struggle in the first place. 

How about an overlay to choose when you see a wolf approaching you, then?  Sometimes you have plenty of time to prepare, but can't choose until the wolf actually gets you.  I know I would be getting my hatchet out ASAP, even if I still hoped to avoid the struggle.

[Mroz4k]

No, because I dont think it would be a wise idea to have a notification of this sort present - some people are careless and wont realize they are being stalked until the wolf is upon them. And sometimes it happens just so fast anyways, when the wolf surprises you... so this would be sort of a warning.

Most people carry their tools either in a backpack or on them. Maybe not in the case of a knife, which is easy to strap to a belt, but a crowbar, hatchet or a hammer are tools mostly carried on a backpack, so not easily accessible. We cant select to hold a tool in the hand already, I suppose that would be one way to do it, but if that is so, it should be done by "selecting" it in for equiping it in an inventory, not through any sort of hotkey.
If I knew I was going through a dangerous location beforehand, I would be holding an axe in my left hand and a burning torch in my right hand, but that is going into it too realistically. Let us be happy we get to even chose what tool to use for a self-defense, and that it isnt just fists all the time.

[Prestermatt]

14 minutes ago, Mroz4k said:

No, because I dont think it would be a wise idea to have a notification of this sort present - some people are careless and wont realize they are being stalked until the wolf is upon them. And sometimes it happens just so fast anyways, when the wolf surprises you... so this would be sort of a warning.

I get that you still want the element of surprise there when you don't see the wolf coming, and then the quick, frantic choice of a weapon is appropriate.

But when you can clearly see the wolf approaching you straight ahead, growling and pacing slowly towards you... it just seems like that would be a good opportunity to choose a weapon and gain that extra second of advantage in the struggle.  We can ready a rifle or a bow in those situations, why not a hatchet?

[Mroz4k]

1 minute ago, Prestermatt said:

I get that you still want the element of surprise there when you don't see the wolf coming, and then the quick, frantic choice of a weapon is appropriate.

But when you can clearly see the wolf approaching you straight ahead, growling and pacing slowly towards you... it just seems like that would be a good opportunity to choose a weapon and gain that extra second of advantage in the struggle.  We can ready a rifle or a bow in those situations, why not a hatchet?

 

19 minutes ago, Mroz4k said:

Most people carry their tools either in a backpack or on them. Maybe not in the case of a knife, which is easy to strap to a belt, but a crowbar, hatchet or a hammer are tools mostly carried on a backpack, so not easily accessible. We cant select to hold a tool in the hand already, I suppose that would be one way to do it, but if that is so, it should be done by "selecting" it in for equiping it in an inventory, not through any sort of hotkey.

This would simulate you preparing yourself in advance.

[Prestermatt]

12 minutes ago, Mroz4k said:

This would simulate you preparing yourself in advance.

That would do it.  And if you have a weapon equipped, you use it in the struggle.  If not, then frantic choice.

What about using the rifle as a melee weapon, if it's equipped? 

[WanderingPalm]

The reason I suggested letting us prioritize which tools to use is for several situations. When repairing clothing, for example, it tends to default to your highest condition sewing kit--I want it to default to my lowest. When starting fires, it defaults to certain items, but I usually want to use my matches before wearing down my firestriker, and have to change it every time. When harvesting cloth from curtains, it defaults to using my knife when I always use my hands instead. When opening a can, it automatically uses whatever tool I have instead of smashing it open, even when I have the perk to smash cans with 0 loss. Why shouldn't I be allowed to specify those things in advance?

As for wolf attacks and weapons, I see it more as designating your fighting tool and making sure it is always easily at hand. If I never leave home without my axe and always use it in a fight against a wolf, why not default to that as my weapon? I'm clearly keeping it for that very reason--probably hanging in a hammer loop on my pants. Why would I instead default to the knife, which, as far as I am concerned, it inside my pack, given how often I use it. If my axe is my weapon of choice, it would never be far from my hand anyway. Besides, fighting with the occasional controller-input lag or holding the thumb stick just slightly too long and passing your preferred selection is also incredibly frustrating and unrealistic.

But this really would be better addressed as adding the struggle-weapons to the weapon button and radial. The weapons should show up at that struggle screen on an automatic radial menu, so you can just immediately hold the thumb stick left and use that item instead of having to scroll through options to what you want. Or I should be able to hit the button (or key for computer players) out of combat and cycle through melee weapons the same way you can for firearms. And we should be able to prioritize items for the purpose of the order they show up in; as someone else noted, the animation for the flare gun is obnoxiously lengthy when you are simply trying to cycle past it, not use it. This was the original idea, after all-- introducing the ability to change the order in which items are chosen, specifically so that you can drop the bait you want.

Realistically, this would mean keeping the first items in your list more accessible than later ones-- like keeping items you intend to use on your person, and spares inside your backpack. It's actually LESS realistic now, when everything is apparently at my fingertips and equally easy to access (why else would I be digging the 12 pound fish out of my pack to use as a decoy when I have a nice fist-sized piece of meat I could easily have put in my jacket pocket?).