UpUpAway95

All for 100% random loot, including matches on Interloper.  If they think it's too tough, then I'd like a specific toggle in the custom menu to include/exclude 1 box of matches and another separate toggle to include/exclude a bedroll in the players inventory.  That is, I'd like to see these two items singled out rather than included/excluded together in the Starting Gear Allocation setting.  That is, players starting with better clothing being able to opt to start without matches or without a bedroll if they so desire.

On 4/7/2021 at 2:32 PM, odium said:

If the fire is burning, the door makes no difference!

 

mending is the hardest for me.  im not going to burn cloth on loper just to level a skill

I always feels safer from attack when the door is closed.  It has nothing to do with keeping the fire going and everything to do with making the place feel cozy.

There's no way that should still be classed as "tinder" as well.  We should be able to make a canoe with that.

It depends on the difficulty.  After playing several very short runs in Broken Railroad only (a small zone where I've been specifically studying the game's loot patterns), it appears that some corpses are scripted to provide knives and hatchets to the player when the difficulty settings allow for these items in the game.  Of course, in Interloper-type settings (i.e. Baseline Resources set to "Low"), these particular corpses will always be empty.  Also, the specific locations of these corpses changes with the run.  In Broken railroad, there is one corpse that is scripted to provide a knife and that corpse will appear in one of three locations with each and every run (based on Baseline Resources = "Very High")  There is another corpse that is scripted to provide a bow and a single arrow and it always appears where there is a prop deer nearby, with a broken arrow in it.  In Broken Arrow (again, when baseline resources = "very high"), this corpse will appear in one of three locations, but it will always appear.  When the Baseline Resources is set to "low," this corpse likely still appears, but it will be empty.

ETA:  I should also add that the "Dropped Items" setting also impacts on this pattern.

5 hours ago, Lycrist said:

I actually suggested to have a headache which lasts for 2 hours which would prevent a player from reading research books. Yeah. That's only minor. So is pain. But you don't see anyone arguing to remove pain because it has no meaningful impact.

Headache would just add some cheap flavour to the gameplay. Nothing more than some unquality of life. Also keep in mind that a headache is on of the first signs of serious dehydration iRL.

I also said, that there could be a dehydration debuff (with a risk building up over time if the player stay dehydrated) which has more severe consequences but that would be more than just a flavour update.

I've actually seen lots of posts over the years unhappy with the pain mechanic - mostly in conjunction with sprains and how easily they are "cured" by popping pain killerrs and a bandage.  Presumeably, a headache would be something logically curable with pain killers, so the impact and annoyance factor would be on par with sprains.  I don't agree with adding "cheap flavor" to the game... quality flavor is better.

22 hours ago, odizzido said:

From actual experience, digging into the ground with a shovel when everything is frozen is really difficult. I tried to find out what you could mean by looking up pictures of a bivouac but I don't understand what you would need a shovel for yet.

I don't think the OP is suggesting digging into the frozen ground, but digging into the snow.  However, it doesn't appear as the snow in the game is generally deep enough (i.e. the grass pokes through in many places) and snow drifts don't appear in areas where they logically should.  We do have some plow ridges along the roads, but that snow would be inordinately packed and hard to dig.

OP - IRL, I think the game's set peice/environment has not been coded in such a way that it can be altered by the player.  Lots of people have asked for the ability to chop down the trees and Hinterland has responded along the lines of that requiring that the whole game be rebuilt from scratch.  The snow shelter is meant to be something of a bivouac, but the mechanic is to place it above the ground.  They could simply add that a tool (the shovel) be required to build it, but that would just serve to discourage people further from using it... since it already is a finicky to place due to it's rather large footb=print.

My guess is they weren't "good girls" and are off somewhere having their fawns. 😁

1 hour ago, Lycrist said:

Yeah. I fully agree that there should be no more micromanagement on certain "thrist levels" like the OP suggested. Headache risk should only start when the bar is empty. I don't know and actually don't think if there should be some kind of dehydration affliction. If, it should probably work like the food poison affliction: quickly depletion of condition and fatigue till healed.

 

You're still not addressing the fact that getting a headache really doesn't add anything to the game.  It's even stated in the Wiki that it is meant to be merely "an annoyance."  So, again... why are we asking Hinterland to add more "annoyances" to the game?  Won't that just make the game more annoying rather than more challenging in a meaningful way?  They would have to add something more to the consequences of having a headache in the game... something that would cause the player to pause and have to reconsider their planned activities.  The current effect on the screen is really nothing more than momentarily annoying.  If that can't be done, then there is really no point to changing it away from the way it currently is IMO.  The current system IS simplified, but it works in game.  It sounds like you have more of an issue with how easily water is obtained.  This could be made more difficult simply by having each can of melted snow return only 15% of a can of water (which is more in line with the actual moisture content of snow).

34 minutes ago, Lycrist said:

@UpUpAway95 yeah. Don't get me wrong. I do not agree with the OP that negative effects of thirst should start at x% above 0%. All I was saying is that carry weight-drop is dynamic (below 50%).

However I disagree with the rest of your argument: Yes, you do lose HP for having your thrist bar depleted. But you also lose HP for having an empty warmth bar - but hypotherima is still a thing Hypothermia. Having it empty for too long will have even more severe consequences. I don't see why there has to be a difference compared to thirst.
The bar is empty. Dehydration risk boils up. When it reaches 100% you get a headache.

Hypothermia risk only kicks in after the warmth bar hits 0%.  It is also a major effect, not a minor one like headache.  You did misunderstand my statement about the fatigue bar.  Yes, it kicks in with an effect at 50%; however, it has more of a meaningful impact than a headache does because it can prevent a player from climbing a rope or from getting back onto a rope if they spent too long on a ledge without sleeping.  I would prefer, however, that it kick in at 0% rather than the 50% line so that players would not so compelled to micromanage their fatigue during the day while climbing.  However, making that adjustment would also make the game a lot easier overall, which is something that probably would not go over well at this point.

The overall point is that there should be an acceptable balance maintained here.  Do we really want a game where we are required to micormanage all of the character's bodily functions?  Does it make it really more challenging... or does it make it just more tedious and frustrating?

I could acccept your version... headache at 0% with a mounting risk of dehydration... but there would have to be a more meaningful impact on what you can and cannot do while you have a headache and a long-term impact for having actual dehydration.  Something like... perhaps... the health bar doesn't deplete, but you have no health recovery for a few days until you become properly rehydrated (which would take more than one drink)... i.e. then maintaining the thirst bar above 50% for 48 hours or more?

1 hour ago, Lycrist said:

That's actually a thing, you know?
Carry weight drops by x with every y% under 50%.

Anyways: I agree that effects should only start once the bar is competly empty.

Above 50% it doesn't drop at all... what I was going on about would be changing it to drop 1% every 5% drop, period, so that people carrying close to the max would have to micromanage their loads in order to, say, climb a rope... even if they had just slept and started with the meter at 100%.  The thirst meter is at 0% when the game decides you are dehydrated and starts to penalize you by causing you to lose HP.  It's simple and it works.  The game just says you're just sufficiently hydrated right up until the moment in time when you become dehydrated.   I really don't see a point to introducing a minor effect (headache) into the mix just to force people to micromanage the meter at 50%-  IRL, we don't have to be constantly sucking on a straw to stay adequately hydrated.  We can go a couple of hours without taking a drink.  This would only make the player have the character drink small amounts of water more frequently instead of drinking larger amount when the meter gets close to or at 0%.  If that's what's wanted, do we introduce the bathroom breaks too?... or, shouldn't some aspects of realism just be skipped over in the interest of keeping the game moving along rather than making it a never-ending source of day-to-day tedium?

This sounds like forced micromanagement of a health stat to me.  The effect of becoming dehydrated in the game currently is lost health.  Let it go long enough and you'll die, which is a pretty long-lasting (i.e. permanent) effect.  The dehydration indicated by 0% on the meter is already an arbitrary limit... above that, you are hydrated and below that you are dehydrated.

Now you're asking that we pay attention to the 30% line to avoid getting a headache (which is a pretty benign effect in the game anyways).  I don't see the point.  What's next?  We have to watch for every 5% drop in any of the meters?  Carry weight drops by 1% with every 5% drop in the fatigue meter?  Shivering starts when the temperature bar reaches 50% and the effects last until you've stood by a fire for an hour in game, etc., etc.?  How "fussy" do we really want to make this game?  Drink too much water and the character has to stop for bathroom breaks?

I would rather see them extend the current options in custom mode (which is, IMO, an official "difficulty" mode of the game since the options are offered by the devs, not through player-made mods).  They could ad a "Very High" setting to the "World Gets colder Over Time"   Currently, the player can get the weather to be a little more brutal than the current interloper settings by increasing the "Wind Variability" setting from "Medium" to "High" (one notch above the current interloper setting) and set the game to Endless Night.

I don't think the beef should be with the temperatures though... clearly the clothing buff given by the bear skin coat and bedroll is more the issue that takes the "teeth" out of the weather in the later interloper game.  If players want to suffer the cold more, they can simply refrain from running around the game in double bearskin coats rather than asking the devs to make the weather colder... which would then likely be followed by a request for a warmer coat item to be put in the game to counter that cold... setting off a vicious circle... along with a whole new slew of posts about how the game lacks realism.

They could, for roleplay, also add an option the disallows the player from  climbing into a bed fully dressed... compelling them to at least take off their boots, gloved, toques, and overcoats... although the serious player can make this sort of a thing a habit on their own.  It does make a fire more necessary to stay warm throughout the night indoors.

ETA:  No one would say that customizing one's character in an RPG by assigning the offered skill points at the beginning of the game differently would suddenly make that playthrough of "unofficial" difficulty, even though the playthrough can be made much easier or more difficult depending on where those points are placed.  The only difference with TLD is we can't adjust the character's profile, so we're given a set of parameters we can adjust regarding the environment.  IMO, both are equally "official" ways of playing games.

I usually find carrying cans of spray paint around to be just so much dead weight.  I do occasionally use them to put otherwise unmarked locations on the map - e.g. the prepper caches, if found, in Mystery Lake or Pleasant Valley.  In this case, it reminds me that I have found them if I'm away from the run for awhile.  I usually use the "storage" symbol in this case.

I have occasionally used the arrows to mark trails in areas where I still get lost; but I generally don't have a can of spray paint on me so, more often than not, I just use arrangements of sticks or stones.  To mark buildings I've already searched (like in Mountain Town), I leave a tinder plug just outside the door.  For cars, I leave the hoods down, but turn the visors down.  Combined with the fact that I tend to search in the same sort of sequence during each run, if I spot just one visor or one tinder plug, I'm usually pretty sure I've gone through the entire area.

This setting is completely adjustable in the custom menu... actually 2 settings would affect it:

Wildlife Smell Range can be varied from Low (where it is set in Pilgrim) to High (where it is set in both Stalker and Interloper).  It can even be pushed to Very High (one setting beyond where it is at in Interloper)

Scent Increase from Meat Blood is currently set at Medium for all Standard Difficulties, but can be varied from None to High.

Therefore, it is not universally OP.  Rather, it just means you personally don't like where they have the setting in whatever standard difficulty mode you're playing in.  Why not try a custom game?

3 hours ago, ajb1978 said:

It's based on number of fish caught, not weight. Catching 10 lake whitefish at Mystery Lake will get you from Level 1 to 2 the same as catching 10 Coho Salmon at Coastal Highway.

Hmm... I didn't think this was the case.  It has always seemed to  go quicker when I've done it on the coast.  Must just be my luck then, so  I stand corrected.   Thanks.

In light of the discussion, I've rethought my original answer since all skills seem to increase by 1 point with each successful action.  This means that repair is the skill I've probably never gotten to 100 during a regular run.  It's not a major skill, so I basically never think to actively try to level it.

2 hours ago, darkscaryforest said:

That makes me sad. I'm still at level 2 hoping it was going to get better.

For me it's definitely gunsmithing since I have avoided Bleak Inlet in the last few of my runs. I'm not good enough at Interloper to go there yet 😅. I assume you can still make bullets in Interloper, just can't fire them haha

If you fish in Coastal Highway or Bleak Inlet, it does go a little bit faster because the level up for fishing is based on weight, IIRC... and the salt-water fish are generally larger than the fresh-water ones found in Mystery Lake, Pleasant Valley, and Timberwolf Mountain.  The higher your level, the average weight of your catch is higher (not necessarily the number of fish you catch).

It's still a long haul, particularly when fishing spawns are set to low (interloper setting is medium, BTW), but doable if you take some time to stockpile wood and coal at a fishing hut with a door (which keeps you safe) and make sure you have a bedroll and lots of line and hooks with you.  You can cook and make water all day long as you fish and keep the fire going at night to stay warm as you sleep.

As for making bullets in interloper... you'll need to find casings and those are in short supply.  Good luck finding enough to get you to level 5 when you can only use each casing once.  If going for the Level 5 in all skills achievement, it is best done in any mode other than interloper.  Achievements can also be completed in a custom mode.  Only feats do not progress in custom.

1 hour ago, ajb1978 said:

Definitely Mending. The number of successful repairs to reach level 5 is just absurd. Even on a Pilgrim game actively repairing every article of clothing you find in the game up to 100%, you will literally run out of cloth and leather before you reach level 5. (Edit: Unless you're actively ripping up every curtain and towel in the universe.) It's absolutely ridiculous. The only way to reach Level 5 is to deliberately rip up perfectly good clothing in order to repair other stuff from 99% to 100%. 

Specifically the jump from Level 4 to 5. Getting from Level 1 to 2 requires 25 successful repairs which is OK. Then to level 3, 50 more successful repairs. Still not bad. The leap from 3 to 4 requires 100, which is getting to be a bit much but follows the simple pattern of "every level requires twice as many repairs as the previous." And then going from 4 to 5 continues this pattern, requiring a whopping 200 successful repairs. That's almost an order of magnitude what it took you to get to level 2!!

Compare to say Archery, where 150 total successes puts you at Level 5 outright. Or Rifle Firearm where it's only 100. Mending is just way off target.

This, for sure.  I don't really understand why they demand so many more successful attempts to get mending to level 5 than the other skills... but it is what it is, I guess.

I had a wolf follow me into the Spence's forge area recently as well.  It didn't follow me up the plank ramp though.

@Cranky - I haven't had one follow me into the fishing huts yet, but I haven't done much wolf sniping from those huts lately.  I wouldn't trust it.

12 hours ago, Syraith said:

I was actually surprised they didn’t offer the standard difficulty settings when starting them. A couple I think are fine with a default difficulty but others seem like they’d be fun to try on harder settings.

I"m sure their reasoning ties into the scripted events that occur within these challenges.  The Hunted, for example, is totally  incompatible with standard Pilgrim Mode.  As another example... interloper blizzard frequency is totally incompatible with The Whiteout challenge.  The standard difficulty modes are also not linear increases in difficulty.  Instead, they also change the balance of the game.  Stalker, in some ways, is more difficult than interloper.  They would have to rebalance each difficulty setting offered for each challenge separately.  That's a lot of work for what amounts to a meaningless badge (for all challenges so far except Darkwalker, which gives a feat).

@Mig_zvmI'm all for adding more Custom settings into the Survival mode game.  It's the scripted events within the Challenges that I can't see working well with the variability of the custom settings.  Imagine a Whiteout challenge if someone turns the Blizzard Frequency setting to None while jacking up all the wolf agression settings and spawns to the max.  The challenge then would be more than challenging... it would be impossible to complete because the big blizzard couldn't happen.  HInterland could add in other difficulty settings for any or all of the challenges, but I do think they have to maintain, in this case, control of the challenge's balance to ensure the scripted events work at any difficulty the player could select.  We don't have "custom" story mode either... likely for the same reasons.

I'm a big advocate for custom options in the main survival game and for allowing feat progression to occur in Custom survial playthroughs.  However, where the scripted challenges are concerned, I don't think they should be added/allowed.  As @ManicManiacstated... stepping up to the set challenge is the point.  Certainly, Hinterlands could create catagories for the challenges and classify them into groups (e.g. Easy, Medium, and Hard).  Since only one challenge involves a tangible reward in the form of a feat, this would only be a cosmetic indicator to the player of the relative level of challenge the player is undertaking.  If they want to continue to award feats related to challenges and not attainable within the main game, they should then perhaps have different levels of the same feats available (e.g. the ones attained in Easy Challenges giving the same type of perk as the one attained in Harder challenges, but not providing the same degree of benefit... say, a 1% boost to X if earned in an easy challenge and a 2% boost to X if earned in a hard challenge.  Hard ones would overwrite the Easy counterparts.

All that said, I don't think it's really practical for them to change the "system" at this point in time.  It might better be something they consider for TLD2.

23 minutes ago, Dr. S. said:

I think it depends a lot on the settings. In my current interloper run, I'm actually ahead in mending compared to fishing, and it's not because I've neglected fishing. Even at level 4 fishing, the catch rate is well under one fish per hour.

Still, you can grind through a lot of in-game hours in a fishing hut with a door as long as you bring a supply of fishing tackle and wood with you since each hour of fishing is sped up (as in passing time).  it's a great way to get your blizzard walker feat at the same time since it is considered to be outdoors yet is sheltered so that your fire will never go out.

Your video brought to mind part of a poem that I read a long time ago and that has stuck with me.  It's about two climbers and entitled "David" by Earle Birney.

"There it was David who spied to the south, remote.  And unmapped, a sunlit spire on Sawback, an overhang Crooked like a talon.  David named it the Finger.

That day we chanced on the skull and the splayed white ribs of a mountain goat underneath a cliff-face, caught tight on a rock.  Around were the silken feathers of kites.  And that was the first I knew that a goat could slip."

The full poem can be found here:  https://rpo.library.utoronto.ca/poems/david

... and an image of The Finger (in the Sawback Range, Alberta, Canada) can be found here:

http://peakfinder.com/peaks/480

Definitely mending.  I've only gotten it to Level 5 once just for the sake of getting the achievement for maxing out all skills.  My strategy is to just not worry about it.  I repair things only when they need repairing and "suffer" the failed attempts as they happen.  Following a close second (or perhaps even a tie) is gunsmithing because I can't be bothered scrapping batteries and hauling lead around as long as I have sufficient found ammo to get the job done.

1 hour ago, Mistral said:

Re: my previous post, perhaps in hindsight the most logical/realistic take on wolfs would actually be having no regular wolves at all, so setting at "none". Timberwolves could either remain at "low" or even go as high as "high".

This way you could theoretically mimic a real regional wolf population which is concentrated on specific area (Bleak Inlet) and which works in packs, rather than bunch of random lone wolfs roaming all around the Great Bear.

Also, one could argue on having bears either on "low" or "none", because of the hibernation.

This would probably be more realistic.  I think bears should be a "low" because they do break their hibernation from time to time for short periods... although one can't change their AI to avoid them wandering about for most of the day and night and only sleeping for very short periods.  Aurora frequency can be quite high during the winter months (just not noticeable in areas where there is a lot of light pollution).  However, the unrealistic reaction of the animals in the game can't be changed by the player, so I would almost be inclined to set the frequency of the aurora to None if realism was my primary objective.

I don't see how it can since the water you find is mixed in with the water you make in your inventory.  I can't remember worrying about it when I got that achievement, but if you want to play it absolutely safe, just avoid picking up any water bottles for the 25 days.