Allow achievements and feat progression on custom

[JezusCrustPizza]

Most people aren't going to care whether or not you get achievements on custom difficulty but I for one really wish you did. I've always been about making progress and getting gamer score and unlocking the feats. I don't think you should get them if you set the game to the easiest settings. There should be a line where it's considered difficult enough to still include achievements and feat progression or not. The reason I want to still get progression through custom difficulty is because I love parts of interloper and parts of stalker but interloper itself is too hard and stalker itself is too easy. If I could use a custom difficulty and still get achievements it would make this game much more enjoyable for me and whoever else may think like this. 

[Jack02517]

yup. if you where on stalker or harder i think we should be able to get achievements.

[UpUpAway95]

You can get achievements on a custom difficulty.  It's only the feats you can't get and feats have nothing to do with your gamerscore.  Nothing is stopping you from getting either on higher difficulties.  What skin is it off your back if someone else gets them on an easier difficulty?  Answer:  None... it doesn't affect you in any way.  TLD is a single-player game.  As it is, the feats are just long and grindy and many of the achievements are the same.  If people don't want to waste 100s of hours trying to grind out 1000 fires on interloper and then die at fire 999, they shouldn't be "forced" to by other "jealous" players who want to do that for themselves.  Nothing about the difficulty at which I play my SP games should concern you.

Custom settings make difficulty levels meaningless anyways.  I could use a stalker base template and change one setting, turning wolf spawning right off, and completely change the nature of that difficulty.

However, I do agree that feats should also be available in Custom.

[JezusCrustPizza]

I don't know why you are saying that I would be jealous or forcing them to earn their feats and achievements on a harder difficulty. I also don't understand why you think that it is I that care whether or not they get them through an easy difficulty. Hinterland are the ones who would care and that's why you can't unlock feats on custom in the first place. Because people could just set the mode to the easiest settings, easier than pilgrim, and get them. I am not jealous or trying to force anything on anyone, you can get the feats on pilgrim already anyways which is far too easy. I think you misunderstood my post completely. And your aggressive behavior was completely uncalled for. Your difficulty level doesn't mean a hot damn to me, you can play with everything hostile to you turned off and I wouldn't care in the slightest. But of course you shouldn't be able to unlock feats or achievements if you are doing that as it would be too easy, which I'm guessing that Hinterland agree with that based on their decision to turn feats off in the first place. And I didn't realize that you could unlock achievements on custom difficulty that is my bad there.

 

[UpUpAway95]

25 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

I don't know why you are saying that I would be jealous or forcing them to earn their feats and achievements on a harder difficulty. I also don't understand why you think that it is I that care whether or not they get them through an easy difficulty. Hinterland are the ones who would care and that's why you can't unlock feats on custom in the first place. Because people could just set the mode to the easiest settings, easier than pilgrim, and get them. I am not jealous or trying to force anything on anyone, you can get the feats on pilgrim already anyways which is far too easy. I think you misunderstood my post completely. And your aggressive behavior was completely uncalled for. Your difficulty level doesn't mean a hot damn to me, you can play with everything hostile to you turned off and I wouldn't care in the slightest. But of course you shouldn't be able to unlock feats or achievements if you are doing that as it would be too easy, which I'm guessing that Hinterland agree with that based on their decision to turn feats off in the first place. And I didn't realize that you could unlock achievements on custom difficulty that is my bad there.

 

You did say "I don't think you should get them if you set the game to the easiest settings."  Why say that then unless you do care that other people are getting those feats and achievements easier than you are playing on a harder difficulty?  It's that statement of yours that gave me the idea. 

It shouldn't matter at all how easy they might want to make it on themselves.  It doesn't change or affect or prevent what you're doing making it harder on yourself.  Since feats are only used in the game itself, why shouldn't a person be able to unlock them on whatever difficulty they want just as much as they can or might want to use them on the same difficulty levels they obtained them?  Maybe that person has a physical disability that makes it harder for them to play generally than you.  So, again, why try to "force them" to play at a higher difficulty just to gain access to a difficulty adjustment that affects only themselves in their own game?

Achievements do affect gamescore... but one person's gamescore doesn't affect anything to do with yours.  It no longer gives access to any real Microsoft disocunts the way it used to (I play on Xbox One).  It's only a cosmetic thing between me and my personal friends. on my friends list.  So again, what does it matter to you what difficulty I get them on?  It doesn't prevent you from getting them on whatever difficulty you like.

I could them changing to say that achievements can't be obtained in custom mode, just on the Pilgrim, Voyageur, Stalker and Interloper modes.  But if you want to be able to get them in custom because you want to make it harder on yourself than stalker but easier on interloper... why shouldn't a person be able to take a Pilgrim template and adjust some custom settings in a way that, say, makes some aspects of the game easier and others harder and get the achievements and feats just like you.  How are you going to "police" what individual adjustments make the game easier or harder for every person in a "custom" mode?  If I took every custom slider to the easiest position and then slid just one to a harder position (ever by just one click) would that then satisfy not playing the game on the easiest settings and, therefore, qualify under your proposal for achievements and feats?

[JezusCrustPizza]

I already clarified that your difficulty setting doesn't matter to me, pilgrim or interloper. But I don't think that everything good set to max and everything bad set to none should grant people achievements or feats as that is just too easy of a difficulty. It isn't even about people being unable to play on a harder difficulty at that point, it's just about abusing a system for game progression, which I do very much care about.

[UpUpAway95]

17 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

I already clarified that your difficulty setting doesn't matter to me, pilgrim or interloper. But I don't think that everything good set to max and everything bad set to none should grant people achievements or feats as that is just too easy of a difficulty. It isn't even about people being unable to play on a harder difficulty at that point, it's just about abusing a system for game progression, which I do very much care about.

How is arbitrarily "abusing a system for game progression" when you have no idea what their individual motives are.  As I suggested, they could have a disability that makes it difficult for them to just even play a videogame.  Again, how does their progression affect you anyways?  It's 100% a single-player game and they aren't competing with you in any way.   Why do you care?

ETA:  There are already specific achievements that have to be obtained on specific "default" difficulties - e.g. the 24-hour on Interloper one and all of the ones related to Wintermute and any of the challenges.  The devs could just make all new achievements pertinent to specific default difficulties rather than putting up any more of the grindy ones they have now.  That would be my preference.

[JezusCrustPizza]

A person stealing a candy bar is wrong and doesn't affect me in any way but I still care about it. Why do I care is a good question, I just do. It's wrong. It shouldn't happen. And let's be real here, someone with a disability doesn't need to play on a difficulty that easy. Pilgrim is a good level for whoever it may be that's playing, and if they really want to play on something easier the option is still there anyways.

[UpUpAway95]

16 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

A person stealing a candy bar is wrong and doesn't affect me in any way but I still care about it. Why do I care is a good question, I just do. It's wrong. It shouldn't happen. And let's be real here, someone with a disability doesn't need to play on a difficulty that easy. Pilgrim is a good level for whoever it may be that's playing, and if they really want to play on something easier the option is still there anyways.

You don't know what a person with a disability might need.  A person who steals a candy bar is hurting someone other than themselves... the person they are stealing from.  A person who advances their own progression in a single-player videogame is not hurting anyone.  They are merely exercising their right to play a single-player game in their own way.   If you have a "right" to make things more difficult for yourself just because you want to, they have the same degree of rights to make things easier on themselves if they want to.  Ultimately, the devs control just how easy those easiest settings are allowed to become.  Everyone should be allowed to use those sliders to the maximum ranges the devs set without restrictions being imposed just because some people what to make settings easier and others want to make them harder.

[JezusCrustPizza]

Well then they can play the game their own way, I'm not stopping them and don't want to. Just without getting the achievements or feats

[UpUpAway95]

8 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

Well then they can play the game their own way, I'm not stopping them and don't want to. Just without getting the achievements or feats

If they can't get achievements or feats on custom, then it should be that no one gets achievements or feats on custom.  If anyone can get feats and achievements on custom, then everyone should be able to get feats and achievements on custom.  Simple as that.  All players should be treated equally.

[JezusCrustPizza]

I don't agree, but I'm not going to argue about it any longer like we're in a YouTube comments section. There is no way to make you change your opinion and you aren't going to change mine. If they do introduce feat progression in custom difficulties, I don't think you should be able to progress in them if you have anything lower than pilgrim would be. The easy difficulty part wasn't the main point of the post anyways so we really shouldn't be arguing over that at all. I'd take complete feat progression in custom over no feat progression any day.

[UpUpAway95]

1 minute ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

I don't agree, but I'm not going to argue about it any longer like we're in a YouTube comments section. There is no way to make you change your opinion and you aren't going to change mine. If they do introduce feat progression in custom difficulties, I don't think you should be able to progress in them if you have anything lower than pilgrim would be. The easy difficulty part wasn't the main point of the post anyways so we really shouldn't be arguing over that at all. I'd take complete feat progression in custom over no feat progression any day.

If the devs feel that the settings on those sliders that are easier than pilgrim make the game too easy, they should eliminate those settings entirely from the sliders so that no one can use them.  Again, ALL players should be treated equally.  Simple as that.

[JezusCrustPizza]

Not arguing anymore.

 

[UpUpAway95]

19 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

Not arguing anymore.

 

Not arguing either.... just stating my opinion and why I feel that way.  If Pilgrim is to be the easiest "acceptable" difficulty level for feats and achievements, then no individual aspect of the game should ever be easier than it is on Pilgrim.  People who play on stalker level difficulty everywhere else should not, for example, be able to reduce their risk of sprains to 0% and still get achievements because that would make that aspect of the game easier than it is on Pilgrim.  I'm simply not buying into the idea that it's only people who set all the sliders to their easiest level who MIGHT be 'abusing the system for the sake of game progression.'

[JezusCrustPizza]

You misunderstood me again. I said anything lower than pilgrim would be, and setting your sprains to 0 would be lower than pilgrim. And what about the people with disabilities who need easier than pilgrim. But oh, for arguments sake lets just say we don't need that anymore..  

[BareSkin]

I have to agree. I played only Interloper+ customs, and I can't see a good reason to get the feats moving up when any Pilgrim will do.

I had to wait for 4DON to get Fire Master...

[UpUpAway95]

17 hours ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

You misunderstood me again. I said anything lower than pilgrim would be, and setting your sprains to 0 would be lower than pilgrim. And what about the people with disabilities who need easier than pilgrim. But oh, for arguments sake lets just say we don't need that anymore..  

You've continuously indicated that what you cared about were people to set everything to the easiest settings.  As far as people with disabilities, I'm still basically advocating for equal treatment of all players, including them.  I don't like to see people arbitrarily accuse other people of doing something wrong without proof... and, as I said, you have no idea whether a person who sets everything to the easiest setting is doing so to milk the system... but that's exactly what you accused them of.

IF Pilgrim is to be the easiest "acceptable" setting for feats and achievements in the devs estimation, they should just eliminate any settings on the sliders that are easier than Pilgrim.   No one, therefore, would be able ot play with any setting easier than Pilgrim and, therefore, would not be able to get feats and achievements on anything with any individual aspect easier than Pilgrim.  This would disadvantage people with disabilities and make the entire game less accessible for them.  I would then be advocating on their behalf for an easier standard difficulty than Pilgrim on which they could still qualify to get feats and achievements.  Feats and achievements should be equally accessible to all players... regardless of the difficulty on which they play.

If using a legitimate setting offered by a game is "wrong" for some players, it's "wrong" for all players and should not be in the game.  I don't think it's "wrong" to use the sliders all set to their easiest settings... because those settings have been put there by the devs... i.e they are not a hack or a mod.  Every player should be free to use them as long as they are there and in any way the want (without hacking or modding) and be entitled to the same benefits as anyone else who uses them... regardless of whether or not they are used altogether or individually.  If you give feats and achievements to any custom settings, they should apply to all possible custom settings.  If you don't want to be universal in that, then take away the individual custom settings easier than they are set on Pilgrim or take away the feats and achievements from all custom games.  Don't create two different "classes" of players.

[JezusCrustPizza]

Look I love this whole include every gamer thing you have going but it really doesn't matter that much. Including minorities is great but it's not like this is some real life racial or gender or disability issue where they're being discriminated against for being a minority. Under pilgrim is too easy to reward feat progression. Just like in other games, you must play on certain difficulties to unlock things. Would you say that gamers with disabilities are being unfairly treated because they cannot unlock an ornament from For Honor's story mode because it is too hard? It's not much different here. Feats and achievements should not be equally accessible to all players regardless of the difficulty on which they play. Higher risk higher reward. Not that there is any risk in the first place, in pilgrim animals won't even attack you unless you attack them.

Not that this is a very meaningful argument because it's really just a guess but... Think about how little people care about the feats. Now think about how little people there are that play this game that would need a difficulty under pilgrim because of some sort of disability.  Now think about how many people fit both of those categories. And as much as I love getting achievements and feats, I'm just happy to play the game. It really isn't that big of a deal and I don't think other people including those with disability's would think so either. It's such a minuscule thing. 

[UpUpAway95]

6 hours ago, BareSkin said:

I have to agree. I played only Interloper+ customs, and I can't see a good reason to get the feats moving up when any Pilgrim will do.

I had to wait for 4DON to get Fire Master...

I started my first game on Pilgrim and, while learning the game, it was fine.  Now, quite frankly, I'm bored to tears with it most of the time... but these feats and achievements are so long and grindy, that I'll be darned if I'm going to start a new game at a higher difficulty and just abandon the 300+ days I've already invested.  I"ll continue to work towards the achievements in that file.  The OP does also have that option... to grind out the feats and acheivements in stalker (and be bored as they claim) or up their game to Interloper and do it all there.  I still don't see why all the "concern" about people who choose to do it on an easier difficulty.  If custom qualifies, then all available settings within custom should still qualify.  Simple as that.

[UpUpAway95]

33 minutes ago, JezusCrustPizza said:

Look I love this whole include every gamer thing you have going but it really doesn't matter that much. Including minorities is great but it's not like this is some real life racial or gender or disability issue where they're being discriminated against for being a minority. Under pilgrim is too easy to reward feat progression. Just like in other games, you must play on certain difficulties to unlock things. Would you say that gamers with disabilities are being unfairly treated because they cannot unlock an ornament from For Honor's story mode because it is too hard? It's not much different here. Feats and achievements should not be equally accessible to all players regardless of the difficulty on which they play. Higher risk higher reward. Not that there is any risk in the first place, in pilgrim animals won't even attack you unless you attack them.

Not that this is a very meaningful argument because it's really just a guess but... Think about how little people care about the feats. Now think about how little people there are that play this game that would need a difficulty under pilgrim because of some sort of disability.  Now think about how many people fit both of those categories. And as much as I love getting achievements and feats, I'm just happy to play the game. It really isn't that big of a deal and I don't think other people including those with disability's would think so either. It's such a minuscule thing. 

As I said, then leave it as it is... custom difficulty does not qualify for feat progression... and that applies for every available setting within the custom mode... universally for everyone who buys the game... and you can just suck it up and either grind them out on stalker and be bored or up your game to Interloper.

[NardoLoopa]

Earning achievements will not give your life meaning; nor will others lessening their challenges take meaning away from your life. 

The playing field is whatever Hinterland says it is.  There's no philosophical grounding.  It's just arbitrary.

"Grind" develops when you hyper-focus on completing some task as fast as possible that would otherwise be completed without inducing boredom if you accumulate the same progress naturally in play focused on other things.  For example, you could grind out 1,000 fires in soul sucking hours of just chaining torch fires.  Or you could play towards other goals and one day surprise yourself, "Oh, wow in my 56th interloper game I've finally lit 1,000 fires.  What do you know."  The 500 day achievement is probably a notable exception, since the timeline is well past the natural exhaustion of things to do in the game, and not far enough out as more areas/resources have been added to the world to be difficult to achieve.

[JezusCrustPizza]

5 hours ago, UpUpAway95 said:

As I said, then leave it as it is... custom difficulty does not qualify for feat progression... and that applies for every available setting within the custom mode... universally for everyone who buys the game... and you can just suck it up and either grind them out on stalker and be bored or up your game to Interloper.

I'm not going to just leave it as is, I'm requesting a feature that I'd like to see in one of my favorite games. Why should I leave it as is because of your opinion? No, you can leave it as is if you'd like, in my opinion it should be changed.

4 hours ago, NardoLoopa said:

Earning achievements will not give your life meaning; nor will others lessening their challenges take meaning away from your life. 

The playing field is whatever Hinterland says it is.  There's no philosophical grounding.  It's just arbitrary.

"Grind" develops when you hyper-focus on completing some task as fast as possible that would otherwise be completed without inducing boredom if you accumulate the same progress naturally in play focused on other things.  For example, you could grind out 1,000 fires in soul sucking hours of just chaining torch fires.  Or you could play towards other goals and one day surprise yourself, "Oh, wow in my 56th interloper game I've finally lit 1,000 fires.  What do you know."  The 500 day achievement is probably a notable exception, since the timeline is well past the natural exhaustion of things to do in the game, and not far enough out as more areas/resources have been added to the world to be difficult to achieve.

Well they're called achievements... By definition it is something done successfully from effort courage or skill. So I would very much like to earn them. And I've already explained everything of why you shouldn't get them below pilgrim which I believe is fair considering pilgrim is already a cake walk. And you can call it arbitrary if you'd like but again, I've explained the reason I think you shouldn't be able to get them lower than pilgrim. 

[UpUpAway95]

On 3/1/2019 at 5:36 PM, JezusCrustPizza said:

I'm not going to just leave it as is, I'm requesting a feature that I'd like to see in one of my favorite games. Why should I leave it as is because of your opinion? No, you can leave it as is if you'd like, in my opinion it should be changed.

Well they're called achievements... By definition it is something done successfully from effort courage or skill. So I would very much like to earn them. And I've already explained everything of why you shouldn't get them below pilgrim which I believe is fair considering pilgrim is already a cake walk. And you can call it arbitrary if you'd like but again, I've explained the reason I think you shouldn't be able to get them lower than pilgrim. 

...and I've given you a couple of options that "handle" that situation better than yours.  Yours arbitrarily creates 2 classes of players... Ones who can utilize the Custom settings to get their feats and acheivements and ones who can't.  To make it fair to all players:  1)  You could eliminate all custom settings that are lower than Pilgrim ones.  2)  You could make it so that both feats and achievements can only be obtained on "standard" difficulties... meaning that you would simply have to choose whether you want to do them on Stalker or Interloper (or try for them within any of the other Challenge games or Wintermute)... rather than whine that Stalker's too easy for you and Interloper is too difficult.  Right now, achievements can be done on any custom setting.  I have no problem with people grinding out 500 days in this game on the easiest settings to get that achievement BECAUSE the game is permadeath.  Since you want it to be an achievement, then I suggest you achieve it in Interloper and challenge yourself since you state that you find Stalker too easy;.  However, as it is currently, NOTHING is stopping you from creating a custom file of your own to get any of the achievements.  You should stop fretting so much about how other people view their own personal achievements.

 

For feats, which you cannot get currently on Custom, you don't even need to do it in one file.  Progression can continue over many files.  It's only a matter really of how many total hours you play... so I have no problem with it staying as it is.  People can do them all in Pilgrim or do them in any combination of save files that use Pilgrim, Voyageur, Stalker, or Interloper settings.  That's 4 difficulty settings you can choose from to grind them out.  You just don't need to make a special custom setting between interloper and stalker.  Unlike you, I do care about being fair to all levels of players.  They bought the game and they should be able to use any and all settings in the game how they see fit.

I even suggested that they could add more achievements related to specific difficulties - like the 24-hour interloper one (which cannot currently be obtained using a custom setting).  They could, say, make Deadman an official standard difficulty level and add an achievement for surviving 30 days in Deadman mode.