Wolf behavior

[Eachna]

To start, I realize there are limits to the changes the devs can even afford to make and there may be very little interest in changing wolves. Still, I know there's a fair amount of dis-satisfaction with wolves as bloodthirsty killing machines that race from halfway across the visible map to attack players. It's not just unrealistic that the wolves attack _people_ at all, it's unrealistic how wolves behave in general in the game. I think if the wolves behaved more like _wolves_, and then happened to kill people, it would contribute to the realism of the game.

I'd like to see wolf behavior tuned a bit to make them more realistic as predators, while still keeping them threatening.

* Wolves should not run away from kills without any effort even on Pilgrim. You should have to use a torch or flare to scare them off a corpse, or fire over their head. This is more towards "consumption of resources" than realism (as real wolves are shy and avoid humans whenever possible), but real wolves do require more *ahem* "encouragement to leave" from scavengers than in-game Pilgrim wolves do from humans.

* Wolves should hunt in pairs. Wolves are pair/pack animals. A pair of wolves could still be balance-able depending on gear and general health.

* A "lone wolf" is prey if a human sees it, not a predator. If you run across a lone wolf I'd like to have it act in a threatening manner and then turn tail and flee in a random direction.

* Wolves can sense weakness based on things like scent and movement (limping/stiffness). I'd like wolves to spawn more often when you're injured and less often when you're at full health.

* Wolves can smell blood/meat. If you've harvested a corpse and are carrying raw meat I'd like wolves to be more likely to spawn and harass you.

* Wolves snarl and go into an aggressive posture before they attack another predator they feel is threatening them. This is a simple form of bluffing, and amounts to them saying "I'm really tough, you don't want to mess with me." I'd like to see some posturing before wolves attack.

* Wolves are primarily nocturnal hunters, although they can roam and hunt at different times of the day in different seasons. I'd like there to be a daily time block where wolves are less likely to spawn (allowing for limited forms of 'safe-ish' travel). If you're injured or carrying meat they might still surprise you. "Safe-ish" is not "safe".

* Having pairs of wolves and lone wolves could increase the uncertainty in the game significantly. If you see a wolf in the distance you won't know if it's a lone wolf or part of a pair. When it starts snarling and posturing...you might back away, or you might defend yourself. If it's a lone wolf, it might just posture for a few seconds and then run away. If it's one of a pair, another wolf would spawn and you could get attacked from the side/back while still watching the front wolf posture. The devs could even model some behaviors for wolves that "look like" pairs but are opponents. So, you might see two wolves near you. One starts growling and posturing...and you think "Oh shit! A pair!" and then the second wolf charges the growling wolf (or vice-versa). This should occasionally (but only occasionally) result in one wolf killing another. Just like in my suggestion lower down about having wolves harass but not kill deer, a harassing wolf could charge the other wolf, bark/snarl a few times, and then change direction and trot away.

* Wolves should return to kills later. Wolves tend to gorge on a kill, but they have to contend with scavengers that like to poach their kills (wolverines are infamous for this). They're also not above a bit of scavenging themselves, by both returning to their kills (if there's any meat left) and snacking on other animals' kills. A deer corpse that was hunted by a wolf or human (not a "starter" corpse) should spawn lone wolves or pairs of wolves every few hours till it empties.

* Wolves are stalk and dash hunters that attack from the flanks and side. They tend to bite the prey on the belly/in the throat until it bleeds to death. The wolves in game appear to hunt more like great cats (they run behind, pounce once, and the deer falls over dead). I'd love to see the wolf animation for hunting deer to be re-worked to be more "wolf-like", including leaving blood trails during part of the run. It would be even more awesome if some work could be done on having pairs of wolves hunt together.

* As part of the "stalk and dash" attack, wolves will sometimes harass deer they don't (seem to) intend to kill. While you should still be able to steal kills off wolves, I'd like to see wolves less inclined to simply be herded into hunting every animal they pass (including two or more deer kills off the same wolf). I'd like to see wolves occasionally 'dash' after prey that runs away and have the wolf change direction, slow down to a trot, and then ignore the fleeing deer.

* Wolves are very "vocal" hunters. They make lots of growling/snarling noises while dashing, and when they feed. It would be creepy to hear wolves snarling/yipping/gulping in the background with no clear sense of direction, then stepping over a rise to stumble across a pair of feeding wolves.

[piddy3825]

Well said, Eachna!

I like everything you said about incorporating realistic wolf behavior(s) and pack hunting mentality, alpha males, vocalizations etc. into the game to add greater realism.

You may or may not recall one of the bugs earlier this summer was random wolf attacks in pilgrim games. That happened to me in one session when I first started playing and I gotta say that was one of my more memorable TLD sessions.

I recently started playing stalker mode, normally not my style of gameplay, only after having read thru some of the numerous discussions here on the forums regarding said subject. I do have to say that I was pleasantly surprised by certain aspects of the wolf behavior dynamic during gameplay that I didn't expect to see.

For example, I found myself out on the ice on the CH near those cottages with the corpse next to the ice across from Misanthropes. I am about 3/4 of the way to the fishing hut when I see two wolves converging towards me from the left and right hand portion of my screen. anyways, I start to walk backwards veering towards the road as both wolves come together, I pop a flare as both break into a run and heads towards me, I keep walking backwards holding my flare out and as the both get within lunging range, they both just stop and are growling and menacing me. I walk back a few more feet and figure what the heck, meat and pelts, I take a little damage. I throw the flare and equip the rifle, only to have both wolves turn tail and run. That seemed pretty realistic behavior to me.

Otherwise, you're right, wolves normally wouldn't just run up to you so you could shoot 'em in the head with a homemade bow.

[roneranger]

I do agree with some of this but I don't actually find wolves all that difficult to fight and evade. If you crouch you can actually get quite close to animals unseen but if you walk or run wolves will see you from a distance. I find that if my condition is near perfect then hand to hand a wolf is not a big challenge one on one but if you decide to track one after wounding it you are likely to come across another wolf. There have been many times where I have evade wolves simply by crouching behind trees while they prowl by.

[SteveP]

There are already wolves acting in pairs or trios. It can be extremely difficult to deal with multiple attacks from wolves so personally, I would prefer to see multiple wolf packs kept to Stalker mode.

The only thing about the current wolf behaviour that makes them manageable is that they seem to stick to predetermined locations and don't wander about the maps freely. This lets you develop a movement strategy to avoid them. To safely pass through a wolf zone, you often need to use a torch or flare (which are limited). Torches are not really that good for fending off the wolves; sometimes they still seem to attack especially if you are weak. I'm my own worst enemy at times because I tend to panic. :-( I'm more typical of an older player wanting a strategy game rather than an arcade fighting type game.

There seems to be a pair of wolves that hang around the main path to the Discovery Point lighthouse that are probably a mated pair. I killed one and the other laid in wait for me to come out and ambushed me a day later.

One particularly annoying feature of wolves is that they never seem to come straight at you if you have a gun. I find it extremely difficult to bring the rifle to bear properly before they have already come within striking distance. There seems to be a jump of about 20 meters that prevents shooting them in close.

[SpaceBallsJim]

Well said all of you, on the top of that i would like to add, my wish is to see unpredictable places where you can find wolves, after few sanbox runs i know exactly where they are and were is safe to run without any concern to find one. That does not drive me much to restart same map and start over. Not knowing where i'll find one would.

[sierra 117]

+1I agree wolf behaviour needs to be tweaked i find it far too easy on stalker to get meat and wolf pelts.

Atm im playing on easy mode and i am finding the challenge of hunting way better than on stalker. For instance the wolf pelt coat ,too easy to make, too quickly on stalker while its proving a lot harder on easy mode.

So yeah i think having lone wolves run away, like pilgrim mode. And only act aggresive/ attack when you hurt them(bow shot etc) trying to steal a deer kill or if they are in a pack. Otherwise they should be passive . Also would like to see them follow/ stalk you from a distance. Like they are waitng for you to sprain an ankle or get close enough to another wolf then they would charge you. Would add to the helpless feeling we should have with wolves.

Also agree they should make wolf patrol paths less predictable .

And defo think adding a few.wolves into random interiors would be cool(like fluffy in the dam)

Even a shack that has no broken windows for the wolf to enter you could have one with a note on the door from another survivor/npc that simply reads. wolf inside. Like they had a struggle and had to lock it in the cabin to get away.

Or something along those lines.

What do you guys think anything you can add?