taking the bear spear outta bounds

[piddy3825]

have you ever wondered what it would be like to use the bear spear in survival mode?

I did just that but the results were not what I expected

I've been replaying episode 2 in story mode and finally retrieved and repaired the bear spear at the forge in Broken Railroad.  
I fought the ole grumpy bear at the broken antenna tower in FM and decided to return to ML and from there I went out of bounds leaving the game
world and entered Raven's Ravine.  Surprised that it actually worked, I continued my adventure and transited to CH.  For what ever reason there was
absolutely no wildllife on the map, so I decided to push my luck and I headed to DP.  I was able to transit to DP via the Crumbling Highway and as luck would 
have it managed to get to DP.  As I continued to work my way along the map, I encountered my first "survival mode" bear and decided to engage him...

slowly stalking him with my new weapon, I quickly closed the distance between us

He closed the distance quickly and although I was gripping my spear with both hands and had my feet fifirmly planted 

He brushed the spear aside and he munched my butt, like he had diabetes and my ass was full of insulin...

the bear slowly sauntered away as I staggered to my feet, my spear lying at my feet, the cold hard street stained with my blood.

what a rush!

 

 

 

[Leeanda]

 is that because it's out of bounds though? Raises some serious questions about whether it's viable in survival. 

There could be some very disappointed players .

[piddy3825]

5 hours ago, Leeanda said:

 is that because it's out of bounds though? Raises some serious questions about whether it's viable in survival. 

There could be some very disappointed players .

No, I am guessing it has something to do with the mechanics of the encounter.  the spear fight is obviously a scripted encounter in story mode as you don't actually kill the bear in the first few engagements outside of his lair.  Since the bear in survival mode isn't scripted to engage with the spear it would be just as if I was standing there unarmed and the result was getting mauled as usual survival game style.  I suppose that if the bear spear is ever introduced as an actual weapon in survival mode that the dev team will need to rewrite the bear engagement algorythm so that a player can fight the bear and eventually kill it.  

on a side note, the better part of the experience was that once I got past the invisible barrier blocking my way out of ML, the rest of the island has opened up for continued exploration.  It's like a voyager game now as far as the wolf and bear are concerned.  The bear spear doesn't scare off the wolf either.  I tried.

[Leeanda]

16 minutes ago, piddy3825 said:

No, I am guessing it has something to do with the mechanics of the encounter.  the spear fight is obviously a scripted encounter in story mode as you don't actually kill the bear in the first few engagements outside of his lair.  Since the bear in survival mode isn't scripted to engage with the spear it would be just as if I was standing there unarmed and the result was getting mauled as usual survival game style.  I suppose that if the bear spear is ever introduced as an actual weapon in survival mode that the dev team will need to rewrite the bear engagement algorythm so that a player can fight the bear and eventually kill it.  

on a side note, the better part of the experience was that once I got past the invisible barrier blocking my way out of ML, the rest of the island has opened up for continued exploration.  It's like a voyager game now as far as the wolf and bear are concerned.  The bear spear doesn't scare off the wolf either.  I tried.

Well I hope that if or when the spear makes an appearance in survival that the majority don't end up the same way you did. Might take quite a few attempts to get it mastered properly. Especially on the wolves as they don't run in a straight line. Perhaps the ability to throw it as well might prove useful? 

Bunny kebabs. 

Glad you're enjoying the out of bounds,I was never brave enough to try it. 

Happy New year to you!☺️

[hozz1235]

On 12/31/2021 at 9:53 AM, Leeanda said:

Especially on the wolves as they don't run in a straight line.

Will it even work on wolves?  I had thought not.

[Leeanda]

29 minutes ago, hozz1235 said:

Will it even work on wolves?  I had thought not.

I doubt it's practical if we're only allowed to use it as in story mode,but as mentioned before if we were permitted to throw it ,I suppose it could work!? 

Personally I'd even try it on the rabbits!  If we ever get it that is.

Edited January 3, 2022 by Leeanda

[piddy3825]

4 hours ago, hozz1235 said:

Will it even work on wolves?  I had thought not.

 

4 hours ago, Leeanda said:

I doubt it's practical if we're only allowed to use it as in story mode,but as mentioned before if we were permitted to throw it ,I suppose it could work!? 

Personally I'd even try it on the rabbits!  If we ever get it that is.

I'm under the impression that the spear only works to scare off the wolves in story mode.    At least the wolves in FM ran away as I got closer to them in story mode, but then again, I had just stabbed the bear pretty good.  The spear didn't do doodly squat when I took it out of bounds.  Wolves just ran right up to me and attacked forcing me to choose the hunting knife in order to defend myself.  It will probably take a good bit of programming in order to introduce the bear spear as a useable weapon in survival mode, particularly if it's meant to be thrown as well as being used as a stabbing weapon.  I'm surprised that noone has suggested mounting a knife on a rifle and using it like a bayonet.  i guess maybe someone should suggest that for the wish list?

[Leeanda]

18 minutes ago, piddy3825 said:

 

I'm under the impression that the spear only works to scare off the wolves in story mode.    At least the wolves in FM ran away as I got closer to them in story mode, but then again, I had just stabbed the bear pretty good.  The spear didn't do doodly squat when I took it out of bounds.  Wolves just ran right up to me and attacked forcing me to choose the hunting knife in order to defend myself.  It will probably take a good bit of programming in order to introduce the bear spear as a useable weapon in survival mode, particularly if it's meant to be thrown as well as being used as a stabbing weapon.  I'm surprised that noone has suggested mounting a knife on a rifle and using it like a bayonet.  i guess maybe someone should suggest that for the wish list?

Its a good idea as long as is doesn't up the wear and tear on the rifle itself. I'm loathe to suggest any wishes these days for fear of  causing any more aggro.  Despite the welcome silence from some one lately. 

I'd back the idea though if you feel like adding it ?.

[hozz1235]

15 hours ago, piddy3825 said:

I'm surprised that noone has suggested mounting a knife on a rifle and using it like a bayonet.

Would the bayonet then be used as a struggle weapon or introduce a "jabbing" (such as with a spear) animation?  The 2nd option would require A LOT (IMHO) of work on HL's part.  Then again, I haven't played Wintermute for some time.  I seem to recall the bear spear was a "set the spear and let the bear impale itself" vs a jabbing weapon.

Edited January 4, 2022 by hozz1235

[Bimbobjoejr.]

If anything, I'd say it would work similar to the bear spear in a "setting" animation. Raise the rifle and it drains stamina, but if it connects with a charging wolf, it plays an animation of you stabbing the wolf, run out of stamina and the usual struggle animation plays. It could work on a bear as well, but to less of an effect maybe.

[piddy3825]

2 hours ago, Bimbobjoejr. said:

If anything, I'd say it would work similar to the bear spear in a "setting" animation. Raise the rifle and it drains stamina, but if it connects with a charging wolf, it plays an animation of you stabbing the wolf, run out of stamina and the usual struggle animation plays. It could work on a bear as well, but to less of an effect maybe.

 

3 hours ago, hozz1235 said:

Would the bayonet then be used as a struggle weapon or introduce a "jabbing" (such as with a spear) animation?  The 2nd option would require A LOT (IMHO) of work on HL's part.  Then again, I haven't played Wintermute for some time.  I seem to recall the bear spear was a "set the spear and let the bear impale itself" vs a jabbing weapon.

 

I think I agree with Bimbo's idea that the animation would kinda be setting the bayonet and the wolf subsequently impales themselves much like the bear when it leaps towards you.  Now I could see a jabbing or thrusting motion as well only for the immersive quality of the encounter.  In story mode, there is some jabbing going on as the scene unfolds as the player engages the bear with the spear.  In the final boss fight, the spear is repeatedly plunged into the neck of the bear as it final falls.  At one point the spear remains sticking out of the bear as the animation ends, but sadly it just kinda disappears back into the player inventory without giving the player the satisfaction of pulling the bloodied spear from the bear's body.      

I think an animation where the wolf runs into the bayonet or the spear and is subsequently thrown over the shoulder of the wielder due to its own momentum would then allow either the wolf to flee with a mortal wound or continue its attack.  The continued attack would then need a stabbing/jabbing animation to be most immersive.

[Bimbobjoejr.]

1 hour ago, piddy3825 said:

I think an animation where the wolf runs into the bayonet or the spear and is subsequently thrown over the shoulder of the wielder due to its own momentum would then allow either the wolf to flee with a mortal wound or continue its attack.  The continued attack would then need a stabbing/jabbing animation to be most immersive.

I think after that first part, if it continues to attack, you could try to stab it again, which could be a 50/50 chance; or you could try to shoot it like struggling with the revolver.

[piddy3825]

2 hours ago, Bimbobjoejr. said:

I think after that first part, if it continues to attack, you could try to stab it again, which could be a 50/50 chance; or you could try to shoot it like struggling with the revolver.

good idea, you get a 50/50 chance of jab/stabbing, but if you were wielding a bayonet style rifle setup rather than a bear spear, the wielder would only be able to fire the rifle from the hip.  another 50/50 chance of hitting their target during the ensuing wolf struggle.  either that would end the encounter or perhaps the wolf would run away?  maybe randomize that aspect of the wolf struggle mechanic as well.  

yeah, all those algorythms and all those hand drawn animations would be necessary in order to make the occurence immersive. 
I don't think we'll be seing anything like it anytime soon.