manni.manni

@jeffpeng 1. "gameplay over realism" - If you reread the original post, you'll see no mention from me asking for realism. I'm very careful with my choice of words. I think you'd find we're actually on the same side. Also, from here on, just assume that none of my suggestions are made on the basis of wanting realism in the game. 2. I disagree. Early game, the bow is already op. When I play seriously, I run around - ignoring everything - to get a hatchet and rush to known bow, maple, and birch sapling spawn points. I actually see no viability with the rifle, early or late. I mostly use the rifle when I'm having fun (i.e. shooting the shit out of a bear/moose to see how much bullets I can waste, triggering wolf packs and quickscoping them, etc.) I'm no arc wizard but I don't really see the point in long range shots with the bow when I can just trigger predators (including the moose) and put an arrow between their eyes in the last second - one shot kill'ing them (something I shouldn't be able to do IRL - even with a gun, but alas, the game allows me to do it, and as much as I love it, it makes abandoning the rifle even easier). 3. If the rifle suits you, that's fine! I'm not here to change your mind! I just have suggestions and I'm aware that this forum is for open discussion anyway. Again, I never asked for realism - I asked for mechanics that would make the rifle a more viable option vs the bow, which it currently isn't IMHO, which I also think is bad. To use the rifle later on is a handicap. Compared to the bow, it weighs too much and sways too much, and they both have the same one-shot potential. So I see no reason to use the rifle when I can get a lightweight one-shot killer. 4. I like your idea with the sniping stance but isn't that "realism over gameplay"? Either way, would be cool for the game. Also, yes this would make it a nice hunting tool but the fact that you have to carry the weight of the meat/hide + the rifle, and you can't/it's difficult to use it defensively, so you'll have to carry the extra weight of your sidearm (bow/revolver). If I were in a situation where I've just killed a moose, I would rather have 20kgs of meat, the 5kg hide, the 0.5kg of the bow, and the 0.10kg of the flare (if I'm not in the mood to kill a bear). This allows me to still move in a reasonable pace and be able to defend myself from wolf packs. Which IMHO is better than carrying 10-15kgs of meat, 5kg hide, 4kg rifle, and the extra weight of my anti-wolf/bear items (bow/revolver/stones/flares/etc) - not to mention the return trip(s). 5. I wholeheartedly agree with your perspective on the rifle skill. The words you used were the words I wish I thought of and wrote on my original post. They need to make it more dynamic or have tangible effects other than packing more of a punch. A steadier aim, sleight of hand, something better than what I can think of.

@Screenshot Pilgrim Yeah idk man, because your reply isn't condescending at all lmao how about replying without needing to be condescending? This ain't twitter. We can have a civil convo. You could have just laid out your points but you had to go down the condescending route. I mean you have 200+ rep so I guess talking that way is not a bad thing in this site. Also, you honestly really don't care, huh? I mean you care enough to reply, to double down on your reply, and also to edit your reply. Hmmmmmm... algood though, at least I know I should just ignore you and give no merit to whatever you have to say.

@stirfoo Ayy bow-gang! Yeah, you should try it with moose. Get them to charge and then headshot them in the last second. Most satisfying way to kill moose imho

@NardoLoopa You've just proven my point in the original post - that the rifle is nothing but a steppingstone. Which in terms of game design, is cool. If Hinterland intended the rifle to be a like a tier 2 weapon and the bow a tier 3 weapon, that's their decision - it is their game after all. Also I agree with everything you said btw, I'm just saying you've proven my point. I just feel like the rifle should be a viable late game option, y'know what I mean? That I'm not just meant to leave it behind and just manufacture 50 bows. I mean the current state of the rifle (and even as you said), the game wants us to leave the rifle behind and go for the bow. Thus, everyone should be bow-gang. I just wanted an even playing field between the two.

@Screenshot Pilgrim

@NardoLoopa I just quickscope with the rifle hahaha Also yeah man, ANY form of sway reduction (never elimination) would be appreciated! Whether it be a hold-breath or whatever Hinterland or anyone comes up with! I also agree with your crouch aim idea - they should never eliminate sway. As for the bolt action, there are some discussion from people about that. Some say its unrealistic, some say it is. Honestly, I just suggested that as the game's way to compensate for the OP-ness of the bow. And yes the revolver is SO OP. Which is why, to me, to not use it is a personal handicap. But hey! Mad respect to you for not using the OP revolver hahaha I salute players like you! The thing I look for in game weapons is reliability. Is it good for offense? What about defense? What about on the move? Is it efficient? Is it replaceble? Is ammo abundant? Can I kill all enemies with it? etc etc. The rifle fails vs the bow when it comes to MY criteria in reliability. Which is why I opt for the bow/revolver combo. I'm literally unstoppable. Only timber wolves give me trouble. Bears and moose are literal child's play to me - no matter the difficulty. Which is also why I wished the rifle could be a more competent option vs the bow. I want to be have a hard time choosing what to bring outside - the bow or the rifle? I want to regret not bringing the rifle. But I never do. Yet I always regret not bringing the bow.

@piddy3825 Yeah man, Bow-Gang for life. Well for now at least. Unless they make the rifle more of a viable contender vs the bow. Also that crouching with the bow I'm sure is just a balance thing hahaha because its too damn OP. Also yeah that is a fun use for the revolver considering you can craft 10 billion revolver ammo.

@Screenshot Pilgrim Yeah I know which is why I just quickscope with the rifle HAHAHA I never use it when playing seriously. I just rush the bow. I keep the rifle for achievements or honestly for decorations - like a trophy. I want to have a reason to use it. Coz as of now, I still have no reason to I really like that idea you have of mounting the rifle! I wish I thought of that! Oh man if only... we can only wish. I mean, as I said in a previous reply... "I just want the rifle to be useful. But hey, if Hinterland believes the current state of the rifle is the way they want it to be, that’s okay! I’ll just be sticking to my bow and I’ll keep wondering what it would be like if the rifle was just as strong."

Hey @ManicManiac Thanks for your reply! I appreciate your response and don’t worry; I never took any of them personally. However, I also disagree with some of your points, so I will respond to them. Also, I’m not adept at using the quote feature and I cbf learning them AND I’m using Word to then copypasta it here so meh... 1. I didn’t use the search feature because I sent my suggestions directly to Hinterland and they told me post it here. Hence, why I'm here. 2. We don’t have to worry about wind or elevation… - Yeah I’m aware I’m playing a game. I actually have a problem when games attempt realism and win at some aspects and lose at some aspects. Takes me out of the experience. I don’t want TLD to be real life, nor The Hunter. I like it as is but I just have suggestions. 3. I’m sure it’s frustrating but hang in there… - I’m an exploit gamer. As I said, TLD has made me a bow person because exploiting the game has taught me that the rifle is useless (personally - at the moment). Because of it’s current state, I use the rifle for fun, not when I’m playing “seriously”. 4. More people should understand and accept that video game doesn’t have to reflect reality… - in addition to #2, I never once said that I wanted realism in the game. If anything, I want it to be more of a game. TLD tries to be realistic in some aspects, some of which I like. However, in other aspects, fall so short or, imo, is adapted badly – feel free believe that they are adapted well, I’m not here to change your mind. I just wanted more dynamic game features to be added into the rifle. 5. don’t think Hinterland is out to tailor for one individual… - I know, which is why I made suggestions – not demands. I needed to mention that I ‘sent them feedback’ because that’s what led me to post here. I know it’s their game and I also respect them for it. I mean if they didn’t tell me to post here, I wouldn’t be here, correct? Again, I mentioned that because that’s why I’m posting here. 6. Skilled marksmen wouldn’t recommend holding breath… - Again, I never asked for realism. I’m not a marksman. I’m a gamer. And games have game features, namely: holding breath to steady or lessen sway. You’re the one with gun experience and I have none, hence why I never once mentioned anything about wanting realistic shooting mechanics. 6b. Sitting and prone is better than standing or kneeling – Refer to #6. Also, I never mentioned sitting or prone because they are not options in the game, nor did I ask for them to add sitting and prone. 7. The advantages we get from the skill tree are significant… - For the rifle, no. Again, as an exploit gamer, the current state of the rifle is a steppingstone. It’s a handicap – for me – once I get the bow. Weighs too much, sways too much, and the bow is superior in every aspect. 7a. I can kill a charging bear or a moose using 1 arrow – why should I use a rifle to do that? That’s my skill personal skill with the bow. 7b. Hunting with a bow and carrying home 20+ kgs of meat/hide is better than carrying an extra 4kgs of the rifle. My point is, the rifle [to me] is nothing but a hindrance therefore, I get rid of it. And that’s what I don’t like about it’s current state. I want to love the TLD rifle and I want to use the rifle. But its okay Manic, agree to disagree. 8. I think because again… this is not encouraged by folks with good marksmanship experience… - You can’t say More people should understand and accept that video game doesn’t have to reflect reality and then say holding your breath is not recommended by experienced marksmen. I asked for dynamic game mechanics – not realism. 9. I think all weapons are balanced against each other… - Again, I can one shot a charging bear and a moose with one arrow. That’s actually my preferred way of hunting them – get them to charge then put an arrow between their eyes. I shouldn’t be able to do that IRL – not even with a gun. But the game’s rules say it’s possible. Which, again (refer to 7a & 7b) 10.“jerk the bolt” not cock the bolt – Shows my lack of knowledge with guns. I actually had to google it but couldn’t find “jerk the bolt” so I used cock. I appreciate that smiley face right next to your correction though. Also, don’t get me wrong. I’m not complaining about the rifle because I’m an angry noob who can’t use the TLD rifle. I love using it actually. I enjoy running around the map and getting surrounded by wolves to quick-scope them. But when I play seriously, it’s a hindrance (refer to 7b). Faster “jerk the bolt” was a suggestion for the sake of dynamic game mechanics – not realism. Something I thought could make it compete against the bow. It’s not the best idea but its an idea nonetheless – maybe someone can think of something better. 11. I use stones to drive off wolves before wasting revolver rounds… - Good for you man. I have 500+ revolver rounds and more to craft with. Not to mention that I can always start a new game and get craft more revolver ammo. So hey, you like stones, I like revolver rounds – agree to disagree. 12. Your response to “so when I miss shots, I feel personally responsible”… - I think you missed my point there. I never said it was a bad thing that I felt crushed whenever I missed a shot using the rifle. I personally see it as a good thing. However, my complain is that I can blame the game because of the TLD sway and that there is no way to steady or lessen the sway other than bringing tons of coffee. As I said before, I love quickscoping charging wolf packs (not timber wolves yet, I’m still trying to master that). My simple point there is that the current rifle is not a good contender vs the bow. I have no reason to use the rifle and I have every reason to use the bow. You addressing my list: 1. You can’t say More people should understand and accept that video game doesn’t have to reflect reality and then say holding your breath is not recommended by experienced marksmen. 2. Alright, I agree with that. 3. Okay, a little common ground, that’s neat! 4. I’m pretty sure when players ask for the game to be more challenging, they’re not referring to the rifle. Remember, these players are the same players who play on Interloper – where there is no rifle *mic drop* (hahaha sorry I’m just having fun) Hey, if you think the game is challenging, that’s good! I think so too…for the first few days at least because that’s how long I usually take before crafting a bow – then the game is on easy mode. I just want the rifle to be useful. But hey, if Hinterland believes the current state of the rifle is the way they want it to be, that’s okay! I’ll just be sticking to my bow and I’ll keep wondering what it would be like if the rifle was just as strong. Don’t worry man, I can take feedback. Agree to disagree!

Hello everyone! This is my first forum submission and I hope you enjoy reading this! However, this might be too long so if you're in a TL:DR mood, just scroll down to the last few paragraphs. So I've been playing The Long Dark ever since (I believe) its launch date and I have 820 hours on it (yes, I know I should have more but I take long breaks, especially if I don't like the updates or when I get bored). However, ever since I've played TLD, I have always had a problem with the rifle. I can remember repeatedly sending feedback to Hinterland Games about suggestions to "fix" the rifle. These ranged from 'angry-man-child' rants to 'nicely-worded' suggestions. I'm sad to say but Hinterland Games are still yet to implement any of my suggestions. For the longest time, my problem has been the rifle's sway. The rifle (in the earlier versions); 1. Never sways at 100% energy 2. Slight sway at 75% 3. Significant sway at 50% 4. Mighty sway at %40 and below (And for the longest time, my suggestion has always been for them to implement some sort of hold breath mechanic to steady the aim) My first solution to this issue was to always bring a ton of coffee for every task that would need me to carry the rifle (i.e. exploring or hunting). My second solution was to get a bow. I can remember when they introduced the "skill" system wherein you can develop skills with certain tools or tasks the more you do them. I was so excited about this that I did not bother reading anything about the update and wanted to see for myself what awaited me once I mastered the rifle skill. ALSO, this update gave the rifle a strong sway, no matter how much energy you have - which also gets worse and worse the more tired you are. After about 50+ bullets or so (this is hyperbole - I don't accurately know how many shots it takes to master), I finally mastered the rifle skill...only to be disappointed to know that all it does is increase the critical hit chance and the damage, reduce per use condition, increase accuracy range (which, imo, is irrelevant), and +5 condition per repair. I find it weird that rifle mastery in the game does not involve the player learning how to hold their breath to steady their aim, nor does it grant the ability to cock the bolt faster than you could at novice level. The only way I've ever used rifles is to line up my shot using right click, then do a quick-scope. This is because the aim is steady for the first half-second of right clicking. Ever since I had this problem, I only ever saw the rifle as a stepping stone between having no weapons and having the bow - the most OP weapon in the game. Then the revolver came along...which made the rifle completely obsolete. My only reasons to use the rifle these days is to: 1. Get the rifle mastery skill (for fun - gives me something to do) 2. Kill bears for sport - I usually ignore or walk around them coz imho, bear hide is useless 3. Kill moose for sport. If I wanted moose for meat, I would use the bow coz for some reason, you can one-shot-kill them with an arrow between their eyes The revolver is superior to the rifle in every way. It's efficient, lightweight, has a fast-firing rate, and reliable. Missing rifle shots feels like my entire economy just crashed, whereas missing revolver shots feel normal - as if its supposed to happen. The revolver has no sway, so when I miss shots, I feel personally responsible. This is a good thing because I cannot cry "design flaw". I see every shot I miss as a need to improve. It's also more economic. The introduction of bullet forging made the revolver a thousand times better but it did not help the rifle in any way. Crafting 500 revolver ammo made me invincible from wolves and timber wolves. Crafting even 50 rifle bullets is only a waste of resources and literally handicaps me, hindering me from realising my "true revolver potential". I am passionate about this subject because I love the rifle so much and I love The Long Dark. I feel that in a survival scenario, having a rifle should be and must be one of the most game-changing experience of survival. Having a rifle in the wild could mean life over death, food or starvation, eat or be eaten. This is one of my reasons for taking breaks from the game. Every update, I check the rifle. Every time I do, I'm disappointed. My favourite weapon is useless and a burden to use. I have ideas on how to improve it though: 1. Introduce a hold breath mechanic to steady the aim - could be introduced from novice level or maybe unlocked after reaching level 2 or level 3. Maybe even the ability to hold the breath longer as skill level increases. The length of time the player can hold their breath could be related to the player's current energy level and/or their current stamina (i.e. shorter breath after a sprint). 2. Faster bolt action as skill level increases - mastering the rifle should be related to the rifle's key aspects. A faster bolt action would really feel like a mastery of the rifle. 3. Remove the damage increase as skill levels up. Either increase rifle damage outright or just leave it as it is - I'm honestly quite satisfied with its "normal" damage. 4. A very tight sway and steadier aim when crouched. Common sense on this one. The introduction of these mechanics would make the rifle more dynamic and would make it a contender versus the revolver and the bow. Because as of now, there is no contest. The rifle is a hindrance - a handicap. This would make it less of a stepping stone and more of a game play definer. Do you want to be a silent and lightweight hunter with a bow? Or do you want to be a heavyweight with power and accuracy? If you're still reading at this point, I hope you enjoyed the read. Whether you agree or disagree, or better yet, have a better suggestion, please do let me know! Either way, I hope the game developers listen to this or considers these ideas.