Farmerbob Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 The rifle is, quite simply, a game breaking issue for me. Every time I start playing again, I become horribly frustrated with the rifle and leave the game for weeks or months.I am a good shot in real life, with iron sights. When I am using a rifle that is in good repair, and I am making a standing or crouching shot at 20 meters or less on anything even close to man sized that is moving slowly or standing still, I hit. Period. End of discussion. It's dead, Jim. I wouldn't necessarily be able to kill something as big as a bear in one shot, but there's no way in Hell that I'd miss a bear that I was shooting at from ambush. Like I just did. Three times in my play session today, which will be my last play session for a few weeks because I'm too frustrated by the awfulness of the rifle to play the game.If the rifle is meant by design to be a horrible piece of garbage like it currently is, then do not allow us to repair the rifle to 100%. On the other hand. if the game designers don't want players to depend so heavily on using the rifle, then make it more difficult to repair. Require rifle parts, which can only be created by harvesting other rifles. Require good tools. Require regular maintenance with a rifle cleaning kit. Require us to zero the rifle. Whatever. Do not falsely advertise the rifle as a useful piece of equipment that will work as real-life experienced individuals expect it to, when it is not and will not.If you let us repair a rifle to 100% it needs to shoot what we aim at when we have a good sight picture at short range. Seriously. This game is going to attract a LOT of people who know how to shoot. For a rifle in perfect repair to be so inaccurate is completely unacceptable, utterly unrealistic, and a source of intense irritation to a large number of people who will be interested in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selfless Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 I have no comments on this other than those I already made on other threads with this same subject this week. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 I have no comments on this other than those I already made on other threads with this same subject this week. Good luck.I have seen some of your comments, and they have absolutely zero bearing on the problem I am discussing.If a rifle in a realism-based survival game is at a 100% repair state, then it needs to hit what it's aimed at. Period. I know how to shoot a rifle with iron sights, and every time I try to play this game with a rifle in near-perfect repair, all it does is piss me off.I really do not think this is what the dev team wants.They need to either fix the sight picture for rifles at high repair, or never allow rifles to get to 100% repair so there's some sort of excuse for the abysmal rifle targeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druffzilla Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 Your a good shot but the rifle is garbage...Did you actually state your problem or did you simply want to complain?If your problem is the same like in the other thread then why don't you post there? If its different you failed at making a point...I never shot a real rifle, only .22 air rifles and only on a short range and stationary targets, but they have ironsights too and I can't figure out what your guys problems are with the sights of the rifle in TLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brun Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 It's weird. I think the rifle is near perfect. Maybe even too good. To the point, where crouching when hunting feels like exploiting the game mechanics. You can get so close that it's real hard to miss.Maybe it's hardware related? A couple of versions back, my hardware configuration experienced some issues with laggy rifle movement. It was actually pretty cool, because it felt like you had too struggle a bit to keep the rifle steady, and thus making the game harder. But it got fixed, and I'm now again able to hold my rifle 100% steady only milliseconds after I lifted the weapon to my chin Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 Your a good shot but the rifle is garbage...Did you actually state your problem or did you simply want to complain?If your problem is the same like in the other thread then why don't you post there? If its different you failed at making a point...I never shot a real rifle, only .22 air rifles and only on a short range and stationary targets, but they have ironsights too and I can't figure out what your guys problems are with the sights of the rifle in TLD.The point I'm trying to make here is that as an experienced rifle user, who knows how to use iron sights, the rifle in the game is maddening because a repaired rifle should be functional, in a way that an experienced rifle user will be effective with it.This game is going to hopefully attract a lot of people who know what they are doing with rifles. The dev team needs to fix this critical failure. Whether it's hardware, or software. Calibrate the mouse on the screen before the player is allowed in-game if it's a positioning issue for some hardware.Either a 100% repaired rifle needs to work properly, or it should be impossible to have a 100% rifle. If other mechanics and tools need to be added to keep the rifle from being too powerful, that's fine too.As it is, it's impossible for me to enjoy the game with the rifle broken so badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druffzilla Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 The point I'm trying to make here is that as an experienced rifle user, who knows how to use iron sights, the rifle in the game is maddening because a repaired rifle should be functional, in a way that an experienced rifle user will be effective with it.This game is going to hopefully attract a lot of people who know what they are doing with rifles. The dev team needs to fix this critical failure. Whether it's hardware, or software. Calibrate the mouse on the screen before the player is allowed in-game if it's a positioning issue for some hardware.Either a 100% repaired rifle needs to work properly, or it should be impossible to have a 100% rifle. If other mechanics and tools need to be added to keep the rifle from being too powerful, that's fine too.As it is, it's impossible for me to enjoy the game with the rifle broken so badly.Just repeating yourself doesn't make your point more clear...You have to get more specific on what you think is broken, to me the rifle appears to be functional and not broken.If the sights are off, well I don't think its hard for the devs to simply move the ironsight graphics a bit...I'm more concerned about the actual realistic ballistic simulation of the bullet, bullet drop and travel time but its hard to test without bullet holes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyzara Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I think it would be extremely helpful if you could post a video or at least a screenshot how exactly you're aiming. It's almost impossible to give any helpful tips or determine what causes the problems for some people without more detailed information what exactly they're doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 I think it would be extremely helpful if you could post a video or at least a screenshot how exactly you're aiming. It's almost impossible to give any helpful tips or determine what causes the problems for some people without more detailed information what exactly they're doing. Imagine an iron sight picture generated by an ex-Army soldier that regularly qualified expert, from 20 meters or less. That's what I'm using. And I'm missing at least 3 out of 4 shots.There are no hints that will help me, because the problem is that the rifle is behaving wrong.I know this sounds arrogant, but I know how to shoot a rifle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxen Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 ...but I know how to shoot a rifle.Fine...and nobody claims the opposite...but that's a Game and that's 'processed' by your Computer!I can assure you (as a Hunter and by our 'Bundeswehr' trained 'Sniper'...as you would call it) that the 'Point of Aim' on my Computer is nearly perfect!You should surely test the game on another System...I'm absolutely sure it has nothing to do with any experience in RL...no matter how often you tell everybody how good your Aiming in RL is.Try it on another System and surely you'll see that everything's ok with the Rifle in TLD.When it (and your Char...) is in good condition it's hard to miss anything with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 12, 2015 Author Share Posted November 12, 2015 ...but I know how to shoot a rifle.Fine...and nobody claims the opposite...but that's a Game and that's 'processed' by your Computer!I can assure you (as a Hunter and by our 'Bundeswehr' trained 'Sniper'...as you would call it) that the 'Point of Aim' on my Computer is nearly perfect!You should surely test the game on another System...I'm absolutely sure it has nothing to do with any experience in RL...no matter how often you tell everybody how good your Aiming in RL is.Try it on another System and surely you'll see that everything's ok with the Rifle in TLD.When it (and your Char...) is in good condition it's hard to miss anything with it.If your system works as well as you say, and mine is completely and utterly FUBAR, then there is a failure.Which is something that should be fixed.Which is what I am asking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hylander Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 I think the point is, if its your system that is FUBAR, the devs can't do anything to help you. You need to try this on a different machine, which will point out exactly whether the problem is with your specific machine (which the devs can't fix) or there is a wider problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hylander Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 I got curious, and did a little experiment. Not sure how valid this is.Here's a screenshot, showing what should be the point of aim:Download Image 1Here's a screenshot capturing what I think is the point of impact:Download Image 2Not sure if that cloud of white represents the point of impact, but it looks like it. I've highlighted it in yellow. The red circle is in exactly the same spot in both images. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxen Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 ...and mine is completely and utterly FUBAR...I don't know if your System is FUBAR or if it's an issue with the coding itselves!But just for fun:System-Specs as seen below...Settings ingame: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 12, 2015 Author Share Posted November 12, 2015 I think the point is, if its your system that is FUBAR, the devs can't do anything to help you. You need to try this on a different machine, which will point out exactly whether the problem is with your specific machine (which the devs can't fix) or there is a wider problem.Eh, my system is fine. This isn't the only game I play. It is the only game I play with a aiming-point failure that is so noticeable.Here is the sight picture I use. At this range, against the mirror, it misses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hylander Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Okay, I did a little more experimentation, using the car mirror like you did. Shooting into a car is particularily useful, because it makes a very loud "clang" sound when the bullet hits any part of the car.Here's a picture:The left view shows where I would expect the bullet to go (in red), and the right view shows the same (in yellow), and where the bullet actually strikes (in red).Its not off by a huge amount, but it appears that, at least for relatively close range, the aim point is closer to the center of the barrel rather than the sights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 16, 2015 Author Share Posted November 16, 2015 After some testing using an incorrect sight picture as demonstrated by others, I have verified that the rifle is definitely completely broken at any range, even at 100% repair.By intentionally aiming high, I can hit targets. This is extremely frustrating when I see that the rifle is supposed to be at 100% repair.Again, I ask that some time be devoted to fixing the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortex Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Did we need another thread on this same topic? From the same member, no doubt?This is a ***game***. What is this morbid fascination people have with guns?I've been playing Shooters since the Doom 2 days. Every 'shooter' ***game*** has its nuances with gun aiming. Doom had a different aim style, Unreal Tournament had it, Quake had it, Battlefield 2 had it, Wolfenstein had it. (And as much I hate the franchise, Call of Duty has it, I hear...) As much as this ***game*** is under a unique genre that TLD falls under, I don't think Hinterland were going for a "gun simulator" in the literal sense with this title.I had to highlight the word ***game*** a lot because people seem to be forgetting that this is what TLD is. I don't mind people giving feedback on the title, but when you're so hardcore that you have to insist with multiple threads on the same topic and providing ballistic charts and real world examples of how you peppered an animal with rock salt from 50 feet - it gets irritating, for lack of a better word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicko Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 not sure why everyone is complaining - last few shots that I made I killed a deer from 50m and even 100m away with one shot. Maybe luck maybe not or I am just used to using gamer guns. never really shot to many rifles in real world. So to me the rifle == awesome. and yeah it's not a rifle sim game so get over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 16, 2015 Author Share Posted November 16, 2015 Did we need another thread on this same topic? From the same member, no doubt?This is a ***game***. What is this morbid fascination people have with guns?Yes. Because this game has an element of realism that really draws you in. And then you stumble across the rifle's horribly broken aiming mechanism, and it kicks your immersion in the jimmies and laughs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pegasus2 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 I also have big problems when aiming the rifle, even at close ranges. The only time i'm 100% accurate is with a wolf running directly towards me and under 15 meters.My accuracy will fall to somthing like 20% when shooting transverse or stationary targets, even when shooting the center of mass of a dear, i'll miss and not get a blood trail.Since the alignment of the front and rear sights is equal and unchangeable in the game, with a 100% rifle and well rested, I expect the bullet to hit whatever the very very tip of the sight post is over. This would be where the shot should fall correct or a well zeroed rifle for the range it is set to. Many, many times i've aimed with the tip of the sight post over the target at 20/25 meters and missed 1,2,3 shots.There is definately somthing wrong with how the rifle fires or the rifle model itself. Some of the screenshots showing the bullet falling low even at close ranges seems to be correct.I will aim intentionaly high next tiem I'm hunting and see if my accuracy improves. If it does then that would lean to the rifle model being bugged.As it stands, the gun model aims higher when in ADS than where the white interaction dot appears in the game, which also needs to be fixed as it's quite annoying.For reference I play at 1280*720. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerbob Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 I also have big problems when aiming the rifle, even at close ranges. The only time i'm 100% accurate is with a wolf running directly towards me and under 15 meters.I will aim intentionaly high next tiem I'm hunting and see if my accuracy improves. If it does then that would lean to the rifle model being bugged.As it stands, the gun model aims higher when in ADS than where the white interaction dot appears in the game, which also needs to be fixed as it's quite annoying.If you are aiming at the wolf's head and shoulders at close range , you are actually hitting it's chest, which is still a reasonable kill chance.Now that I've played with it, I've discovered that if I make my aim point half-way up the front post, I hit what I want to hit at ranges that I'm willing to shoot at (short).I've never even seen where the white interaction dot is when I'm aiming the rifle. I'm always concentrating on the sight picture.That said, despite figuring out how the rifle is broken, it's still annoying. 100% rifle means 100% rifle. If the team wants it to be inaccurate, don't let us repair it to 100%. Or give the sights obvious damage. Bend/break the front post. Whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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