Blowing the candle as I speak against art happening

[octavian]

Even though I've been explained that when somebody decided for TLD to be blue, art happened, I wish it never did.

[spoil]

[desrocchi]

Actually I see 2 different times of the day there.

And frankly I don't think I would be comfortable playing long sessions in a game with the color palette of the second image.

In that second image I see darkness coming, I would feel the hurry to find refuge for the night. And it also has a bit of a horror vibe to it.

[octavian]

Actually I see 2 different times of the day there.

Same picture, different colors.

[desrocchi]

Yes, I got that...

I was saying that the original one feels like dawn while the one you modified feels like it's nearing the twilight.

It's dark and creepy, that's why I said it gave away a "horror" vibe.

As much as it can be nice to look at as a still frame, I wouldn't like to play long sessions in such an environment.

[octavian]

I also wish snow was white rather than blue and, yellow, of all things.

[spoil]

[Scyzara]

I think the current color choice is much more pleasant for the eyes than a completely white & grey environment.

Even though less colors might be more realistic, it definitely wouldn't be very beneficial for the game if some players might get a migraine or headache after a few hours of playing. (Not everyone reacts to bright and/or mainly white screens this way ofc, but quite a lot of people do).

I thus prefer the current color settings, they're both more beautiful and less stressful to watch.

[octavian]

Desrocchi, there are infinite ways and colors schemes possible for the game to not be blue, I showed one of them.

What you're saying is you don't particularly like this one, what I'm saying is the way it looks now it's like having blue vaseline smeared into your eyes, and I needed a counterexample.

This is not my wish, to have it look like that precisely, this is my wish for it to lose its color cast.

Scyzara, if snow is blue and yellow because "quite a lot of people [sic]" get migraines because of a bright mainly white screen, it's just sad.

You know just as well as I do that snow is white, both in Berlin and Vancouver, Moscow and K2.

[spoil]

[Denyo]

I think the current color choice is much more pleasant for the eyes than a completely white & grey environment.

Even though less colors might be more realistic, it definitely wouldn't be very beneficial for the game if some players might get a migraine or headache after a few hours of playing. (Not everyone reacts to bright and/or mainly white screens this way ofc, but quite a lot of people do).

I thus prefer the current color settings, they're both more beautiful and less stressful to watch.

+1 on this.I agree with you.Altough it really does not seem so realistic,I must admit I have much less problems with my eyes and headache now,with this colour settings.

I wasn`t thinking about this purpose,why devs changed colours,untill I did read your reply.Now it makes completely sence for me and I am very glad,that devs are thinking that way,too.Now I can play game for hours,without getting pain in my eyes and headaches.Only thing i get are sleepy eyes after several hours of playing,which is understandable.

[Scyzara]

if the snow at my feet, those blue patches on the rocks to the left, the roof and so on, were less blue, you're saying quite a lot of people would get migraines because of a bright mainly white screen

It's well possible that you're one of those who can look at bright screens without any problems, but there are also people (including me) who can't. I even occasionally have a headache when the sky irl has a bright grey color (often happens in winter). And if I go skiing, I always have to wear sunglasses. Being sensitive towards brightness isn't much fun.

Have you ever wondered why many people find it more pleasant to read a book (or a text on a kindle e-book) than a text on a standart-monitor? Both displays are white, but brightness and color saturation are different.

Regarding these forums, I'm glad that the background color (as I see it on my screen) is a quite dark and not a bright white. I'm using a special gaming monitor (BenQ GL2460HM) with a particular brightness setting, no idea how dark or bright the forums look on other monitors.

All that being said, it might of course theoretically be possible for the devs to program white, yet at the same time not bright snow. But I'm not sure how well this would work for cheaper monitors (they might either display grey instead of white snow or too bright white snow).

Most players also like the current colorful art style, thus I don't see a reason to change it.

[Shanti]

I find it ironic that your pictures of snow actually have quite a bit of blue in them.

Snow *is* blue. Ish. In the color world, they would say that it's white with blue undertones. When the light hits it, it definitely gets brilliantly white, but mostly that's reflection.

If the devs want to accentuate that aspect of snow, I think it changes the feeling of the game. Blue is often a solitary, cold, and emotionless color, which might be the type of feeling they want to create in the player. I don't think it's wrong, just different.

Also, in your "blue and yellow" snow picture, I think it's important to note that the blue and white is the snow, the yellow patches appear to be reflected light, which is really cool, IMO, and not a poor color choice for the snow as you seem to think.

In your two examples at the very top, I think the second image you have achieved a sepia-tone feel, which has a very different feeling, and brings a lot of pre-conceived notions to what the game will be about. I personally prefer the blue and white look better - it fits with my own notions of how the game "feels", and what the game is about.

[octavian]

I find it ironic that your pictures of snow actually have quite a bit of blue in them.

Snow *is* blue. Ish. In the color world, they would say that it's white with blue undertones. When the light hits it, it definitely gets brilliantly white, but mostly that's reflection.

Right, so in TLD, light must not hit it.

So in those pictures, is snow a uniform color or splotched in various complementary colors, shades and places, like somebody spilled something?

The issue is that everywhere on the planet in any condition you want snow is a uniform, neutral color, except in TLD. And if snow is no longer neutral, it's either due to light scatter inside the snow layer, reflected colored light, a non-white source of light, or a white balance issue or choice. Neither of these affect just small, couple of meters in diameter, patches.

In your two examples at the very top, I think the second image you have achieved a sepia-tone feel, which has a very different feeling, and brings a lot of pre-conceived notions to what the game will be about. I personally prefer the blue and white look better - it fits with my own notions of how the game "feels", and what the game is about.

Like I was telling desrocchi,

there are infinite ways and colors schemes possible for the game to not be blue, I showed one of them.

What you're saying is you don't particularly like this one, what I'm saying is the way it looks now it's like having blue vaseline smeared into your eyes, and I needed a counterexample.

This is not my wish, to have it look like that precisely, this is my wish for it to lose its color cast.

I feel the need to stress that a blue color palette, and a blue color cast, are two different things. The latter is applied to everything, all the time, while the former is a favoring of blue, cold colors, above all else, while letting others, few as they may be, be what they are, not coated with a blue film.

Thanks.

[octavian]

It's well possible that you're one of those who can look at bright screens without any problems, but there are also people (including me) who can't. I even occasionally have a headache when the sky irl has a bright grey color (often happens in winter). And if I go skiing, I always have to wear sunglasses. Being sensitive towards brightness isn't much fun.

Sorry to hear that, it must be annoying. I wear sunglasses in those cases too, evereybody pretty much has to. Good thing they make us look badass 8-)

Regarding these forums, I'm glad that the background color (as I see it on my screen) is a quite dark and not a bright white. (I'm using a special gaming monitor with reduced brightness settings, no idea how dark or bright the forums look on other monitors. )

Great, if the snow was the background color of the forums, I'd be beyond happy.

Have you ever wondered why many people find it more pleasant to read a book (or a text on a kindle e-book) than a text on a standart-monitor? Both displays are white, but brightness and color saturation are different.

It's kind of part of my job to wonder about these things.

All that being said, it might of course theoretically be possible for the devs to program white, yet at the same time not bright snow. But I'm not sure how well this would work for cheaper monitors (they might either display grey instead of white snow or too bright white snow).

Nobody’s paying us to worry about that. We're just giving feedback. I don't think I should have to worry about that, even if I know it's a trivial thing to do, working with color half of my adult life. Come on, you're giving the answer yourself. If they make snow white, it doesn't have to be blindingly bright. The issue is its color, blue and yellow, in patches. Not the brightness, shade of gray.

Most players also like the current colorful art style, thus I don't see a reason to change it.

That's like saying most players want multiplayer or more guns or "something". It doesn't matter what most players want, or what we think most players want. What matters is if we can have a serious discussion on why the snow is ******* blue and yellow.

You’re from Germany, you can pay ~350 euros, hop on a train right this second, change three trains, and get off at Kleine Scheidegg at the foot of the Eiger in twelve hours. Right? That's from Berlin. Then take a picture, post it in this thread and go skiing. I'd have to take a ******* plane, ~500 euros just to get to Basel or Zurich. Luckily, snow's white here too, unfortunately, the Alps aren't here too.

I can't just hop on a plane. Maybe you can't hop on a train either. But you're going skiing, you know snow; even if you've never done a summit, you know what a mountain is. The Alps are on your doorstep.

It's extremely frustrating to see somebody that knows what it's like being on the slope not having a problem with snow being blue and yellow. It's not about realism, it's not about art, it's about common sense.

This is why I'm so pissed off. And it simply makes me sad, I'd understand if you never got out, but you go skiing, Germany, Alps, Eiger, Matterhorn, all just, there, more there than for me that's for sure, and you have no issue with the snow being blue and yellow. I'm... lost for words honestly.

It’s not about what the players want, or what the developers want, or what I prefer, or what you prefer, it’s about you and me, Scyzara and Octavian.

If you can look me in the eyes, adult to adult having an ordinary, open conversation, and honestly tell me that most players also like the current colorful art style, thus you don't see a reason to change it, if you honestly don’t get what I’m saying, you skiing Skyzara, presumably in the Alps, if you honestly don’t get what I’m saying then snow should really be blue and yellow, gray and white, varying in small, meter wide patches from place to place.

If snow happens to be blue and yellow here and there, and it doesn't matter to someone who knows, like me, what's snow and what's a mountain, I guess I don't actually know anything then.

[Ninjakebab]

I agree, Octavian. I actually really liked your 2nd picture example, even though it represents a counterexample in the extreme. If only the sky retained a bit more blue, I would prefer nr. 2 for sure. The blue is a bit cartoony.

About the brightness/migraine issue, that really should be up to the end user to tweak brightness settings on their own monitors. I have sensitive eyes too, and have my brightness all the way down. I can't watch TV in a dark room without pain, but I can avoid it by tweaking brightness settings. No issue.

[Scyzara]

If you can look me in the eyes, adult to adult having an ordinary, open conversation, and honestly tell me that most players also like the current colorful art style, thus you don't see a reason to change it, if you honestly don’t get what I’m saying, you skiing Skyzara, presumably in the Alps, if you honestly don’t get what I’m saying then snow should really be blue and yellow, gray and white, varying in small, meter wide patches from place to place.

If you ever come to Germany, we can gladly have a face-to-face conversation about my opinion regarding the relevance of snow colors in non-photorealistic video games. And I will look into your eyes and tell you that the unrealistic color of the snow doesn't bother me at all even though I know it is unrealistic. Just like I don't mind TLD's trees to be angular, wolf fur not to be agouti and deer eyes to be black dots.

Btw, I think it might be an option for you (and like-minded users) to decrease the color saturation of your monitors and increase brightness a bit for compensation. (You can also use the Windows screen calibration option to emphasize red and green if you want to keep these two colors intense despite the lower overall color saturation.) Like this you can probably have a more greyish sky/snow and still keep the red barn/green trees.

But I somehow assume you already figured that out given the apparent relevance of colors for you.

[octavian]

Then I have no idea what I'm talking about and this is the best snow will ever get. Good thing most players like it.

[spoil]