The update made this challenge absolutely ridiculous.

[InvaderNoodle]

Worse clothes, less loot at campfires, and now you need all the pages, and then get to Ash Canyon to banish it? 

Come on. I get this is a roguelite survival game. But the challenge was brutal enough before these changes. But I guess my punishment for not playing in October is me not getting the Feat ever. 

I feel like the developers cater too much to the hardcore gamers. Case and point the Darkwalker challenge. Make it even less accessible for a gal who doesn't  have 9 hours every day to dedicate to the game. 

And yeah, I'm salty. I'm salty because I had one day to finish the challenge when it was a proper event, I barely failed, and now the challenge is basically aimed at the best of the best. 

It's a single player game without leaderboards or competition, so why make a challenge inaccessible for more casual players? Is that really the direction this game is going? That casual gamers will never access some of the content? Because that's pretty lame. 

[Serenity]

Unless something has changed you don't have to banish it to get the badges and feat. That should be optional. Visiting 6 regions is enough. In the original you never had to visit all regions, which was indeed hard as it involves some backtracking that has to be well planned. But 6 is not too hard if you think about the routes and there are many options for it

Edited December 12, 2020 by Serenity

[Schrodingers Box]

if you “just barely” failed the challenge then the difficulty setting was just right. come on. Common sense. 

[InvaderNoodle]

2 hours ago, Schrodingers Box said:

if you “just barely” failed the challenge then the difficulty setting was just right. come on. Common sense. 

... That was before they changed it. Before they changed the clothing you spawn with and what spawns at campfires. Now I can't collect two pages without dying of hypothermia. Or did you just glaze over that part of my explanation? 

 

And the in-game description says you need to banish the Darkwalker. Not just escape, you need to banish it, which I've heard is done in Ash Canyon. I can't confirm the requirements since the changes made it so I can't get anywhere close to 6 pages. 

Edited December 12, 2020 by InvaderNoodle
Added info

[Schrodingers Box]

in that case you need to learn the maps better. playing interloper and advanced challenges like ATDS and ETDW are all about map knowledge. if you don’t know the maps they are impossible. 
    it’s not that the challenges are hard, - in fact on ETDW survival is not even a factor because it’s only on stalker difficulty so resources and clothing are so plentiful it’s not an issue to survive. the challenge is in not knowing the maps well enough which makes planning ahead fail.  it’s not about surviving it’s about getting to the next destination for a specific reason that you know about 2 maps ago. 
   for ETDW it’s best to use lure to make the darkwalker alway go away from the destination you ultimately are heading towards. don’t outrun him- outsmart him by making him cross-cross you as he heads in the opposite direction as you. of course this requires you to be 2 steps ahead at all times.... which requires knowledge of the map so you know where to place the lures. i recommend the route BI->FM->BR->FM->MT->HRV—>MT->Railway (do not take WR!!)->CH-DP->CH->PV->TWM->AC for the win. 
  if you can’t see the whole path in your head without looking at maps, you are not ready for the challenge yet. 

Edited December 12, 2020 by Schrodingers Box

[InvaderNoodle]

21 minutes ago, Schrodingers Box said:

in that case you need to learn the maps better. playing interloper and advanced challenges like ATDS and ETDW are all about map knowledge. if you don’t know the maps they are impossible. 
    it’s not that the challenges are hard, it’s that not knowing the maps makes planning ahead fail.  it’s not about surviving it’s about getting to the next destination for a specific reason that you know about 2 maps ago. 
   for ETDW it’s best to use lure to make the darkwalker alway go away from the destination you ultimately are heading towards. don’t outrun him- outsmart him by making him cross-cross you as he heads in the opposite direction as you. of course this requires you to be 2 steps ahead at all times.... which requires knowledge of the map so you know where to place the lures. i recommend the route BI->FM->BR->FM->MT->HRV—>MT->Railway (do not take WR!!)->CH-DP->CH->PV->TWM->AC for the win. 
  if you can’t see the whole path in your head without looking at maps, you are not ready for the challenge yet. 

I know the maps just fine. But you can't make it anywhere when you die from exposure because you have no time to properly search for clothes. And now it's even more ridiculous with having to actually banish it. 

I just think the challenge got its difficulty raised too much. It was fine the way it is, but people complained it was too easy and now its just silly. 

I understand what you're saying, but why add content the vast majority of players can't enjoy? They could've just added difficulty settings for challenges so the hardcore could do it on Loper for bragging rights and the casuals like me could do it on a pilgrim. It's not like it negatively affects other players how someone plays a single player game... But every challenge and new area added seems to just make the game more punishing and less accessible, and I think that's a shabby direction to take the game. 

Edited December 12, 2020 by InvaderNoodle

[Serenity]

Keep in mind that the darkwalker timer is real time. This means you can sleep as much as you want. If you are freezing just go inside and sleep or pass time.

You don't need have time to search everything, but there is enough for a cursory search. And with it being only Stalker there is plenty of clothing even if you don't look everywhere. Just do some key spots

And the in-game description says you need to banish the Darkwalker. 

On the badge description? It may not be 100% clear, but it when selecting the challenge and in the quest menu it never says that have to do it. "You might be able to banish it" and "knowledge will help you defeat the darkwalker" are not commands. I always understood it as an optional thing. An additional challenge you can pursue or an opportunity to continue playing Endless Night.

But every challenge and new area added seems to just make the game more punishing and less accessible, and I think that's a shabby direction to take the game

Most of the past challenges and events like Archivist, 4DON or Winter's Embrace were ridiculously easy and boring. There is plenty of the trivial stuff in the game

[therealgardenhose]

7 hours ago, InvaderNoodle said:

I know the maps just fine. But you can't make it anywhere when you die from exposure because you have no time to properly search for clothes. And now it's even more ridiculous with having to actually banish it. 

I just think the challenge got its difficulty raised too much. It was fine the way it is, but people complained it was too easy and now its just silly. 

I understand what you're saying, but why add content the vast majority of players can't enjoy? They could've just added difficulty settings for challenges so the hardcore could do it on Loper for bragging rights and the casuals like me could do it on a pilgrim. It's not like it negatively affects other players how someone plays a single player game... But every challenge and new area added seems to just make the game more punishing and less accessible, and I think that's a shabby direction to take the game. 

I don't get the complaint about clothing, I started in DP and by the time I got out of CH I had Rabbitskin Mitts and a Hat, plus a Mackinaw and a Balaclava which was more than enough and was warm enough for even PV + the rest of my clothes. I've not beaten the new version yet, but it's really not as challenging or punishing as you make it out to be.

[InvaderNoodle]

3 hours ago, Serenity said:

Keep in mind that the darkwalker timer is real time. This means you can sleep as much as you want. If you are freezing just go inside and sleep or pass time.

You don't need have time to search everything, but there is enough for a cursory search. And with it being only Stalker there is plenty of clothing even if you don't look everywhere. Just do some key spots

 

 

On the badge description? It may not be 100% clear, but it when selecting the challenge and in the quest menu it never says that have to do it. "You might be able to banish it" and "knowledge will help you defeat the darkwalker" are not commands. I always understood it as an optional thing. An additional challenge you can pursue or an opportunity to continue playing Endless Night.

 

 

Most of the past challenges and events like Archivist, 4DON or Winter's Embrace were ridiculously easy and boring. There is plenty of the trivial stuff in the game

So why not just add a difficulty setting for challenges instead? Then if you want to do Archivist on Interloper, you can. Seems like a pretty simple fix to both arguments. 

 

1 hour ago, therealgardenhose said:

I don't get the complaint about clothing, I started in DP and by the time I got out of CH I had Rabbitskin Mitts and a Hat, plus a Mackinaw and a Balaclava which was more than enough and was warm enough for even PV + the rest of my clothes. I've not beaten the new version yet, but it's really not as challenging or punishing as you make it out to be.

Try it now. Based on my experience it is a hell of a lot more punishing than it used to be. 

[therealgardenhose]

2 hours ago, InvaderNoodle said:

So why not just add a difficulty setting for challenges instead? Then if you want to do Archivist on Interloper, you can. Seems like a pretty simple fix to both arguments. 

 

Try it now. Based on my experience it is a hell of a lot more punishing than it used to be. 

I have, the attempt I was talking about was on the new version, I also got Mukluks in CH so I was more than fine. I had another run where I started in BI and the temp never went below 3 arrow decrease area, and the campfire there only gives you Longjohns and I made it out and no other region gave me trouble weather-wise. All this to say, it sounds like you're just using a bad strategy and-or you aren't repairing clothing or moving between campfires fast enough.

[Schrodingers Box]

Sorry but if you are complaining about clothing you do NOT know the maps very well at all. within 45 minutes you should have more than sufficient clothing to never worry about cold. because when you know the maps you know where to get clothing. 
   if you are struggling with food and clothing in this challenge you are simply not ready for it. after 1Hr you should be throwing extra food and clothes away. in fact after 2 hours you no longer need to loot to finish the game. 
 With all due respect you are playing a game that is too advanced for your skill level.  try playing interloper and when you can survive 500+days on interloper, you will find every challenge to be easy. but don’t play advanced challenges and complain when you are not an advanced player!!!

Edited December 13, 2020 by Schrodingers Box

[InvaderNoodle]

9 hours ago, Schrodingers Box said:

Sorry but if you are complaining about clothing you do NOT know the maps very well at all. within 45 minutes you should have more than sufficient clothing to never worry about cold. because when you know the maps you know where to get clothing. 
   if you are struggling with food and clothing in this challenge you are simply not ready for it. after 1Hr you should be throwing extra food and clothes away. in fact after 2 hours you no longer need to loot to finish the game. 
 With all due respect you are playing a game that is too advanced for your skill level.  try playing interloper and when you can survive 500+days on interloper, you will find every challenge to be easy. but don’t play advanced challenges and complain when you are not an advanced player!!!

So how would it affect YOU if there was a difficulty option for challenges? You could do Darkwalker on Interloper for your "advanced player" mindset, plebs like me could do it on Pilgrim. I don't see the argument here. You find it easy, so a difficulty option would make it challenging. I find it hard so I could turn it down to get used to things. Neither infringes negatively on the experience for literally anyone else. 

[Schrodingers Box]

wouldn’t affect me at all. I only ever play interloper. anything else is just too easy.  I mean-  when you can just sleep anywhere outside without a fire (or just one stick is enough to warm you up) and fill up on an MRE while knitting your expedition parka, you aren’t surviving.  you are just walking in the wilderness. 
  So whatever the hardest level is- that’s what I will play. right now darkwalker challenge is the hardest level so nothing changes for me.  If there was easy or hard levels you wouldn’t play the hard level. ETDW is a hard level. so don’t play it. 

Edited December 13, 2020 by Schrodingers Box

[Moilanen]

Yeah, the challenge is not hard if you do some pre-planning. Plan your route well and gather stuff when the Dark Walker is still slow, meaning when you have 1-5 pages. Rest of the game is pretty easy if you keep your distance and use paint cans wisely. I made it at my second run (first run ended with a moose mauling me when my flare gun was not loading properly, I think it was a bit bugged in the game...) and I still had like 5 paint cans left in the end and I even used them a lot. You have lots of time to gather what you need at start and you get good stuff from the loot by the green fires.

My route was not very good because I didn't know at a start that I need to get back to Ash Canyon. My trip was like this and I pre-planned it. Also got inside when needed and slep whenever I could. Make sure to use those Ward glyphs. You can sleep 3-5 hours with those at a time. So one can gives you full night sleep easily. Lot's of coffee and energy drinks to find also. I think I used 3 energy drinks and still had maybe 6 of those. Also had two adrenaline stims, but never used them. Had so good clothes I was not cold after about 3-5 pages at any point. Could also sleep outside without a fire if needed. Actually I didn't make any fires either except in the end just for fun when I waited Dark Walker to get me.

My trip was like this:

X Hushed River Valley
X Mountain Town
   Forlorn Muskeg
X Broker Railroad
  Forlorn Muskeg
X Bleak Inlet
X Forlorn Muskeg
X Mystery Lake
   Winding River
X Pleasant Valley
X Timberwolf Mountain
   Pleasant Valley
   Coastal Highway
   Crumbling Highway
X Desolation Point
   Crumbling Highway
X Coastal Highway
   Pleasant Valley
   Timberwolf Mountain
X Ash Canyon

Also I'm not a pro player and I'm not very good at interloper.I thinkfor interloper I need to find a good starting strategy and a little bit of luck. I have passed all the challenges succesfully so I'm not that bad either in this game, but what I mean is that you don't need to be reeaaally good player to pass all those challenges. Just do some pre-planning and think about the main goal. Don't hoard because you don't need to. It's a short run with a task, not a long haul survival situation.

 

[Schrodingers Box]

ETDW and ATDS are not survival challenges. they are planning challenges. 
  ETDW is all about planning and strategic use of the lure glyph. survival is not even a factor.  survival is only a factor in interloper levels. 

[therealgardenhose]

45 minutes ago, Schrodingers Box said:

ETDW and ATDS are not survival challenges. they are planning challenges. 
  ETDW is all about planning and strategic use of the lure glyph. survival is not even a factor.  survival is only a factor in interloper levels. 

I agree. ETDW isn't about looting every building in your sight and gathering resources, it's about moving as fast as possible between campfires and keeping a good pace against the Darkwalker. I beat it on my second try (first try I used an awful route) using the route you recommended above (best route I've tried yet btw) and it wasn't even too difficult, I had some close calls at points but using the lure glyphs as frequently as possible means your chance of avoiding the Darkwalker sky-rockets.

 

[InvaderNoodle]

See my problem isn't the Darkwalker. It's freezing to death while travelling because I'm not getting any clothing as I loot in passing at the start. 

[Schrodingers Box]

well invader, you are definitely not familiar enough with the maps yet for this challenge.  survival is not an issue in this game. it’s not even an issue in any level other than interloper.  keep practicing the basics before trying this challenge. you should be easily plentifully supplied with warm clothes and food within an hour.  the elements are a total non issue in this Challenge. they are a non issue in any level other than interloper in fact. so this is not an issue with game design, it’s an issue with your skill level for this challenge. 
  real garden- I also did it on second try. my initial mistake was I didn’t know you had to go to AC to banish him so I got caught in the fog having to backtrack and already used my fog glyph. that’s how I designed my current route- it offers only one single backtrack through CH and since by then 7 glyphs are collected and DW is pretty fast, I drop a lure at the DP fire and criss-cross the DW as I exit towards CH and by that time I am so far ahead of him I just coast right through to PV and TWM and AC without any backtracks and I have over 10 coffee and 5 go juices so I don’t even need to sleep- though there is plenty of time. I finished with 8 unused spray cans and 3 go juices.  I finished in 3hrs 52 mins. 
     pretty easy challenge for 6 difficulty 

Edited December 13, 2020 by Schrodingers Box

[InvaderNoodle]

3 hours ago, Schrodingers Box said:

well invader, you are definitely not familiar enough with the maps yet for this challenge.  survival is not an issue in this game. it’s not even an issue in any level other than interloper.  keep practicing the basics before trying this challenge. you should be easily plentifully supplied with warm clothes and food within an hour.  the elements are a total non issue in this Challenge. they are a non issue in any level other than interloper in fact. so this is not an issue with game design, it’s an issue with your skill level for this challenge. 
  real garden- I also did it on second try. my initial mistake was I didn’t know you had to go to AC to banish him so I got caught in the fog having to backtrack and already used my fog glyph. that’s how I designed my current route- it offers only one single backtrack through CH and since by then 7 glyphs are collected and DW is pretty fast, I drop a lure at the DP fire and criss-cross the DW as I exit towards CH and by that time I am so far ahead of him I just coast right through to PV and TWM and AC without any backtracks and I have over 10 coffee and 5 go juices so I don’t even need to sleep- though there is plenty of time. I finished with 8 unused spray cans and 3 go juices.  I finished in 3hrs 52 mins. 
     pretty easy challenge for 6 difficulty 

How do you get good enough clothes that early on? Like I said, it's temperature exposure that's killing me. 

[Schrodingers Box]

It’s more like how don’t you get good clothes? the temperatures on the map aren’t even remotely cold enough to even be a problem without decent clothes. You can complete the challenge easily without even having warm clothes. 
   if clothes are an issue start in a region of the map good for clothing like PV and head to the plane crash. But then you will have to backtrack through it. 
   but if clothes are your problem you are not going to succeed on this challenge.  clothes are not even remotely the issue.  There aren’t even any blizzards in the challenge. I can’t imagine what you are doing that you would possibly freeze to death. 
     What is your longest interloper run?  I don’t Understnd how you are possibly surviving even a just a week on interloper when you struggle with clothing in this challenge. 

Edited December 14, 2020 by Schrodingers Box

[Arran]

Those 2 new challenges with max 6 stars difficulty are not required for challenge mastery badge and are meant for advanced players only. I like them being difficult, it gives those advanced players high hurdle to beat.

[Swippity_Swappity]

On 12/13/2020 at 6:46 PM, InvaderNoodle said:

How do you get good enough clothes that early on? Like I said, it's temperature exposure that's killing me. 

You're dying of exposure? That wasn't an issue for me. Granted, I haven't gotten more than 4 pages, but still. I think you're spending too much time doing other things. My method was to make a path, and follow that path, to the T stopping only when absolutely necessary.

Edited December 24, 2020 by Swippity_Swappity

[UpUpAway95]

I agree with the OP... the comparative difficulty of these challenges has increased exponentially.  I think it's time they introduced varying difficulty levels to the challenges to re-encourage more timid players to at least attempt them.