Please enable feats progression in Custom Survival mode!

[ArcherAC3]

Custom games are in general much more difficult than Pilgrim, so I honestly do not see the point of not being able to progress my feats.

Both Stalker and Voyager are much less immersive, fun and likely not as hard than what I have with my custom settings. It's simply silly to be forced to play those not as exciting modes just so you can progress.

If the argument for this progression restriction is that Custom can make it too easy to progress, it makes zero sense that Pilgrim allows feat progression.

Quite honestly, this is a broken "feature" (restriction) and shouldn't even have been added.

[ManicManiac]

I don't think there's anything broken about it.

I like that there is no feat progression with custom.  A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

 

[Suggestion]:  If folks find it silly that we can obtain feat progression on Pilgrim but not Custom... then perhaps folks should just grind out the feats they want on Pilgrim or Voyager -whichever they like better- and then folks won't have to fuss about no feat progression on Custom... because it wouldn't even be an issue anymore. 

Side note... I'm fairly sure that Feat Progression is available on Pilgrim because it's an official difficulty mode (part of the intended curated experience in other words); and not one that is completely variable (that would be "custom").

Edited April 20, 2020 by ManicManiac

[ArcherAC3]

9 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

I don't think there's anything broken about it.

I like that there is no feat progression with custom.  A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

 

[Suggestion]:  If folks find it silly that we can obtain feat progression on Pilgrim but not Custom... then perhaps folks should just grind out the feats they want on Pilgrim or Voyager -whichever they like better- and then folks won't have to fuss about no feat progression on Custom... because it wouldn't even be an issue anymore. 

Side note... I'm fairly sure that Feat Progression is available on Pilgrim because it's an official difficulty mode (part of the intended curated experience in other words); and not one that is completely variable (that would be "custom").

Sorry, but that still makes zero sense.

Not allowing progression due to the players having a "custom experience", especially in a game such as TLD (with huge playthroughs and time spent) is extremely silly still - that's not even a proper reason.

So I pretty much cannot have an exact Voyageur experience but with intestinal parasites, higher animal perception distance and harder struggle while progressing because it's not one of the 4 limited presets - although it's right in between Voyageur and Stalker difficulty-wise? Sorry, but just no, that was the worst dev decision in this game so far.

Edited April 21, 2020 by ArcherAC3

[peteloud]

I would prefer to see Feat Progression in straight Voyager and Stalker modes only.  Completing those feats in Pilgrim or simplified custom games is too east and doesn't deserve the Feat award.

[ArcherAC3]

7 hours ago, peteloud said:

I would prefer to see Feat Progression in straight Voyager and Stalker modes only.  Completing those feats in Pilgrim or simplified custom games is too east and doesn't deserve the Feat award.

In the end - as aforementioned here - TLD is not a multiplayer game, much less competitive; so why does it matter that much to you or to the Devs?

You must spend a considerable amount of time to earn many of the feats (we are talking about hundreds to a thousand of in game days) - I got a real life so I would never spend that much time playing something I don't enjoy or in a way I don't enjoy for that long, even if for "grinding".

[Azdrawee]

21 hours ago, ManicManiac said:

I don't think there's anything broken about it.

I like that there is no feat progression with custom.  A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

 

[Suggestion]:  If folks find it silly that we can obtain feat progression on Pilgrim but not Custom... then perhaps folks should just grind out the feats they want on Pilgrim or Voyager -whichever they like better- and then folks won't have to fuss about no feat progression on Custom... because it wouldn't even be an issue anymore. 

Side note... I'm fairly sure that Feat Progression is available on Pilgrim because it's an official difficulty mode (part of the intended curated experience in other words); and not one that is completely variable (that would be "custom").

I'm sorry, but your suggestion solves absolutely nothing. Of course I can grind my feats in Pilgrim or Voyageur, but that absolutely defeats their purpose - not only that it would be really boring, but it would also provide no challenge, which is the entire point of feats, isn't it? They should be a reward for my previous achievements, not a grind.

I haven't tried to make the easiest custom difficulty possible, but I doubt it would be much easier than Pilgrim. Pilgrim alone is really really easy and getting all of the feats is not a challenge for anyone who spent at least 10 hours in survival mode. My preffered way to play (and a way that many other people like as well) is an Interloper level difficulty with guns enabled. I see absolutely no reason why I couldn't get feats for playing one of the hardest difficulties possible.

I absolutely agree with @ArcherAC3. TLD is a singleplayer game, and the way we experience it is completely our choice. I see absolutely no reason for this restriction.

[odizzido]

I personally don't use feats but I am always for people playing the game how they want to play it. I think the reason hinterland gave is that they're worried people will make a custom game even easier than pilgrim to get feats. I personally don't see that as a problem, but there is obviously a problem with people who only play custom games that also want to get feats.

 

Maybe hinterland could just disable feat progression if the custom game is too easy? That would at least help

[ManicManiac]

@Azdrawee
I don't recall if we've a similar conversation to this before, but either way I'm not interested in getting into a circular argument... esepcially when it will all boil down to a difference of opinion.

I do think the point remains:

On 4/21/2020 at 12:39 AM, ManicManiac said:

A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

Side note... I'm fairly sure that Feat Progression is available on Pilgrim because it's an official difficulty mode (part of the intended curated experience in other words); and not one that is completely variable (that would be "custom").

also, as I mentioned in The Long Dark Hotfixed to V1.69 [57923]:

Quote

I tend to agree with Hinterland that feats should not be earned through custom settings, I think the team made the right decision when they implemented that.  I know some of folks here don't agree, and I'm not interested in having the same tired debate

You may not agree, that's okay. 
I will point out that that this is my subjective point of view... and no amount of people fussing about wanting to earn feats through custom experiences will ever get me to think it's a good idea.  I'd prefer folks should play the game in the standard modes in order to earn feats. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In general, and for everyone else reading this post...

I think that the feats were meant to be a reward earned by playing the modes of the game that were intended by Hinterland, and not ones designed/tailored by players.  It's a simple thing to grasp and I think it's more than a fair trade off.

Custom was just a gift to us so that players could tune the game to better suit then or perhaps add or remove certain nuances.  I think that to have that kind of freedom of play and then still fuss about feat progression is kind of a, "I want my cake and eat it too" sort of situation. 

Folks might not like it (as this thread makes obvious), but I think Hinterland's decisions about their game should be respected.

Edited April 21, 2020 by ManicManiac

[ManicManiac]

15 hours ago, ArcherAC3 said:

Sorry, but that still makes zero sense.

It seems that's just because you are of a different opinion. 
It can be a natural tendency for folks to not consider any other point of view but their own.

15 hours ago, ArcherAC3 said:

extremely silly - that's not even a proper reason.

Just because you don't think it isn't a "proper reason" doesn't mean it's not one... it just means that you don't think it is.
And just because you may think it's silly, doesn't make it so either. 

15 hours ago, ArcherAC3 said:

So I pretty much cannot have an exact Voyageur experience but with intestinal parasites, higher animal perception distance and harder struggle while progressing because it's not one of the 4 limited presets - although it's right in between Voyageur and Stalker difficulty-wise? Sorry, but just no, that was the worst dev decision in this game so far.

Once again I can acknowledge that this is your opinion... but I can't abide that you seem to be making such a declarative statement when it's simply a personal point of view.
Just because it's your opinion doesn't make it true. 

However, on the other side...
You absolutely can play the way you describe! That's what custom settings are for.  You just can't do it and earn feats... which again, I think is a fair trade of for being able to tailor the experience to what best suits an individual. 

 

33 minutes ago, ManicManiac said:

Folks might not like it (as this thread makes obvious), but I think Hinterland's decisions about their game should be respected.

 

On 10/31/2019 at 1:05 AM, ManicManiac said:

[Addendum]
*What I'm talking about here is not referencing any particular post in this thread... this is more of an overall explanation of why and when I take the stances that I do.*

In my opinion too many people get hung up on convincing themselves that their opinions are objective truths and that they are right in whatever statement they are making (which of course objectively is not the case - opinions are subjective in their very nature).  The general idea of my comment was meant to convey that if we accept the game for what its... then our discussion about what we think the game 'could' be would be much less infused with people's personal emotional baggage  

The moment people start tossing around their opinion like they know better than Hinterland what's going to be best for Hinterland's game... that's when I tend to perk up.  Again I think it's great to talk about ideas folks have for this game... but I don't think people should make declarative statements when they are expressing very subjective points of view.  I think people also need to remember that when they post on a forum they are inviting discussion.  They shouldn't be surprised when people comment on their ideas.  Nor should they expect everyone to rally around their idea and praise it as "...the way, and the light..." but some folks here act like that.  They get genuinely upset if folks dare to not "take their side." 

The short version is:  I'm all for the sharing of ideas, but I think people need to stop getting bent around the axel over their opinions.  I think people would be happier if they accepted the game as is... and then talk about things whey would like to see change (instead of clamoring for change just because they are personally frustrated or don't like a certain aspect).  That difference in attitude changes the perspective and tone.  Instead of coming from an over inflated sense of entitlement, it becomes actual constructive feedback/criticism.

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by ManicManiac

[Azdrawee]

52 minutes ago, ManicManiac said:

A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

Side note... I'm fairly sure that Feat Progression is available on Pilgrim because it's an official difficulty mode (part of the intended curated experience in other words); and not one that is completely variable (that would be "custom").

Can you explain how exactly does the fact that it's an experience "tailored by the player" make it any less appropriate for feat progression? It doesn't make sense to me. I understand the argument about difficulty, but as we've estabilished earlier, Pilgrim is already extremely easy.

[ManicManiac]

@Azdrawee

The difference to me seems clear... the "standard" modes are designed and curated by Hinterland, and thereby represents "normal" play.

"Custom" is not curated by Hinterland, because it permits the player to modify and/or overhaul the experience to better suit their personal tastes.

Feats, I think, should be a reward for "standard" play... not our own custom version of the game.

Look, I'm not here convince anyone of anything... this is just how I see it, and I've said my piece more than a few times now.

On 4/21/2020 at 12:39 AM, ManicManiac said:

I like that there is no feat progression with custom.  A custom experience is one that is tailored by the player, and I think trading that for feat progression was a good call on Hinterland's part.

[also]

I think that the feats were meant to be a reward earned by playing the modes of the game that were intended by Hinterland, and not ones designed/tailored by players.  It's a simple thing to grasp and I think it's more than a fair trade off.

Custom was just a gift to us so that players could tune the game to better suit then or perhaps add or remove certain nuances.  I think that to have that kind of freedom of play and then still fuss about feat progression is kind of a, "I want my cake and eat it too" sort of situation. 

Folks might not like it (as this thread makes obvious), but I think Hinterland's decisions about their game should be respected.

I think these two posts already explained it pretty clearly.  I don't know how much more clearly I can illustrate it.  Weather folks agree or not, doesn't change my opinion of it.

I think Hinterland was correct in making the trade off between feat progression and the ability for players to customize the experience.

[Addendum]
I don't think the other opinions on this topic are wrong... I just don't agree. 

Edited April 22, 2020 by ManicManiac

[peteloud]

I get the impression that some players wish to attain the Feats awards when playing an easy customised version of the game.

 

If they wish to play easy-peasy games fair enough, but they should not expect to get the same award as someone who has battled through cold, starvation and wolves to get that award. 

 

Next they will be wanteing to use a mod where they can give themself the awards without having the inconvenience of playing the game.

[ManicManiac]

On 4/23/2020 at 9:15 PM, Dum_Gen said:

Which doesn't make any sense.

Really?  ...It seems like common sense to me.  I mean, the words and concepts are simple enough I think.  I even explain it a little more in the post your referencing.  At the moment I just don't have time to try and explain it more simply.

Also, I know I've went down this kind rabbit hole with you before "Dum_Gen."

I just don't have time for it right now

[Aurimas]

On 4/22/2020 at 12:40 AM, ManicManiac said:

I think people would be happier if they accepted the game as is... and then talk about things whey would like to see change

Sounds like Krishna or some kind of sect to me.. I'm guessing that's what Dum_Gen meant

[ManicManiac]

@Aurimas

If taken out of context, virtually anything can be misconstrued like that.
However, your comment kind of seemed to me like it was bait... so I'm going to leave it alone.

Edited April 24, 2020 by ManicManiac

[ManicManiac]

@Dum_Gen

I'm still not going take the bait. 
and if it's really not just bait for an argument, then I simply don't have the time to keep on trying to explain what I consider to be simple concepts and ideas.  Also, I just don't find circular arguments productive in any way...

So, fine... you think one way, and I think a different way.  I think it's best we just leave it at that.  

In short I'll say again: "No thank you, to Feat Progression on Custom."

Edited April 25, 2020 by ManicManiac

[ArcherAC3]

On 4/21/2020 at 6:40 PM, ManicManiac said:

 

On 4/22/2020 at 5:20 PM, ManicManiac said:

Feats, I think, should be a reward for "standard" play... not our own custom version of the game.

 

 

That's a massive logical leap I can't make sense of and simply too shallow to be a reason.

"We won't allow you feat progression because you changed the experience, however slightly, within allowed options we GAVE you".

It's just silly.

We could go further and say achievements should not be achievable because the experience is not as "intended", yet that's not the case and it wouldn't make any more sense.

Edited April 26, 2020 by ArcherAC3

[peteloud]

If some people want Feats to be easily achievable can they just not use a mod to give themself the Feat?

[Serenity]

2 hours ago, peteloud said:

If some people want Feats to be easily achievable can they just not use a mod to give themself the Feat?

Jeezus Christ. Enough with this simplistic, antagonistic nonsense. It's not about making things easy. You can also make things harder than the default difficulties. And if you take the Stalker or Interloper template and for example disable cabin fever you're still a lot harder than Pilgrim.

If you don't want things too easy, then you need argue that each individual setting has the possibility to disable feats if it's changed below Pilgrim levels.

[ArcherAC3]

8 hours ago, peteloud said:

If some people want Feats to be easily achievable can they just not use a mod to give themself the Feat?

Again, I don't want to waste time grinding to progress with the feats - not to say that there are no mods in the Xbox version (neither time capsule).

I just want to enjoy the game and play seriously while progressing, however slowly.

The preset modes are way too limited and imperfect in many ways. Stalker does a fair job on wildlife behaviour and by enabling intestinal parasites, but is way too much in terms of cold and hunger; voyager fixes these last points, but you can get so close to wildlife it becomes boring.

[odizzido]

It's funny but I am kinda the opposite of you archer. I disable parasites but have the cold turned up. It's nice that we have custom so we can change things to what we like.

 

edit--------

I would be for parasites from raw meat....but when I look at it, eating raw meat is already too risky compared to how easy it is to cook it anyways so it would never happen. Maybe eating raw meat should be less risky to tempt people into taking a chance. I mean, who actually eats raw meat?

Edited April 27, 2020 by odizzido

[Dahart]

What i don't understand in this discussion is, that for some people it seems to matter in which way other players have earned their feats.

So they maybe played a custom game that was very easy, and earned a lot of feats in a short time. So what? Why does it matter to you? Jealousy?

Can you not be proud to have achieved your feats by going through all the hardships you had in your game?? Actually, wouldn't that be something you could be bragging about if you felt so inclined?

All i'm saying is, what do you care? Let others play the way they want and if they want feats for that, so what?

[Sherri]

Waaait a minute... you can't progress feats on custom difficulty???

I literally am 18 days into my first ever sandbox on essentially Voyager with small tweaks. I was wondering why my feat progresses weren't increasing.

Man that sucks.

Seriously, who does it hurt to let people enjoy it their own way? 🤦‍♀️

Edited May 4, 2020 by Sherri

[odizzido]

Jim sterling talked about this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIWivb-8C1w

[markwars1972]

An idea...

Feats can be achieved in all modes, but only work in the modes you have achieved.  If you have all feats in Pilgrim, for instance, those feats only work in Pilgrim.  Custom feats would work in Custom but not in any of the official game modes...the same as the other four.

So the feat badges could be different colors or have a number/letter designation.  It would give everyone what they want, would allow super completionists to earn 5x the number of feats and would prevent anyone from losing a feeling of progression.

Thoughts?