Enough with the wrist spraining on slopes!!

[Deseoso]

It is only a small thing but it really niggles me. I worked in a ski resort before. I have spent many hours walking up and down ski slopes. I luckily never sprained an ankle while doing so but I came pretty close a few times. I can tell you from experience that I never, not once, even came close to spraining a wrist. Spraining a wrist while walking on a steep slope is not even a risk. There is zero possibility of it happening unless you actually fall down the slope which never happens in this game.

I fully agree with ankle sprains being a strong possibility on steep slopes. Wrist sprains? No chance. Spraining a wrist from walking on a slope is about as likely breaking a leg by putting your hat on.

[Lonelyloper]

Lol. I agree it's super annoying and doesn't seem right the way it is now.

I'm not sure, but in my mind though I think you get the sprain from the fact that your character falls and sprains their wrist while trying to break their fall, but the game just doesn't have a proper animation for it. That's what I think causes the wrist sprains anyway, and I find it easier to accept if I think of it like that. But yeah, it'd be nice if the sprain system was improved a bit lol. 

[Moll]

I would accept sprain wrist, if they animate a fall down a slope in first person. With frantic rotary view when falling, it probably brings some people Epilepsy or PTSD but i think its worth it. And wrist sparin turns into logical thing.

Edited November 6, 2019 by Moll

[Saws n Sins]

I personally believe the new sprain system should only be in effect if you're carrying too much. Makes sense, you don't see people in real life spraining their legs and wrists when walking on an incline. Now maybe when you're carrying stuff, but somebody that used to backpack all different kinds of terrain I just feel like the new sprain system is annoying when you barely have anything on you. 

The system should only give you sprains when you're over encumbered and or sprinting, slight taking a stroll with no weight on you shouldn't give random sprains.

[ajb1978]

When I was about 11, I tripped over something, stuck out my hands to soften the impact, and hyperextended the wrist.  I could barely move that wrist for a couple weeks.  So spraining a wrist while walking on a slope does make pretty good sense if you figure they lost their footing and landed on their hands wrong.

[Guest kristaok]

I admit the spraining is annoying at times, BUT it is realistic in the sense that naturally when people fall / trip they automatically (usually) stick their hands out to save themselves- thus they could in turn sprain their wrist.

[MarrowStone]

17 hours ago, Lonelyloper said:

your character falls and sprains their wrist while trying to break their fall, but the game just doesn't have a proper animation for it.

While I would love a falling animation, people can suffer from motion sickness or become disoriented from sudden camera changes that aren't cutscenes. The only other game I know of that had fully simulated falling in it is Miasmata. Some people loved it, others despised it. 

If we did go the "Simulated falling" route, I'd highly suggest that the camera flipping be optional for those who may not handle it too well medically. 

Also, I've injured my wrists from falling irl more than my ankles so it really just depends on the person I guess. Cold tendons and heavy packs increase sprain risk even more than normal conditions as well. 

[ThePancakeLady]

1 minute ago, MarrowStone said:

The only other game I know of that had fully simulated falling in it is Miasmata. Some people loved it, others despised it. 

I hated it. it did make me motion sick, just like *some* games in VR do (while others don't).  I would toggle it off if it were added- and it better have a toggle to allow me to turn it off, like we have for Camera Effects... which I leave on. The gimping with an ankle sprain does not bother me, it's true-to-life for me and my cane, lol. I see that view IRL, every day, any time I walk. And the blur effect when in pain closely simulates the blurred view and tearing up I get when my pain levels hit over 10/10, or I have a blinding migraine going on.

Wrist sprains when falling on a slope is realistic (notice I use no " " there, too...). Can't tell you how often I have sprained a wrist when I have fallen, on a slope of even on a flat surface, falling into a wall or onto the ground. 

I am a klutz IRL, I roleplay my characters like they are as well. Though they get hurt less often than I do IRL, lol. 

[Deseoso]

While it is true that falling over and catching yourself with an outstretched hand can cause you to sprain a wrist, all the slopes in this game are covered in a heavy snowfall. The snow makes it extremely unlikely that you would sprain a wrist falling over. Plus this game simply doesn't have a falling over mechanic.

Sprained ankles is definitely a risk, even more so because you are walking in snow.

[ThePancakeLady]

1 hour ago, Deseoso said:

While it is true that falling over and catching yourself with an outstretched hand can cause you to sprain a wrist, all the slopes in this game are covered in a heavy snowfall. The snow makes it extremely unlikely that you would sprain a wrist falling over. Plus this game simply doesn't have a falling over mechanic.

Sprained ankles is definitely a risk, even more so because you are walking in snow.

Nothing personal. but are you a sports medicine doctor or physical therapist? It is entirely possible to sprain your wrist falling in the snow, on a slope or flat surface. Been there, done that, a good number of times. I was a backpacker, a caver, a rock climber, a hiker... in all 4 seasons. And a klutz, in all 4 seasons.  You may never have had it happen to you, but that does not mean it can't happen, or doesn't happen.

And the game does have a "falling over" mechanic. It just does not have an animation for it. 

[NardoLoopa]

Just a sprain?  Consider yourself lucky.  A friend actually broke his arm falling over on a slope with a pack on -- tried to catch himself.  Wasn't a fun trip back home.

[Guest jeffpeng]

On 11/6/2019 at 7:49 PM, Moll said:

it probably brings some people Epilepsy or PTSD but i think its worth it

That's a pretty "nice" way to look at it. 

On topic I would concurr with wrist sprains being very unlikely and should only happen at the smallest of chances, but if we are sticking with realism here then please also make it so that your hand is borderline useless for weeks, you keep dropping things, can't loot containers anymore while holding a light source, lose health when you accidentally try to use it, and overall feel miserable (maybe have some spotaneous outbursts of rage kicking things - which also might sprain your ankle).

Doesn't sound too appealing? Hm! Maybe one could rework the system then so that the chance to contract a sprained wrist is relatively high, but it actually heals super fast, in, let's say, 2 hours.

[ManicManiac]

As to the wrists, I think folks here are correct in that spraining wrists is a perfectly legitimate/resonable risk.  I've walked though it before, so I will include it below.

The short version is that your sprain risk isn't just representing the risk of rolling an ankle, it's more representative of your risk of sprains from, "Slips, Trips, and Falls."  I think this has less to do with OPs life experience and more to do with a misunderstanding of what the sprain risk represents.

I agree with folks here that if you slip, trip, or fall... there is a legitimate and reasonable risk of spraining a wrist as our survivor reaches out to try and catch themselves.  (it's literally a reflexive action...)

Regardless of the finer details... is super easy to avoid sprains in most cases.  My self for example, I almost never get sprains at all any more... and the ones I do get are very well deserved (goating around and trying to climb high places for the purposes of mapping - yeah I get a lot of sprains from that, but it makes sense because I'm climbing around on steep slops and risky paths)  I explain more below:

On ‎11‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 1:03 AM, ManicManiac said:

As to how I avoid sprains... it's in keeping with how Raph described the mechanic:  Even when I am encumbered, I just pay attention to the feedback the mechanic gives me.  If I'm traversing up a slope or even small hill and I see the sprain risk indicator, the game is telling me two things.  The first thing it's telling me is that I am currently on what's considered a treat to "rolling my ankle or tripping and spraining my wrist" (this explains why sometimes we might see a sprain indicator pop up on what might seem "a little bump in the snow") - that's essentially a trip hazard (it's not just about really steep slopes).  The second thing that indicator is telling me is that if I keep moving on this hazard (as in continuing to walk along, ignoring the warning indicator) that I could slip, trip, or fall at anytime and suffer a sprain. 

As I've played it seems evident to me that the sprain indicator is all about time...  I mean yes there are many factors (fatigue, encumbrance, slope angle severity, RNG rolls... so on, and so fourth) but what I noticed common to all instances of slope & sprain is time.  It may seem counterintuitive (I ask folks to please remember - sometimes a video just needs to video game), but once on a surface that triggers the sprain warning indicator is when the game will start making rolls against the modifiers on whether or not a sprain is triggered.  It appears to do this in increments (and I've never witnessed it being immediate - in other words there is always time between when we first see the indicator to when we eventually see a sprain) so there is time to act.  All we need to do is get to a surface that does not trigger the sprain risk warning.

The idea is to keep exposure to the risk low.  If you are climbing up a slope and you get find yourself in a risk condition you can either leave the slope, you can find spots along the slope that perhaps are not steep (like on boulders/rocks along the way that have a flat surface you can sort of "rest at" to remove the risk indicator and "reset the system"), and you can also sprint.  I know that sounds nuts, but think about it.  If you are going up a slope and you just have a little ways to go, but your get sprain risk indicator... you can roll the dice and sprint the rest of the way.  That way, you are at least decreasing the exposure time to the risk factor, and therefore "roll the dice" fewer times.  This increases your chances of getting up over that slope before you hit a sprain.

So, while sprains are a real thing to worry about when traversing the world of Great Bear, there are ways to minimize that risk.  However if a player chooses to traverse a lengthy stretch of slope, then that player also needs to accept the risk they are choosing to take.  Trapesing around on slopes or trying to goat up the terrain, then sprains are deserved in those cases.  It's super easy to get around the maps and even avoid wolves and bears without needing to skirt steep slopes (I know a lot of us old timers got used to spidering around all over the place with relative impunity).

(and remember we don't need bandages or pain pills... we just need a place to sleep for 2-4 hours depending on what we've hurt - save those bandages for wolf and bear bites)

Ultimately, I think it comes down to two factors...

- Perhaps some are still experiencing bugs (causing the mechanic not to function the way Raph described as the intended function).
- Perhaps some are still going recklessly over every hill and dale without regard to the feedback the game gives them.

In both cases, I'd day is not a problem with the mechanic itself.  I don't doubt some are still having real problems, but I'm not convinced it's because of the mechanic itself.  I'd be more inclined to believe there is a technical problem or a player problem. 

Edited November 7, 2019 by ManicManiac

[Kaisentlaia]

Good points @jeffpeng and @ManicManiac.

Personally, I always saw that wobbly screen animation as a simplified representation of "you tripped and sprained your wrist trying to steady yourself", so I don't see anything wrong with this mechanic. I managed to hurt my hands really bad once by tripping and falling on a slippery sidewalk and I wasn't even on a slope, wrist sprains while walking on a snowy slope make perfect sense to me.

[Hilayla]

I tripped and caught myself on a wall. Didn't even fall. Sprained my wrist. My daughter fell off a swing set when she was a kid and broke both wrists. She wasn't even swinging, just sort of sitting there kicking her foot against the ground.  I made the doctor do a bone density test on her because I'd never heard of someone breaking both wrists at the same time and I was in my 30s before I broke a bone. My ankle. walking through a muddy horse pasture and stepped on a piece of wood that was buried. Well half my foot stepped on it which caused it hyper-extend outwards. Who knows what's under that snow that could trip us up.

[ThePancakeLady]

Here's the thing...

If sprains bother you, you can turn the sprain mechanic completely off in a Custom Settings game. 

And if you are okay with the sprain mechanic, but the wobbly gimping camera view bothers you or causes vertigo for you- you can turn that off in the Options menu, no Custom Settings needed.

[Admin]

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