stalker Mode: Predators realism

[Ms Nutcracker]

I spawn near the camp office and found no food and had to venture of into the lakes and there were wolves scouting the ice lake. I think 2 of them. So has anyone survive like this? Even walking to the rails was hard as a wolf attack me from behind. Nothing no clothing or food at the office camp.

So i wonder how you survive.

Update:

This now is about adding realism to the predators of TLD.

[pikkue]

By collecting tools, harvest gut, craft snares and den: Bunny farming

Get some more experience in venture, its worth it!

[TLDFAN]

Stalker mode is not for the majority of players, it also is not for new players. I don't think most players enjoy their deaths being cheap or at the ridiculous pace they come from wolf attacks.

I don't want to say the game is cheap but my patience for Wolf attacks at the intensity level and frequency is wearing a bit thin on Stalker. I like the challenge of having fewer resources available and harsher weather, but out of the last 20 attempts all 20 are Wolf deaths. A substantial number coming from exits to buildings where my health is near full and I am armed with something, maybe not a knife but something and still dying. Wolf attacks in Stalker are the new "food poisoning" I understand being attacked by a Wolf because it wants to eat you and it is a predator should be injurious or even lethal in some circumstances but the whole mechanic is just amped up too much in Stalker. There are some areas on the lake where you can literally drag 5-6 wolves together and your only way surviving that is to run or toss a few flares or start shooting. With the fact Wolves don't run when they hear a gunshot you need to be pretty accurate too.

It is probably more unrealistic and most situations right now.

[Hylander]

Wolf attacks only happen a lot if you (a) aren't paying attention, or (b) are deliberately provoking them.

Its almost always possible to avoid wolves. Even when they growl at you, you can still run faster than them.

[pulkmees]

Yeah by abusing the game mechanic, which is frankly unrealistic and note very intuitive.

And no you can´t simply avoid them by paying attention.There´s like 4-5 near the townsite.Lots of high snowbarriers and hills, where they can come at you and you can´t just peak or jump to see if they are really close.They start running at you from behind a freakin building.

[Bill Tarling]

There are a lot of Stalker mode players at 50, 75, 100, and 200+ days survival [without just hibernating in one place]... most of us spend the majority of time travelling between locations, on both maps. It takes a lot of practice to know how to maneuver around the wolves, as well as how to lead them where you want - but it's not hard once you grasp the techniques.

[Hylander]

I certainly don't abuse the game mechanic. I've described in other posts how I handle wolves. I've spent probably 100+ days in the Quonset hut on Stalker, and I go in and out multiple times a day. You have to be careful, and pay attention, but it isn't impossible.

[Bill Tarling]

I certainly don't abuse the game mechanic. I've described in other posts how I handle wolves. I've spent probably 100+ days in the Quonset hut on Stalker, and I go in and out multiple times a day. You have to be careful, and pay attention, but it isn't impossible.

Exactly... each long run player has their prefered technique for handling the wolves - which shows it's not only possible, but also that there are quite a few ways to deal with them and survive. What Hylander says is true for most of us who play long Stalker runs "you have to be careful and pay attention".

As well, you learn to weigh your options quickly when unexpected wolves suddenly show up nearby... It all takes practice

[John Dow]

I absolutely agree.

Wolves are hard, but not impossible to handle. If they get you from behind, you might have bad luck by them one-hit killing you (the so called uberwolves). This can be seen when you died by 'shock'.

Aand... wolves are not intended to be superrealistic so far, as the programmers clearly stated. Could have to do something with the electromagnetic storm

This game gives impressive moments in surviving, as for example in my current run with more than 100 days, 3 wolves blocked my ways in Costal Area back to the train. I was desperately trying to get around them with flares and as soon I managed to scare one off another started to hunt me. After an infight I had to give up and return, freezing and dehydrated, reaching the next hut back where I knew there was still water in the toilet. I literally jumped into the closet with 1% condition left and survived...

Never give up !

[FoneBoneJay]

I certainly don't abuse the game mechanic. I've described in other posts how I handle wolves. I've spent probably 100+ days in the Quonset hut on Stalker, and I go in and out multiple times a day. You have to be careful, and pay attention, but it isn't impossible.

Exactly... each long run player has their prefered technique for handling the wolves - which shows it's not only possible, but also that there are quite a few ways to deal with them and survive. What Hylander says is true for most of us who play long Stalker runs "you have to be careful and pay attention".

As well, you learn to weigh your options quickly when unexpected wolves suddenly show up nearby... It all takes practice

Spoken by the guy who travels naked in the game. Yeah the mechanics in Stalker are great but the Wolves are over concentrated and in some areas you never see them. It is too fake. You should have a chance of encountering wolves anywhere and you should also be able to get into the higher value areas without having to face a gauntlet of wolves to get in there. The developers need to create more depth of the challenge. If it is one dimensional, and wolves are the only immediate threat that makes them cheap. The doors should be locked on some of the higher value areas, requiring a break in, and or removing obstacles, or require digging in to get into them, or a window entry with the chance to suffer a twisted ankle on entry or exit. Etc... Right now its Wolves wolves wolves wolves. ...and unrealistic wolves at that. The Wolf AI needs some more depth and variety too.

[FoneBoneJay]

3 additional deaths this weekend, all wolves. Yeah we need an adjustment even on Stalker. The game needs some air taking out of the CHEAP-O Tires were riding on

[Hylander]

I'm on day 24 in my current Stalker game - I've survived eight wolf attacks so far this game (granted, two of the eight were a double-attack, where I ended up with 7% health).

And no, I don't use any macro keys or helpers or anything. The way to survive a wolf attack is rapid left-click to build up to max strength, and then rapid right-click five or six times, and then repeat. The wolf normally runs off on either my first or second set, and I end up losing as little as 15%, or as much as 50%.

[FoneBoneJay]

I'm on day 24 in my current Stalker game - I've survived eight wolf attacks so far this game (granted, two of the eight were a double-attack, where I ended up with 7% health).

And no, I don't use any macro keys or helpers or anything. The way to survive a wolf attack is rapid left-click to build up to max strength, and then rapid right-click five or six times, and then repeat. The wolf normally runs off on either my first or second set, and I end up losing as little as 15%, or as much as 50%.

So you are completely satisfied with Wolf implementation right now?

[Hylander]

No, I didn't say that. What I said is they are not impossible to deal with.

[gamel]

I spawn near the camp office and found no food and had to venture of into the lakes and there were wolves scouting the ice lake. I think 2 of them. So has anyone survive like this? Even walking to the rails was hard as a wolf attack me from behind. Nothing no clothing or food at the office camp.

So i wonder how you survive.

In 30 games in stalker, I've died almost only to wolves. But in fact, wolves alone are not very dangerous. It's rather the combination of some of the following elements which is lethal : wolf, low condition, fog, wind, cold temperature, encumbered and above all, carelessness and impatience.

Only go out when the weather is ideal (no wind, no fog), when the temperature is ideal (> -10°C if possible), don't hesitate to sleep a couple of hours when necessary to wait for the weather to change. It's very unlikely to have good temperatures before 1 PM though, so generally you should be out between 2PM and 8PM.

Be extra careful with wolves, keep your distance and run in a straight line when they chase you. They always give up eventually. Keep some pieces of meat on you to distract them (F4). Don't make stupid mistakes like looting the fishing cabins when wolves are around.

DON'T GET TRAPPED IN SEMI-CLOSED STRUCTURES like the fishing hut over the unnamed pond, or the derailment wagon. Hindered wolves are buggy atm, they tend to build up some attack power because of the frustration and become überwolves who literally ONESHOT you. I'm not kidding. There are many accounts of such attacks (myself included, twice), which occur after trying to take shelter in semi-closed places where the wolves are still waiting for you outside.

[FoneBoneJay]

The one shots are the specific issue I am referencing that and the very shallow depth of the Wolf AI in general.

In fact I can summarize what Wolves so pretty quickly.

A. Walk back and forth on a linear pattern

B. Turn towards you on a dime when they detect you.

C. Begin to approach you rather quickly

D. Maintain a small distance away determining fight or flee when you weild a lit flare or are standing near a campfire.

E. Attack if you do nothing.

F. Run if you toss the flare at them or walk away from them slowly in a direction that draws them towards the fire, then they run from the fire.

I state the case for the #1 killer of players in this game that the AI is really shallow. Wolves should less predictable, more tenacious, more of a "stalker" and more deadly, they should also be less of a pain in the ass because the game needs them to run security.

[ChillPlayer]

That's my main beef with Stalker, until day 150 it's main difficulty comes solely from more and aggressive wolves. Once you don't have any bullets, the other factors of stalker begin to play a bigger role, but until then the game is rather a wolf hunter simulator, survival in stalker simply means to not get caught by a wolf. I hope that with future updates the devs will find more clever ways than simply adding lots of wolves to make stalker more difficult. Because in time you become so proficient in dealing with wolves that it's no longer a challange, only an annoyance.

[FoneBoneJay]

That's my main beef with Stalker, until day 150 it's main difficulty comes solely from more and aggressive wolves. Once you don't have any bullets, the other factors of stalker begin to play a bigger role, but until then the game is rather a wolf hunter simulator, survival in stalker simply means to not get caught by a wolf. I hope that with future updates the devs will find more clever ways than simply adding lots of wolves to make stalker more difficult. Because in time you become so proficient in dealing with wolves that it's no longer a challange, only an annoyance.

Exactly they aren't a challenge they are an annoyance. Wolves should come out of nowhere, they should stalk, they should only be detected on the rarest of occassions when you are actively looking for them. They should not be as they are now. They are also treated too much like a guard dog with shit vision in the game. This is not how they should behave or the kind of threat they should present. They need better and more varied AI.

[Ms Nutcracker]

Thanks for that so you need to walk? But you need a good idea of the map to find the right place. Cause as said like me if you spawn near the office well there is nothing to eat. Only like one bar and before you notice it your dead. so you need a snare. It just food and how do you find food?

Wolves are easy to get by just run when they see you. But if they come behind then well your dead. But they are like guards on the ice sheets just watching out for that human. Is that realistic? It should be that resource is low and so they go out hunting and that means if they sniff you out they will be more then wanting to attack you. That is hard core, you take their resources now they are out for revenge and will hunt you to live. Perhaps that can be an idea? Wolves increase in attack if all their food is gone?

So that means if that happens that if the dev decided to have it they needs to be an ecosystem. Where if you kill too much rabbit or any other resources you can tip the balance of the predators and they will come and hunt you. Or you can starve cause you killed all the rabbits, forage all the potatoes, killed all the fish.

So you got manage the resources out there in a smart way. You can fish and that wont cause all the fish to die cause your only doing it.

Actually that make sense. Unless you go out on a killing spree then the resources can never be gone? However you can set it to hard mode and then it will make it so resources are very low so all the predators will start to hunt you!

Imagine that wolf stalking you at late afternoon and scratching your door to find a way in! Cats do it and wolves are very smart! If there is way into the hut it will get in! Other smaller predators can get in too also. But wolves are the ones to fear at night.

I like the idea that they should be like guards watching over the thin ice ready to attack you but seek you out cause that is how they should act.

Even the bear too!

I think this mode is like less resources and see how long you can survive!

[TLDFAN]

Have nothing against challenge, but everything tells me the artificial nature of the AI and mechanics isn't going to hold a player base looking for deep immersive realism and compelling gameplay. I don't want to tunnel vision just on wolves but it is definitely an area that should be marked for major for improvement.

Can we get some comments or direction from some of the community management folks on what direction the developers are looking to go with AI/wolves, and what we can do to help see it improved?

[pulkmees]

Wolf attacks only happen a lot if you (a) aren't paying attention, or (b) are deliberately provoking them.

Its almost always possible to avoid wolves. Even when they growl at you, you can still run faster than them.

Running faster than wolves is abusing the game mechanic in my opinion, I´m pretty sure you shouldnt be able to ourun them EVER.My first death was literally caused by not knowing that.8 minutes into the game survived, spawned next to a wolf.It started to come towards me, I thought nope, I can´t outrun that thing, stayed in place, died because I couldnt figure out the build attack thing fast enough(which is a fine mechanic in itself, I like it)

I am paying attention and I´m definitely not provoking them.Whatever you do to actually avoid them makes sense ONLY by this games´ rules, meaning I can´t use logic to avoid them.If I can see them from a far I obviously go around them in a big circle, but if they

Why should I use some weird tactic that only works in this game(where main selling point is to be quite realistic in general) ? To play the montony game for 150 days ? And by weird tactic I mean expecting them to come out of nowhere(10m away) and/or planning your trip in some overcomplicated manner, which has no real world counterpart because you simply cant look out the window or peak around a corner.

Wolves don´t just spawn in out of freakin nowhere.You can´t plan ahead, you dont have a mental map of their location in this game.They spot you from behind buildings for christs sake.

[TLDFAN]

Wolf attacks only happen a lot if you (a) aren't paying attention, or (b) are deliberately provoking them.

Its almost always possible to avoid wolves. Even when they growl at you, you can still run faster than them.

Running faster than wolves is abusing the game mechanic in my opinion, I´m pretty sure you shouldnt be able to ourun them EVER.My first death was literally caused by not knowing that.8 minutes into the game survived, spawned next to a wolf.It started to come towards me, I thought nope, I can´t outrun that thing, stayed in place, died because I couldnt figure out the build attack thing fast enough(which is a fine mechanic in itself, I like it)

I am paying attention and I´m definitely not provoking them.Whatever you do to actually avoid them makes sense ONLY by this games´ rules, meaning I can´t use logic to avoid them.If I can see them from a far I obviously go around them in a big circle, but if they

Why should I use some weird tactic that only works in this game(where main selling point is to be quite realistic in general) ? To play the montony game for 150 days ? And by weird tactic I mean expecting them to come out of nowhere(10m away) and/or planning your trip in some overcomplicated manner, which has no real world counterpart because you simply cant look out the window or peak around a corner.

Wolves don´t just spawn in out of freakin nowhere.You can´t plan ahead, you dont have a mental map of their location in this game.They spot you from behind buildings for christs sake.

Agree, agree, and agree! Why try to outrun, maybe an injured wolf you could outrun but seriously wolves can hit 30-40mph. We're hard pressed to hit 20mph. The road is a good speed modifier but seriously its not realistic at all.

I see there are two schools of thought here and I just can't respect the one that says essentially... Wolves are fine change your behavior over them or learn to deal with their fake behavior Vs. Lets change them to be more lethal more real and more of a stalker than a lame add on.

-TLDFAN

[John Dow]

"As the result of the geomagnetic disaster which servers as part of the fictional foundation of the game, we have taken liberties with the portrayal of wildlife behaviour. This geomagnetic disaster will be explained in the Story mode. We are not attempting to create "realistic" wildlife behaviour in the game.

We know that Wolves do not typically attack people."

Is that really so hard to understand ?

[chicks]

"As the result of the geomagnetic disaster which servers as part of the fictional foundation of the game, we have taken liberties with the portrayal of wildlife behaviour. This geomagnetic disaster will be explained in the Story mode. We are not attempting to create "realistic" wildlife behaviour in the game.

We know that Wolves do not typically attack people."

Is that really so hard to understand ?

And the purpose of this semi aggressive comment in a peaceful discussion is...?

Personally, I love the wolf AI in normal. It seems to fit okay. There IS too much stuff to grab around IMHO and some dumb thing like not being able to salvage curtain and boxes for wood and etc, but hey, this is alpha so np.

Wear wolf coat and some wolf actually run from you haha (or maybe that was the gun? Anyway, it happened)

[John Dow]

"And the purpose of this semi aggressive comment in a peaceful discussion is...?"

It just is not about expecting realistic behaviour of the wolves and it's not abusing game mechanics...

I wanted to post this reminder, and maybe should have left out my comment, sorry.