Milton Mailbag -- Dispatch #24

[Raphael van Lierop]

Hello community!

I wasn't able to get the Dev Diary finished this week, but it should be out next week! Fingers crossed. There's lots to talk about. Also, we're working on another hotfix which should land early next week, on all platforms. 

And now, to the Mailbag.

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Question from @smaointeoireacht:

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On Trapper's Homestead in survival, why are the windows always lit at night regardless of Aurora? Is this purposeful or a hangover from Wintermute? It just seems strange that this is the only building that does this, and there is never any source of light inside the Homestead to cause it either.

This is a bug.

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Question from @Skelegutplays:

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Why is the box of crackers so large? It looks like there would be 500 grams minimum in it.

Conspiracy from the cracker companies, I guess. They fill the box with air and you think you are getting value when in fact, you are not.

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Question from @Morrick:

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What's behind the boarded door inside Milton's Post Office? Your secret office, right? Where you take care of these Mailbags. 

It's Fluffy's hushed casket. She's waiting.

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Question from @Smellyfries:

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How much has the game changed sense you first brought it into Early access all those years ago?

You tell me!

From my perspective -- it's changed a lot, and also very little. The core game is the same as it was when we brought it to Early Access. But the scope, depth, level of polish, and amount of content is *vastly* increased and improved. The world is about 10-15x bigger than it was. Significant new systems have been added. Every single asset has been overhauled at least once, some 2-3 times. The overall style has remained the same but every texture has been retouched, the renderer is entirely new, the post-FX system is entirely new, new animation system, new UI, etc. We added 15+ hours of narrative-driven WINTERMUTE gameplay which is already about 3x more than we had originally scoped the game to be in our Kickstarter (where I think we promised like 5-7 hours TOTAL for the entire game), and we still have three episodes to go.

But, for all that change, I think you can play a build from 2014 and see the core of the game there, and it still feels like that. I'm not sure what that means, but I think it's a good thing.  

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Question from @Sito:

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Hi Raph, one of the things I really like about HRV is to find random stuff when exploring out of the way areas. For example, I wandered up some out of the way hill and found a rifle leaned up against a tree. Golden!

Would you consider adding more random items in the other maps to make exploration more exiting? In ML for example, I know every square metre and know that there is nothing to be found up that ridge or behind that cliff, so I don't bother going there anymore. I think some random treasure like an old campfire with a pot in some out of the way place would make each new start a new experience. 

 

Yes. I think we should probably refresh all our loot tables and all our "random" spawns, just to shake things up a bit for our long-time players. It'd be a fair bit of work and would probably irritate some people but I think it'd be worth it.

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Question from @muoz:

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Have you considered programming randomized loot tables?

We do have loot tables, and have had for a long time. We also have items with a % spawn chance in the world, outside loot tables. We also have some items on a random spawner so we can say there are X in this region but they will spawn in one of Y locations. We have 3-4 different systems (SYSTEMS -- not tables -- we have dozens and dozens of loot tables, ex. every container type in the game has a loot table) that handle where and when loot appears. But yes, we could always improve these!

In terms of truly RANDOM loot tables -- I think a better approach is a blend of somewhat certainty around some critical items, and a sense of randomness about more common things. Some of the tools in the game -- ex. Rifle, Hatchet, Knife, Prybar, etc. -- if the loot tables were truly random, there'd be a chance these items would not spawn at all, ever, but you wouldn't know that, so you'd keep looking for them, and potentially never find them, then die because you got "bad rolls" and then you'd wish someone had hand-placed them the way we do right now.

I think we can refresh the loot placement but I don't think going full random is the right solution. Also, many of the same people who feel the loot locations are too familiar/known are also the ones reading wiki entries that tell you exactly where to find the guaranteed spawns, and these wiki entries are often populated using data that was extracted from the game, info we don't give to you and don't want you to see, because it -- surprise -- makes the game feel too predictable.

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Question from @Azdrawee:

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After fighting the Old Bear, Jeremiah kicks you out of his homestead and you can't go back. The game puts everything you had in his cabin in your inventory. I can't help but wonder... why? To me, it was quite a hude problem, because I was REALLY encumbered. I've also read some posts from different players that couldn't even move and they thought it was a bug, since they couldn't reach the door and see that it's locked.

Because the alternative was locking you out of the cabin with all your stuff still inside. I thought our solution was pretty fair.

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Question from @amadeuszbx:

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Straightforward question: do you plan to add option to sleep on the floor (like anywhere, even on snow)?

I'm asking cause it seem highly unrealistic (not it's-just-a-game unrealistic, but really unrealistic) that characters stay up until they die of exhaustion instead of passing out and waking up later. Sleeping on the bare floor could have no benefits of regular sleep (like very slow condition restoration or no affliction healing) and on snow it could mean temperature penalty instead of bonus so you would need a fire going. Buuut it should at least be an option, right? If it isn't, it's just quite silly that characters  stay up until they die of sleep deprivation and it makes bedroll a bit too crucial than it should be.

 

There are currently no plans to add this. Between the bedroll, cars, snow shelters, and every interior (most which have beds or mattresses of some kind), it seems you have a lot of options for where to sleep? 

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That's all the questions I have time for this week! Enjoy the weekend and stay cozy out there.

- Raph

 

[Admin]

Please use this thread for discussion of @Raphael van Lierop's answers. However, while we will be monitoring the thread, he won't be following up on questions here. If you have more questions please post them in the main question thread and they may be addressed in a future Milton Mailbag.

If you want to know if a topic has been addressed please check the Milton Mailbag Index.

[BareSkin]

8 minutes ago, TheRealPestilence said:

Regarding sleep: It takes four full days to die of just fatigue.  No place in the game is that far away from a place to sleep.

But you move very slowly (overweight), can't sprint, and are more likely to get sprained and to be detected by wolves= high death probability, when  you could have just slept on that cave/mine floor while waiting for the last blizzard to pass. This is a problem mainly in Interloper, because the bedroll is very rare, and your travel distance is not counted in hours but in "minutes spent freezing", if you get the chance of good weather...

[Azdrawee]

6 hours ago, Raphael van Lierop said:

Because the alternative was locking you out of the cabin with all your stuff still inside. I thought our solution was pretty fair.

But why do you even lock the cabin? The player can still go to grey mother's, even after you complete every single quest in Ep. 1, so I don't really see a point.

[amadeuszbx]

10 hours ago, TheRealPestilence said:

Regarding sleep: It takes four full days to die of just fatigue.  No place in the game is that far away from a place to sleep.

But it's not the point. It's just so silly. Why? Why can't I sleep on the floor of the cave? 

What's more not every interior has a bed plus, even more importantly as BareSkin said: you get this fuzzy view, and start staggering around way before so while in theory it takes some time to die from exhaustion, in practice you won't be able to move efficiently to those beds (that are supposingly all around). What's more, why can't I just sleep on the ledge or in some cave midway through my climbing? I know it will be dangerous but let me suffer consequences. Don't make me stuck on the ledge with 0 energy just because I did not take that additional 1kg of bedroll weight (more if it's Bearskin Bedroll)? 

Saying that there is plenty of places to sleep predefined by the game is not addressing the problem (not only my problem but problem of many, many players) at all. It's like saying: "Ok, characters refuse to eat with their hands in extreme survival situations. They require knife and fork. But we made spawn point for plenty of forks and knives so it seems you have a lot of options where to eat?" It's exactly the same level of pointlessness. 

[Smellyfries]

16 hours ago, Raphael van Lierop said:

How much has the game changed sense you first brought it into Early access all those years ago?

I asked this question because I got the Long Dark after episode 1 and 2 (before redux) was released, so I didn't know of how much the game has actually changed. Thanks for the Info! 

[Sceh]

"This is a bug."

Please don't ever change it. I love the light coming out of those windows, all cozy and warm. It's like a friendly face at the end of a long day, and it's calling you home.

It's also why I make this location my more permanent base when in ML, even though it has far less storage space and is more out-of-the-way than the Camp Office or the Dam.

[Pillock]

17 hours ago, Raphael van Lierop said:

Yes. I think we should probably refresh all our loot tables and all our "random" spawns, just to shake things up a bit for our long-time players. It'd be a fair bit of work and would probably irritate some people but I think it'd be worth it.

I really like the idea of this! (Maybe on condition it didn't mess with existing saves?)

The current loot locations can feel a bit stale once you get to the know them over time (I've never looked at the loot table data, just played a lot of hours. Why anyone would want to ruin their experience by doing that is beyond me). Is that flare under under this bench? Is the hacksaw on this shelf? No, it must be in the other place then. Etc. Refreshing it would be great: almost like exploring the world again for the first time. Less meta gaming is always better, as far as I'm concerned.

What I'd really like to be able to do is set custom variables on the amounts of certain items, then have them randomised across all their possible down locations in the entire world. So, for example, set rifle availability to between 3 and 6 (say), but not know exactly how many there are in total or in which rifle spawn locations they are: you might get several in one map and none on most of the others. Same goes for the other important tools. I think that'd really mix things up and make each play through more different from each other than they currently are.

[Fuarian]

13 hours ago, Azdrawee said:

But why do you even lock the cabin? The player can still go to grey mother's, even after you complete every single quest in Ep. 1, so I don't really see a point.

I think it's to usher the narrative forward. 

[Pillock]

1 hour ago, Fuarian said:

I think it's to usher the narrative forward. 

Surely that ought to be up to the player? Why should the Devs/Author care how we choose to pace ourselves?

Getting kicked and locked out of Jerry's place didn't bother me much. I just thought it was weird!

[NardoLoopa]

1 hour ago, Pillock said:

Why should the Devs/Author care how we choose to pace ourselves?

They're ambivalent about it -- that's why they gave us Sandbox if we don't like their nudging. 

[krisspykriss]

17 hours ago, Pillock said:

Surely that ought to be up to the player? Why should the Devs/Author care how we choose to pace ourselves?

Getting kicked and locked out of Jerry's place didn't bother me much. I just thought it was weird!

It might have to do with how the rest of the story goes. Just a thought. 

[Fuarian]

On 2/23/2019 at 6:18 PM, Pillock said:

Surely that ought to be up to the player? Why should the Devs/Author care how we choose to pace ourselves?

Getting kicked and locked out of Jerry's place didn't bother me much. I just thought it was weird!

Because it's a story. You're playing as a character, you are not the character. You simply experience the story through their point of view. If you want to pace yourself, then play survival mode. Pacing is a heavy aspect of narrative story-telling. 

[stratvox]

On 2/22/2019 at 8:59 PM, Raphael van Lierop said:

Conspiracy from the cracker companies, I guess. They fill the box with air and you think you are getting value when in fact, you are not.

Soooo... Lay's Chips, then.

[Pillock]

22 hours ago, Fuarian said:

Because it's a story. You're playing as a character, you are not the character. You simply experience the story through their point of view. If you want to pace yourself, then play survival mode. Pacing is a heavy aspect of narrative story-telling. 

It's also a game. It's an interactive experience, not a passive one like an animated movie.

I'm sure there are good reasons for locking you out of Trapper's; I just thought it felt a bit weird because those reasons aren't immediately obvious to the player. It might be in order to usher the story forward, but I'm not so sure. I don't think an author should be expecting their audience to have to recognise narrative writing techniques in order to make sense of what's happening and why. That wouldn't be a sign of good story-telling. Changes of pace should feel organic and natural to the audience. This particular event feels contrived.

[melcantspell]

It seems logical from a story point of view, in my opinion. If you were able to get back inside Trapper's Cabin, Jeremiah would still be there (as opposed to Grey Mother). 

It would feel completely different to the player to then leave injured and weak Jeremiah to himself when you get the chance to get back inside. The urge to move on and keep in mind the last words Jeremiah spoke to you (thus adding mystery to his character) is stronger since you were locked out. Jeremiah does not WANT you to get back inside. He wants you to move on and do as he said. That's why he put all your items outside and locked you out. 

Edited to add: I guess it also makes sense to feel confused about being locked out. That's exactly the kind of character that Jeremiah is - he is supposed to make you feel confused   

[Ape88]

On 2/25/2019 at 11:50 AM, stratvox said:

Soooo... Lay's Chips, then.

Or any chip company really... 

[Faithful Cartographer]

Why can't I ask a question for mailbag 25? Topic to put questions for some reason, everything in the archive...

[XaldinVii]

@Faithful Cartographer Yeah it looks like the thread got deleted or something. I am not seeing it either. @admin ?

[Admin]

2 hours ago, XaldinVii said:

@Faithful Cartographer Yeah it looks like the thread got deleted or something. I am not seeing it either. @admin ?

Weird, not sure why it got moved. It's back where it belongs.

[Lohaan]

On 2/23/2019 at 3:59 AM, Raphael van Lierop said:

This is a bug.

Please don't fix this... That light makes you feel so good when the blizzard has you...and you're tired...and losing health fast...but suddenly you come around that corner....and the warmth of that light beckons you home...It gives me a boost of endorphins just seeing it. This bug I love. 

 

[DarKube]

1 hour ago, Lohaan said:

Please don't fix this... That light makes you feel so good when the blizzard has you...and you're tired...and losing health fast...but suddenly you come around that corner....and the warmth of that light beckons you home...It gives me a boost of endorphins just seeing it. This bug I love. 

I totally agree !