More weapons

[Dargot]

Hello!

I want to suggest more detailed and comprehensive weapon system.

1) Melee weapons
  1.1. Improvised spear - can be used to fight off wolfs and bears. Crafted from sapling and scrap metal
 
2) Throwing weapons:
  2.1. Improvised spear (see 1.1.) - can be thrown
  2.2. Sling. Can be used to throw stones with more range. Crafted from cloth.
 
3) Firearms (list with descended importance)
  3.1. Current .303 rounds.
    3.1.1. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.
    
  3.2. 12-gauge rounds
    12-gauge rounds can be with slug (has more power but less range than .303), buckshots(several shots in round, for wolfs/deers), lead pellets(for rabbits). Heavier rounds than .303.
    3.2.1. Pump-action shotgun (5-6 rounds, rate of fire(RoF) higher than current rifle)    
    3.2.2. Double-barreled shotgun (2 rounds, very high RoF, relatively slow reloading)
    3.2.3. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.
    
  3.3. Totally improvised gun. Can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. Reloads in inventory actions without rounds, only by using powder and slug/buckshot (see later).
        
  3.4.     .44 rounds. Has less power than .303 and slightly less range, but lighter rounds.
    3.4.1. Revolver (5 rounds, RoF higher than shotgun)
    3.4.2. Lever-acton "Guide gun" (5-6 rounds, RoF like shotgun)
    3.4.3. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.

  3.5. .22LR. Has very low power, but very light rounds and can be useful to kill rabbits.
    3.5.1. Bolt-action rifle. Like current rifle but .22LR.
    3.5.2. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.
    
  3.6. .375 H&H(or similar round) Has very high power but very heavy rounds.    
    3.6.1. Double rifle (2 rounds, very high RoF, relatively slow reloading)
    
  3.7. .223. Has less power than .303 and similar range, but lighter rounds.
    3.7.1. Ar-15. 20 rounds, high ROF.
    3.7.2. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.

  3.8. 20-gauge rounds
    20-gauge rounds can be with slug (has less power and range than 12-gauge), buckshots(for wolfs/deers) and lead pellets(for rabbits). Has less shots in rounds than 12-gauge, but lighter rounds.
    3.8.1. Double-barreled shotgun (2 rounds, very high RoF, relatively slow reloading)
    3.8.2. Improvised single-shot gun, that can be crafted from sapling and scrap metal. 1 rnd, very slow reloading.
    
  3.9. Combined firearms. 2-barreled guns with 1 barrel .22LR and other - 12 gauge, and so on.
    
 
4) Rounds crafting.

  All rounds can be harvested to get bullet (slug/shots/pellets), primer, case and powder and can be crafted from this materials using Reloading Tools.
  Bullets for rifles need to be found or harvested.
  Slugs can be crafted by Bullet Mold or crafted improvised (with bad characteristics) from scrap metal
  Buckshots and pellets need to be found or harvested or crafted improvised (with bad characteristics) from scrap metal
  Cases need to be found or harvested (and can be taken by character after he shoots)
  Primers need to be found or harvested
  Powder for rifle rounds need to be found or harvested
  Powder for shotgun rounds can be found or harvested or crafted improvised (with bad characteristics) from matches
 
  IMHO, such firearms system demands little new game mechanics, some artwork, but will offer to player some flexibility according to the one's style of play and great fun.
 
  Sorry for my English.
 
  Sincerely yours, Dargot.

[Rusty_Old_F250]

I'm not opposed to adding more guns to the game, but, I really don't want it to turn into a FPS. I advocate adding some more .303 caliber rifles to the game, just for some variety, (a P14 Enfield, and a Martini Enfield) but lots of different calibers, plus shotguns and pistols gets to be a bit much. IMHO, it just gets to complex and distracts from the focus of the game. 

Sam

[JErosion]

I've always said that this game could use more firearms like a revolver and especially a shotgun. While American Westerns always placed emphasis on handguns, it was shotgun that truly tamed the west. Although I'm in favor of there being of there being multiple types of shotgun ammo... Bird shot, slugs, buckshot. Birdshot for rabbits or maybe some gamebirds like Grouse, if they ever add any.  Dargot does have good suggestion in having an improvised gun... although i would never try it with the 303 like you just begging it to blow up in your face. now a single shot shotgun can be improvised with a nail and a couple of pipes

[Rusty_Old_F250]

Actually, one thing @Dargot mentioned that I would really like to see implemented is gunsmithing and reloading. The devs expressed some interest in this a while ago, unfortunately, I don't think it will happen anytime soon. they have a lot on their plate as is.

Sam

[Doc Feral]

And to think I was joking when I suggested a craftable blunderbuss...

There's the risk of making the game too FPSish, and although I may accept the ability to forge crude blades or make rustic clothes out of animal hides, gunsmithing is a bit too high on the technical skill ranking.

[JErosion]

Although imagine the horror the game would become if there were a huge variety of rounds and guns.... after searching all of mystery Lake, The Coastal Highway, and even down to Desolation point and  you found 9mm, 38 special rounds, .303s, and  a dozen .22 but you only find a shotgun with no rounds

[ThePancakeLady]

20 minutes ago, JErosion said:

Although imagine the horror the game would become if there were a huge variety of rounds and guns.... after searching all of mystery Lake, The Coastal Highway, and even down to Desolation point and  you found 9mm, 38 special rounds, .303s, and  a dozen .22 but you only find a shotgun with no rounds

That is one of my main concerns as well, to be honest. We have limited carry weights. Having a dozen different guns, with a dozen different rounds... you know the forums would be filled with players wanting more carry weight (Let me carry 3 times my own body weight!!!) so they can pick up every round, and every food item, and every stick, and every gun, and.. it would get kinda nuts. And where would they put the loot spawns? Some areas or containers are already a bit cluttered with "junk" at times as it is. They would have to figure out "realistic" places to hide all of the guns, all of the rounds, all of the mats for crafting rounds or slugs, and not make it like a virtual firearms candy store. And... carrying 20kg of ammo but not having the right gun for any of it. Would suck. You know it, I know it. I think Hinterland knows it. 

 

I would be okay with a revolver or pistol, but just one, and it would have to be as rare as the flare gun. Maybe more rare. 1 in the entire game world rare. And 'Lopers don't get to have it either, in a vanilla settings game. It would be a trophy, a with ammo rare enough to make it a last ditch weapon, not something people are running around pew pew pew pew pew pew pew pew... like it's nothing. I could also see a shotgun, single barrel, or double. Also very rare, ammo also on the rare side, but not as rare. Useful for scaring predators away, possibly wounding them from a distance, giving you more time to escape. Birdshot only. Having larger buckshot, a wide spread, and the possibility to kill 3 wolves with one blast.. a bit too OP. But wounding and/or scaring an entire pack, slowing them down, so you can get away? Or killing one animal at close range with a birdshot blast to the face or throat/belly (would cause a bleedout- infection type slower death), or a rare one-shot crit if the animal is in attack charge and you get it at point-blank.

Even that is getting to be too complex and busy. ^^^

Gun-smiting and crafting our own ammo, I liked at one point in time. But after a year or more of thinking about it, I think it is too complicated, the mats would be too rare and hard to find or harvest, and the amount of skill needed to "realistically' accomplish it, in a dead world, with no firearms supply stores to shop at... I have reconsidered and no longer feel it would make the game better, or fit the game well.

 

Just my 2¢. 

[JErosion]

yeah I've never been a fan of idea of crafting rounds, as you said thats too much of a complication. Although they could get super creative with firearm spawn locations like have one spawn behind or under a chair so you would only find it if you broke it down.

[Khan_Drichthyes]

The only round crafting I'd go for right now would be melting and casting lead to make bullets for a muzzle loading rifle.

I envision such a rifle as being painfully slow to load, having somewhat less accuracy than the current hunting rifle, but packing a much bigger punch due to firing a round with significantly greater mass.

Here's a nice one

The rifle in the link is a double barreled rifle, so you would get two shots.  And, at a caliber of .58, each shot will have a very heavy punch.

Lead for bullets can be harvested from the balance weights found on the edge of car wheel rims.  Black Powder and percussion caps (unless it's a flintlock) are the greater limiting factor as they would not be craftable.  Paper cartridges holding your premeasured load of powder could be crafted with newspaper.

[Hotzn]

Concerning the pistol, I remember there was already a model of one in the game files at some point. Some people even got a glimpse of it due to some glitch in their game iirc. So the devs most likely envisioned it. But that does not necessarily mean it's coming - maybe it was given up.

Apart from that, my 2 cents: Adding the usual range of firearms would make TLD more generic and therefore less interesting (at least for me). Many players have expectations they carry over from other games they have enjoyed, and therefore they want to see the same things in TLD - a button for jumping, a set of stone-age crafted tools & weapons (stone axe, spear, bow drill, sling) a million crafting options, the usual range of firearms and so on. That is only fair. But if Hinterland fulfilled all those requests, TLD would become just like any other game out there. However, TLD was successful because it was NOT just like any other game. There lies a danger in "going generic".

Based on the current game version, I personally do not miss other weapons at all. Would I even drag a shotgun or a pistol along? Probably not, what for? As things are, I don't even carry around the rifle - it's too heavy, and the bow does the job nicely. Rather than seeing new weapons, I would prefer to see more differentiation between the bow and the rifle - I find it hard to believe that I craft my first ever bow (out there in the icy cold, without any instructions, from materials I am not familiar with) and then - BAM - take down a bear with it. So maybe there should be different quality bows, and I should only be able to craft the better ones when I have raised my according skill. And maybe different types of arrowheads/arrows. And the rifle should still be the best and most accurate weapon in the game, period.