Dev Diary - February 2018

[Cr41g]

I love the game as whole... it is far from trash....and I am happy to wait till the devs are ready to release a finished product for story mode... I am way to engrossed in survival and the challenges right now... to be that angry

[Patrick Carlson]

52 minutes ago, Le Petit Prince said:

LOL... It's been almost 7 months and you say it will still take long time, and you can't still give a date about only 1 episode which should be already done 3 months ago at the end of 2017. I don't know what others think but i think this news are nothing but tragedy. I'm not very into survival games but i really liked the story mode, and i finished it in only 24 hours and waiting for 7 months... I wish it wasn't too late to refund this piece of trash...

So you changed some actions of NPCs on previous episodes on 7 months? CONGRATULATIONS...

I hope you make this character be able to jump, so that this "THE LONG TIME" waiting worth it at least a little bit.

Sorry guys, i know everyone's gonna attack me on comments, but hey! You all know what you have just read are truths.

I'm sorry to hear you feel this way. But no matter how you feel, we'd ask that you respect our community and keep your comments civil and friendly, even when you disagree. Calling the game "trash" doesn't meet this standard. Since you're new, perhaps you haven't had a chance to read our community guidelines yet: http://www.hinterlandforums.com/announcement/40-rules-and-guidelines-for-the-hinterland-forums/

Thank you.

[shade_grey]

1 hour ago, Le Petit Prince said:

LOL... It's been almost 7 months and you say it will still take long time, and you can't still give a date about only 1 episode which should be already done 3 months ago at the end of 2017. I don't know what others think but i think this news are nothing but tragedy. I'm not very into survival games but i really liked the story mode, and i finished it in only 24 hours and waiting for 7 months... I wish it wasn't too late to refund this piece of trash...

So you changed some actions of NPCs on previous episodes on 7 months? CONGRATULATIONS...

I hope you make this character be able to jump, so that this "THE LONG TIME" waiting worth it at least a little bit.

Sorry guys, i know everyone's gonna attack me on comments, but hey! You all know what you have just read are truths.

You bought the game just for story mode... Why?!

Also, your character will never be able to jump... at least not in the same way jumping is implemented in other FPS games. The Long Dark just isn't that kind of game.

Here's a link to a topic that discusses things that are fundamental to the game:

 

[Blinkin]

I'm not going to turn down a negative reaction like that. It's an opinion and I'm glad it's being shared.

However I disagree. The main problem is in expectation as far as I can tell. For me The Long Dark has become way more than I expected. And you know this is the truth.

Peace!

[Patrick Carlson]

2 hours ago, Blinkin said:

I'm not going to turn down a negative reaction like that. It's an opinion and I'm glad it's being shared.

However I disagree. The main problem is in expectation as far as I can tell. For me The Long Dark has become way more than I expected. And you know this is the truth.

Peace!

To be clear, negative criticism is perfectly fine! These forums are full of examples of negative critique. But be civil and respectful when you share opinions. Civil feedback, not, it's a "piece of trash", is much easier to understand and take seriously, too. 

[Mixxut]

*This part of the post is deleted because it caused a sh*tstorm*. There is just so much to do right now in The Long Dark to call this game trash. I'm glad to hear that Hinterland is putting so much effort in this game!

[MrJade]

9 hours ago, Mixxut said:

The true fans can wait. There is just so much to do right now in The Long Dark to call this game trash. I'm glad to hear that Hinterland is putting so much effort in this game!

This is the most fallacious thing I've read in weeks? "True fans"? You are logically fallacious. Hinterlands is slow, and it tests many of my friend's and my patience when we either backed the game in KS or else bought it in Alpha.

[Mixxut]

26 minutes ago, MrJade said:

This is the most fallacious thing I've read in weeks? "True fans"? You are logically fallacious. Hinterlands is slow, and it tests many of my friend's and my patience when we either backed the game in KS or else bought it in Alpha.

Well if this offends you this much I can change it to "personally I can wait" if you want to...

[MrJade]

12 minutes ago, Mixxut said:

Well if this offends you this much I can change it to "personally I can wait" if you want to...

It doesn't offend me, it just makes you look foolish. Using logically fallacious in an argument weakens your position and reveals a lack of understanding.

It would be intelligent to change it to "personally I can wait" and understand that true fans can think Hinterlands is moving too slow.

[Blinkin]

Just going to add that that's still an opinion MrJade. I don't think there's anything like 'true fans'.
We're all people who like or dislike certain progression of this project. No matter the point of view it's all fine.
I can wait too, but again that's personal.

[MrJade]

1 minute ago, Blinkin said:

Just going to add that that's still an opinion MrJade. I don't think there's anything like 'true fans'.
We're all people who like or dislike certain progression of this project. No matter the point of view it's all fine.
I can wait too, but again that's personal.

The point of the fallacy is that you cannot say "True X" cannot do something. "True fans" would just be people that are fans of the game. Some are going to be impatient with the progress. Some are going to think it is fine. Some are going to think it is moving too slow.

Point is, saying or disparaging others because you think it is moving just fine is fallacious, and that isn't an opinion. 

[Hotzn]

On 24.2.2018 at 7:06 PM, MrJade said:

This is the most fallacious thing I've read in weeks? "True fans"? You are logically fallacious. Hinterlands is slow, and it tests many of my friend's and my patience when we either backed the game in KS or else bought it in Alpha.

If that was the 'most fallacious thing' you have read in weeks then you a) either don't read much or b) don't know much about logic (no offense intended, I'm just strictly applying logic):

The term 'true fans' implies that there are two types of fans - 'true' fans and 'false' fans. A false fan would be someone falsely pretending to be a fan. There are false doctors, false policemen and false experts in the world (further premises which I personally would regard to be true). It is easier to falsely pretend to be a fan than any of the professions listed above (dito). If there are people who will falsely pretend something which requires them to overcome a certain degree of difficulty, then there must also be people who will falsely pretend something which only requires them to overcome a lesser degree of difficulty (dito). Therefore, there must be false fans (conclusio).

Now you are saying there cannot be such a thing as a 'true fan', because - that is the implication - there cannot be such a thing as a 'false fan'. However, given the understanding outlined above a 'false fan' can very well exist. What you really want to say is that @Mixxut  made a premise that a 'false fan' cannot wait, at the same time implying that all who are impatient (or complain about the speed of Hinterland's development) are 'false fans', and that you disagree with that premise. Which is only fair, as that premise does indeed contain a slight provocation (and I would personally also disagree with it). However, if you had only expressed that disagreement instead of elaborating on logic and @Mixxut's intelligence (which in turn contains another slight provocation), your case would... have looked better.

Anyway, I'm happy to see logic being discussed and - in part - applied on these forums. Always worth hanging out here. 

[Le Petit Prince]

Look, i love the story mode and the game itself. I love atmosphere, i love soundtracks, i love story, i love everything about the game. Except it's too short and other episodes are never releasing. I get bored when i play only survival. I missed playing Wintermute, i am wondering next things. But i wanted to play it during Winter and collage vacation, but now the vacation is over and winter is about the over also. The point here is; companies makes new games or another season of TV series on 7 months. First 2 episodes can be finished within 24 hours and waiting the next one for 7 months is way too long, admit it. Even 7 months later, they're keep saying "it will still take long time and we can't give a specific date." 

I am already forgot the game, what was i doing, what was happened, i don't remember. I am thinking i've bought the game only for waiting, without knowing how long more i should wait. Maybe at the end of 2018 or maybe in the middle of 2018, episode 3 will be released, but i will not even remember there was a game called The Long Dark. It's too much time for 1 episode. Literally if you don't like survival mode, you're playing nothing. It doesn't make sense to me. 

[MrJade]

20 hours ago, Hotzn said:

If that was the 'most fallacious thing' you have read in weeks then you a) either don't read much or b) don't know much about logic (no offense intended, I'm just strictly applying logic):

The term 'true fans' implies that there are two types of fans - 'true' fans and 'false' fans. A false fan would be someone falsely pretending to be a fan. There are false doctors, false policemen and false experts in the world (further premises which I personally would regard to be true). It is easier to falsely pretend to be a fan than any of the professions listed above (dito). If there are people who will falsely pretend something which requires them to overcome a certain degree of difficulty, then there must also be people who will falsely pretend something which only requires them to overcome a lesser degree of difficulty (dito). Therefore, there must be false fans (conclusio).

Now you are saying there cannot be such a thing as a 'true fan', because - that is the implication - there cannot be such a thing as a 'false fan'. However, given the understanding outlined above a 'false fan' can very well exist. What you really want to say is that @Mixxut  made a premise that a 'false fan' cannot wait, at the same time implying that all who are impatient (or complain about the speed of Hinterland's development) are 'false fans', and that you disagree with that premise. Which is only fair, as that premise does indeed contain a slight provocation (and I would personally also disagree with it). However, if you had only expressed that disagreement instead of elaborating on logic and @Mixxut's intelligence (which in turn contains another slight provocation), your case would... have looked better.

Anyway, I'm happy to see logic being discussed and - in part - applied on these forums. Always worth hanging out here. 

I think you missed a key point here and rabbit trailed illogically. I did actually state there are true fans. I said, ""True fans" would just be people that are fans of the game". 

I am saying that his definition of true fans is fallacious, and your attempt at logic and/or humor is misplaced since you cannot read what I typed apparently. The statement of "most fallacious" was a bit of hyperbole, which is fully acceptable in normal language. 

So, all in all, a failed attempt to say that I said something I didn't. I agree there are true fans, in that they are fans of Hinterlands and that saying that "true fans" must be patient is fallacious. 

Please try to read everything next time. 

[RossBondReturns]

I think both Fans and so called True fans are fans of the game.

Also I despise the term True Fan, it drives a wedge in fan bases and can cause huge fractures within them. As a Terminator fan I've seen that happen. If you like anything outside of T1 and T2 you're not a true fan gets thrown around a lot- excuse me but I just love the Terminator Universe as a whole and find each new chapter enjoyable...and somehow I'm not a true fan?

Ok then.

I got TLD during early access and I think, personally, that Hinterland is doing a mighty fine job at creating a truly unique gaming experience. Creating a truly unique gaming experience takes more time then doing something that's been done before and say slapping a fresh/different coat of paint on it. It takes an immense amount of time especially with a relatively speaking small yet dedicated team.

They push out updates to sandbox and game mechanics quite often, some of which contain pretty significant overhauls, and at the same time they have a croe team working solely on Episode 3 and beyond.

My point is as far as I'm concerned Hinterland has proven themselves to be very dedicated to the passion project of theirs and they clearly have the skills to bring it to completion so because of that I choose to wait patiently...and keep surviving in sandbox over and over as I wait for further episodes. For sandbox/survival mode is the best storytelling survival playground of it's kind I've found...and it just keeps getting better.

 

[Blinkin]

I think this topic is getting slightly derailed. although the subject is quite interesting.

Le Petit Prince I get what you mean, this is actually something we have to keep in mind We don't want to let The Long Dark become overwhelmed by feature creep.
I've also forgotten half of the story already and I'm starting to understand why some people decided to wait playing Story mode till it's finished.
I still have enjoyed the game so far, but I understand why people are saying it takes too long. Makes perfect sense.

[Le Petit Prince]

Yeah at the first time i opened the story mode, i saw it saying "SEASON ONE: WINTERMUTE"

So i read about future episodes and thought that it will be 5 episode total on wintermute. And after that there will be season 2. Maybe with another character with another story or the next season of the same story i don't know but another season of story mode. If we finish one season (wintermute) and wait for next season for 1 or even 2 years, it will feel like waiting the second game of a series and it is totally okay. But if we are going to wait a year for each episodes of each season like this, it's not cool. It's too much. Like my grondsons only can complete the second season  (I'm 21 btw)

My English is not so good but i hope you get the point. Waiting this long for each next episode is too much, i thought the long dark could provide us long and joyful experience, i thought we could create maybe even 4 seasons and play it together in 4 years or 5, but now i am losing my belief to that. Because creating even 1 episode is taking too long.

[Pillock]

3 hours ago, Le Petit Prince said:

Waiting this long for each next episode is too much, i thought the long dark could provide us long and joyful experience, i thought we could create maybe even 4 seasons and play it together in 4 years or 5, but now i am losing my belief to that. Because creating even 1 episode is taking too long.

I don't think every episode will take this long.

I agree that it would be too long if there was such a big gap between every remaining installment of Wintermute, and that people might well lose interest in the series if that happened, and be justified in doing so. But Hinterland have explained the reasons for this particular delay and I'm sure they'll be working hard not to see any repeat of the kinds of issue that have caused it this time.

What I read from this Dev Diary is that the longer-than-anticipated wait for Episode 3 is partly down to the fact that they want to take their time now rather than later to sort out the major problem areas with the game. They can then hopefully get the rest of the series done in better timeframes that the player-base will find more acceptable.

As long as they keep us customers informed reasonably regularly on general progress, they'll allow us to judge whether the game is worth following. And they've always been quite good at doing that thus far, so I'm not particularly worried.

[nicko]

On 2/21/2018 at 1:58 PM, admin said:

“Buffer Memories”: The aurora reveals secrets hidden within the depths of otherwise dead computers, relics of the world before “the long dark”. Could this make it into the next update?

that would be cool, just ran across this PC in a well known map. Looks bit different to the OP spoiler though

 

[MrJade]

14 hours ago, Pillock said:

I don't think every episode will take this long.

One my gripes is that it took too long to even get Wintermute out at all. I bought the game in 2014 and was told that it would be out "soon", which was then pushed back to 2016, and was later told that it would be broken up into episodes and then sold on consoles.

I purchased the game with the original vision in mind, and now I'm not being given that at all. Luckily, it didn't cost much, but I've never bought an early-access game since and won't. The Long Dark burned me entirely too bad.

With all of that in mind, I do like the game, and I did purchase the game knowing that there is every chance that the game would never get more complete than it was at the exact moment of purchase. However, the updates have radically slowed down, vision has crept, and not all of the feature promised 4 years ago are in the game.

[Pillock]

34 minutes ago, MrJade said:

However, the updates have radically slowed down, vision has crept, and not all of the feature promised 4 years ago are in the game.

That's true. But hopefully the release of Episode 3 + 1&2 overhaul will bring the story closer to that original vision - that certainly appears to be the intention set out in this dev diary.

For me, early  access has been a great way to get hold of some very good games at knock down prices, and The Long Dark is certainly one of those, so I'm pretty happy with how it's gone. And in this case it might not even have got made at all if the EA uptake hadn't been as strong as it was.

The full release of this game has clearly not gone entirely according to plan, both in terms of delivery of the product and also actual game content. But the team do seem very committed to putting both things right, which is encouraging from our point of view, I think. I haven't lost any trust either in Hinterland or in the Early Access concept in general as a result of TLD - I think overall they've gone about it in the right way. 

[Blinkin]

I can agree with the fact that Story mode has been delayed a lot. I see why this is something worrying and a reason to feel things are getting out of hand.
I'd like to add that the episodic structure of the game has been communicated from the start as far as I know. But I also dind't expect such a long delay (which in my opinion has some good reasons but I also see why it is a negative thing).

[hozz1235]

I am also a backer.  Tried the game in it's early stages and decided to wait until it was "polished better".  That did take a long time, but I'm also learning, with other backer games, that is to be expected.  Therefore, I "put the game on a shelf" and came back and am loving it.  Yes, I am anxious for more content but have plenty of other stuff/games to keep me busy while I wait.  Playing Kingdom Come: Deliverance right now!

[XAlaskan_420X]

It went quite for a while, so I figured that some work was going on. I am excited about what is to come! and I like extra surprises. The visible gloves are coming to the game, Hinterland is listening to our requests. The updates are always improving the game, in my opinion. 

[Hotzn]

On 26.2.2018 at 7:31 PM, MrJade said:

I think you missed a key point here and rabbit trailed illogically. I did actually state there are true fans. I said, ""True fans" would just be people that are fans of the game". 

I am saying that his definition of true fans is fallacious, and your attempt at logic and/or humor is misplaced since you cannot read what I typed apparently. The statement of "most fallacious" was a bit of hyperbole, which is fully acceptable in normal language. 

So, all in all, a failed attempt to say that I said something I didn't. I agree there are true fans, in that they are fans of Hinterlands and that saying that "true fans" must be patient is fallacious. 

Please try to read everything next time. 

I understand now that you are a true master of logic and humour. I apologize for my laughable and vain attempts at both and withdraw from this discussion (also not to derail this thread).