The new Fatigue-system and sleep

[Finleggan]

Hi guys,

first of all: i love that game! I was sooooo looking forward for this patch.

And alltogether the update is great.

I like the new region, haven't explored a lot of it yet.

But i just had to stop after 1,5h because the new Fatigue-system really kills the fun for me.

It is soooo annoying how fast the possible weight to carry degrades. I'm at ca. 20/30kg with my clothing and a little too much water (the toilet just was too good to be true) . I only carry one log of wood, barely any food and not even one tool. But i can't go on a decent tour to explore.

For me it seems pointless to go anywhere as long as I am only a little bit tired, because not even halfway tired i already lost 3kg capacity. When I find some loot then I can't even be really happy about it, cause it means weight. And I end up going to sleep every two or three hours at daytime to keep fatigue closest to zero i can manage. That means for me, sleeping half the day. At night I stand next to the bed and just wait for daytime to come (for obvious reasons).

Second point: Sleep interruptions.

I don't get it. I.e. It's 5am and really really cold outside. I want to sleep to 9am for daylight and a little less blizzard and I have to work the "go-to-sleep"-dialog three times to make it happen. That's just annoying. And nothing is even happening. I do understand that it might be a problem if you are outside and have wolves sneaking around. But my guy gets up from his bed and I just send him back in, cause there's just no reason to be awake unless i want it. I could even support it if he would refuse to sleep, when he's not tired at all, but the way it is now is just not comprehensive to me.

Or another approach for me would be to give a message, that I didn't sleep tight so I'm still a little tired when i get up. Then I can decide to take an additional nap.

But personally don't like the interruptions. When I want to sleep to 9am or till I am fresh again, I will just send the man back to bed as often as it takes.

Am I the only one with these problem? Well, i don't think they really are survivability problems, but for me these points just interrupt the flow of the game and make it less fun. I can't enjoy exploration or the fear of freezing, starvation and dehydration cause number one occupation is managing my sleep.

Greetz, Fin

[elloco999]

At night I stand next to the bed and just wait for daytime to come (for obvious reasons).

I haven't played v1.52 yet, and maybe that's why, but I don't find anything obvious about it... How is standing next to the bed in the dark any better than getting into that bed and speed up the time until daylight? Or does this have something to do with the sleep interrupts?

[Sandra]

Good Morning/Day/Evening

Same here. I love the update, but that new fatigue-system annoys me. You can't make plans without knowing exactly how much you can carry.

When I leave my base to explore, I usually carry 15-16 kg with me, but of course after exploring houses/huts it is more. Together with the constantly decreasing Maximum this leads to me running back to my base after I explored max. two houses. I don't know whether this is realistic or not but I know that it is a little boring.

About the sleep interrupts: It is a little annoying to run through the sleeping menu three times a night. But I wouldn't mind if this would make any sense. But while the survivor wakes up a couple of times one night for no reasons, the next night she sleeps like a baby and wakes up dehydrated. Why does a big "nothing" interrupt her sleep while thirst doesn't?

[elloco999]

Yeah, I would like to know what it is that interrupts your sleep. It seems strange to me that you would just wake up for no reason. But apparently the game doesn't give you a reason atm. If I wake up in the middle of the night, it's usually for one of two reaons: my daughter crying or me needing to go to the bathroom... But then I do no why I woke up.

[furq]

I'm finding I'm have to sleep an inordinate amount to keep the fatigue down and carry weight at a reasonable level. I can see why you did it , to stop the starving, but in a situation like that, you would ration your food, wait as long as you could before eating, maybe starve yourself a little ?

[Finleggan]

How is standing next to the bed in the dark any better than getting into that bed and speed up the time until daylight?

What I meant was: For obvious reasons I don't go out scavenging at night. Whether I sleep or stand around doesn't matter to me. Not being tired towards night in this game is just a waste of human resources.

And I wanted to add some thoughts about the weightproblem.

The new system effecticely decreases the default capacity you can carry. Any good loot- and/or exploration-run leads to at least halfway tired. And at that point i lost 5kg capacity, which means my effective maximum is at 25kg. When I'm unlucky in some unknown region it even goes down further.

It is just not rewarding exploring a new area and heading back at 11am because i know at 1pm I will be encumbered and if I don't find a bed, I'll be exhausted by 3pm, shortening my effective daytime by at least four hours.

When i first ran around the Mystery-Lake-map, I just loved stepping through the snow, wondering what lied behind that next hill. Now exploring just means the urge to quickly find the next bed, so I can rest my troubled back.

[xnoybis]

I think the sleep interruption happens mostly when you're already well rested and possibly during infections or at low condition?

As for carrying weight and fatigue, yeah, I imagine the penalty should start applying only after you're 50% tired. Being tired is kind of binary up to that point, you're either tired or not, the gradation begins when you realize you're tired, before you're "carry all the forest back to cabin!", once tired you're more like "I have to sit down, umm, I have a pebble in my shoe, go on guys, I'll catch up... zzzzzzz...".

[AceM42]

I have started looting houses in the new zone and I will just lump everything that is not necessary for me immediately into one big container and just save it for when I need it. May be useful to keep a log of the items you stash in the homes. I tend to leave all the toilet water an clothes that I do not need in the homes until I do need them. Granted my last play through ended because I had 3 wolves trapping me in one of the cottages by the lake for 2 days... They just would not leave... So with no weapons at all I decided to go for it. Stinking first wolf ran off after I punched him 3 times and another one came around the corner and finished me off....

[Ruhroe]

It's more important to have a base of operations, and leave everything behind you don't need. All the stuff for repairs, extra fuel, etc., your bed roll, everything but clothing you have on, water, and maybe wolf protection. I was walking around with only 10ish kgs worth of weight and had plenty of room. That little weight and you don't fatigue nearly as quickly.

At first I had issues with the fatigue system too, but it can be managed. Also, they said the beds now are a bit different and it's very important to get uninterrupted sleep. Some will allow that much more easily than others. The bonus from it will help you recover much more quickly.

Add in the new cold system, and exploring now is not nearly as easy as it was before. It has to be planned, and managed, and maybe (too soon yet to see, as people adjust to it being harder) adds a bit of needed complexity. The 'menu' cycle the game had become before when everything was easily consolidated in one house, within a few days after start, was very uninteresting.

Perhaps, it will take a little time adjusting. Like most games, when something becomes different and has to be re-learned, it's initially a bit frustrating.

[Finleggan]

I totally get your point.

But I just don't think it's fun. That's just what I wanted to say with this thread and I wanted to know, if anybody felt the same way.

As I mentioned, I only started out. I don't know the map. I'm on my way exploring. All "stuff" (not food nor water) I got are two sets of simple tools and four sewing kits (à 0.10kg btw ). And some cloth. I already had to leave behind a hell lot of clothing (shouldn't it be reduced? I do find a ridiculous amount of it) and a nice jerry can of lantern fuel in a random hut at the end of the world, where I might never ever find it again. I just refuse to set my base at the first random building I stumble upon. Because I don't know what is where. And the possibility is high, that I never ever want to return to that edge of the map.

I was lucky to find work boots and a really nice winter coat. Each weighing in at 2kg. Only the clothing I'm wearing brings me to 7kg alone. Add some water, food, an emergency log of wood and a little medication and I am nearly at ~15kg. And please don't tell me to leave some of it at (a random) home (far away from anything useful) in a world where the next wolf or blizzard could easily keep me trapped in a house far away from "home" and the COLD has become a real killer (which I really like). And I don't even own a knife or hatchet, I'd like to have on me, when scavenging, to fend of wolves or get some meat from a carcass.

The 'menu' cycle the game had become before when everything was easily consolidated in one house, within a few days after start, was very uninteresting.

You are right with this too. And most of the changes with the update work towards changing that. But isn't a fatigue-system, that forces you to leave anything but your pants at home encouraging a "my-home-is-my-castle"-playstyle?

Before patch, I really liked surviving by running from location to location and living of the things i found there, till I moved on. Ofc leaving the not-so-important-stuff in a central place. But I only returned there, when I met 30kg.

I personally don't think it's fun to run outside, loot one house, run home, wait for the next day, rinse and repeat. And when there's nothing more to loot within range, I have to spend some days moving all my stuff to the next building?

EDIT: just re-read your post, I have to ask: Is it really beneficial to a survival game, when i want to leave my bedroll in a house with a bed, before heading out into the wilderness, for the sake of my backpack?

[Burning Bridges]

I am getting sleep interruptions in real life too, it's normal to me,