Melee please.

[Thor]

Dead horse , I know. But melee is a must have in a game like this.

[azuratte]

Yes. I think I'm crazy to say this but have it as a timing/quicktime event... I threw up in my mouth when I wrote that.

Running around in circles swinging a knife trying to hit a dog, doesn't make sense. Programming sensible and well animated wolf attacks would probably make the devs just hang themselves; but, being allowed to hold up a knife and if timed right when the dog lunges to pre-damage it before it pins you down would make sense. Even just having a knife out and have random percentage chance to injure the attacking wolves would be good as well.

With no weapon out, it would be nice to be able to 'yell' at the animal to try to spook it.

Az

[rpowell327]

I as well would like to see a melee system. if you have a hunting knife and/or a hatchet in your inventory it would seem logical that you would use them to defend and attack the wolf. Likewise if you had the rifle you would be able to smack the wolf with the butt of the rifle.

[elloco999]

You automatically use the best weapon in your inventory in a fight: knife, hatchet, prybar in that order. An icon in the upper right corner displays the weapon used.

[snegec]

Funny. Because even with having a hatchet, my self-defence was done with a knife.

Not only that. The wolf went at my face, but injured my calf.

[lordkevnar]

You automatically use the best weapon in your inventory in a fight: knife, hatchet, prybar in that order. An icon in the upper right corner displays the weapon used.

Pretty sure if you jammed a lit flare into a wolf's eye, he wouldn't come back for another attack. I kinda wished I could do this as I was being eviscerated for the 9th time.

[Cosmoline]

In real life if you actually were attacked by a wolf, a hunting knife would be just about as useful as the game shows. So while I don't like the interface much, I can't argue with the results. You might live with first aid and the wolf might eventually bleed out or die of something. But you're going to get hurt badly. Knives in the hand are not for use on living angry animals. Gene Moe managed to fight off a sow with his skinning knife a few years back, but was badly mauled and still ended up having to shoot the sow to finish her off. He credits divine intervention. Your only real chance is to keep the animal at some distance, thus the invention of the knife on a long hardwood pole.

As far as clubs, there's little chance of doing real damage with one, but it's certainly possible to bap an animal on the nose and have him run off. People have actually warded off bear that way, but it's not recommended. In game, though, the wolves are apparently all insane. So presumably they no longer care about getting bapped in the nose. And even with a tire iron, you're not going to make much headway against an attacking wolf. It's far too sluggish. If you've ever done helper work for German Shepherd or Malinois training you'll know what I mean. They move FAST. You'd need something like a proper, balanced war hammer and you'd have to know how to use it properly. After two years of HEMA I'm just starting to learn how it's done.

[blargen]

Running around in circles swinging a knife trying to hit a dog, doesn't make sense. Programming sensible and well animated wolf attacks would probably make the devs just hang themselves; but, being allowed to hold up a knife and if timed right when the dog lunges to pre-damage it before it pins you down would make sense. Even just having a knife out and have random percentage chance to injure the attacking wolves would be good as well.

With no weapon out, it would be nice to be able to 'yell' at the animal to try to spook it.Az

I agree with all of this. Just the image you described made me chuckle of someone on Mystery Lake during a snowstorm jumping and swinging repeatedly as a wolf is biting them. I like the idea of pre-damage if you are holding a weapon, like you do with a flare, and have it random. You may get lucky and hit they eye or neck and do mass damage early, or you may barely hit it (depending on condition, cold, hunger etc).

[elloco999]

Funny. Because even with having a hatchet, my self-defence was done with a knife.

That's because the order is:

1. knife

2. hatchet

3. prybar

4. bare hands

[snegec]

Stick a knife onto a pole = harpoon/spear.

In the game, I drop a piece of meat for the wolf, wait till it starts chowing then shoot an arrow in the head. Bleeds out in under 15 minutes. Works every time.

[Aelaera]

Yes. I think I'm crazy to say this but have it as a timing/quicktime event... I threw up in my mouth when I wrote that.

Running around in circles swinging a knife trying to hit a dog, doesn't make sense. Programming sensible and well animated wolf attacks would probably make the devs just hang themselves; but, being allowed to hold up a knife and if timed right when the dog lunges to pre-damage it before it pins you down would make sense. Even just having a knife out and have random percentage chance to injure the attacking wolves would be good as well.

With no weapon out, it would be nice to be able to 'yell' at the animal to try to spook it.

Az

I would like to see the current "attack" animation to be a last resort part of the fight. It would be interesting to see the wolf and human encounter to be a bit more realistic, although the wolves currently have some form of vendetta against humans. I don't like the idea of running around stabbing the air circling the wolf like an idiot but it would be cool to see the ability to damage and potentially scare a wolf away with something besides flares and gunshots. Yelling would be awesome, since it's a well known technique to stand your ground against animal attacks and the devs have already implemented a mild form of this. It could be a double-edged sword because while it could potentially make a wolf think twice about gnawing on your face but it may also draw more wolves... or even a bear. It could also being interesting once the survivor AI mechanic comes into effect, especially if you aren't on the "friendliest" of terms with your neighbors.

[ChefxRoyal]

Stick a knife onto a pole = harpoon/spear.

In the game, I drop a piece of meat for the wolf, wait till it starts chowing then shoot an arrow in the head. Bleeds out in under 15 minutes. Works every time.

Great idea with the spear. And i will try the bait tactic on the wolf lol

[Shanti]

+1 for melee.

I would suggest that it gets approached with certain assumptions, mine being:

• The wolf is faster than I am in a sprint
  
• The wolf is quicker, naturally better armed, and more stable than I am
  
• The wolf is trying to get me onto the ground, where it has the advantage over me.
  
• The wolf both wants to eat me, and wants to survive. Which he wants more may lead to different outcomes

I would break combat into 2 phases, based on the player's stances - standing or on the ground.

Standing combat would use normal walking / running controls, and the player would have a few options - attack with a weapon, or block with the off hand. The player can choose to do both at the same time. Additionally, the player may either maneuver for advantage, or brace for a charge.

Attacking with a knife or a hatchet is slow, and has a very short range. The wolf AI should know to stay out of reach until it darts in for an attack. Attacking with a spear has a narrow effective range (the wolf can dart in closer than your spear tip), but keeps the wolf at bay. Using two hands on the spear (not blocking) should make it quicker to maneuver and a stronger attack.

Blocking with the off hand would probably be primarily sticking the player's forearm into the snapping wolf's jaws, in a attempt to keep the wolf away from something more vital. Perhaps if timed correctly, the player could bop the wolf on the nose with a fist, or grab a hold of it's chest / neck.

While attacking and blocking, the player can choose to try to step forward while attacking for a stronger attack, or step back with a block for a better chance to defend properly. However, a charging wolf should knock a player over immediately if he makes a successful attack, moving on to phase 2 of combat.

Alternatively, the player should be able to press / hold a button to "brace for a charge", which would make the spear much more effective against a charging wolf, and make the player much more likely to keep his feet if he is able to deflect the wolf's attack even a little - with either a defense or an attack. The downside to bracing should be the player turns much slower, maybe pivoting a few degrees around "front", and using the strafing buttons to actually pick his feet up (making him vulnerable) to turn his "front".

In phase 1, the wolf should constantly be calculating it's hunger vs. danger, and be ready to disengage if it's getting hurt a lot in the encounter. I think wolves' behavior should be somewhat random, some preferring to charge, and some preferring to circle and nip. On stalker, wolves should circle and howl, hoping to bring in a second wolf to attack from a flank.

Phase 2 should continue like it currently does. If the player has a better weapon for close combat (like a knife), he draws it automatically when he goes down. I would prefer a system where I could still block the wolf's bites in close combat, but the wolf should continuously do damage to me with his claws as he rakes with his feet as well.

Finally, I think we should get another item to craft - a leather or cloth covering for the fore arm, which would reduce the amount of damage taken when the player shoves his arm into a wolf's mouth.

Personally, I think that the running, jumping, slashing combats of skyrim are unrealistic and annoying. If someone is actually good enough at timing to rush a wolf, then let him, but I feel like wolves should be faster, stronger and generally more dangerous than the player. Thief did a good job of this with it's combat with the swordsmen guards. If the thief attacked them in a "fair" fight, they were faster, stronger, and all around better than the player, often frustratingly so. Wolves should be like this. Staying in Phase 1 should be difficult, and something even veteran players struggle with. Phase 2 should be very dangerous for players - I think loosing 50-80% condition should be normal, and it should depend more on keeping a level head and attacking / defending properly, rather than just button smashing.

[Sempophai]

A spear, I'm surprised we're making a bow, before we're making a far simpler item like a pointy long stick. If you get flanked, from the initial attack and taken by surprise, then being knocked down etc seems fine, but if you have a spear and manage to actually face an aggressive wolf, then a two tiered system, defending with the spear, potentially killing or scaring off the wolf without taking damage, followed by the existing 'on your back' combat method, if you fail with the spear. I would like some basic free form stabbing ability though, for those occasions when I manage to sneak up within touching range, behind a feeding wolf. Throwing type spears are more complicated to make, as far as good balance etc etc, but a solid stabbing spear, is a fairly basic tool to craft and can be as simple as a long sturdy stick sharpened against a stone, with perhaps a fire hardened point, possibly progressing to a slightly more complex version with a knife blade point. (or flint, or bone, if those ever acquire a function in crafting).

[tdgillies]

I approve of the motion for the quicktime event. But only if you have the tool in hand.

Hands: Frankly if you know much about working guard dogs (German Shephards, Malanois, etc) or wild wolves they are king in that fight and frankly I think you have a chance to wrestle and kick them off but deal no damage just make them retreat.

Knife: Slightly longer quicktime as it is faster but less damage.

Hatchet: Slightly shorter quicktime reaction as its slower but hits hard.

Prybar: Shorter quicktime, even less damage than knife (better than nothing).

Spear: Long quicktime as it intercepts the animal way before it gets you, between knife and hatchet damage and also it lengthens the animal deterrence as they delay closing distance with you because you have a long pole in their face.

[doggonemess]

I think that melee attacks would be reasonable, but not over the top stuff. You should be able to slash at an attacking animal as a last resort, and spear hunting would be cool.

If I can offer my two cents about quicktime events... NO! Please, please, PLEASE don't go that route. I actually gave up on a couple games years ago because of those stupid things. Most of them at tweaked for freaking race car drivers or something, as my reflexes aren't even fast enough. I've had them tested, I'm slightly faster than average, but can't for the life of me do these stupid minigames.

[ChristianGamer]

I would like to see a machete added to the game for weaponry along with with many leafy plants for it to harvest.

[Boston123]

I would like to see a machete added to the game for weaponry along with with many leafy plants for it to harvest.

Wrong type of terrain. Machetes are for leafy vegetation, as you say, not for the woody vegetation you find in a deciduous/coniferous forest, like the kind we have in-game. For that, you need (and we have) an axe.

I have never understood the mania over machetes.

[ChristianGamer]

thanks for the clarification

[doggonemess]

I would like to see a machete added to the game for weaponry along with with many leafy plants for it to harvest.

Wrong type of terrain. Machetes are for leafy vegetation, as you say, not for the woody vegetation you find in a deciduous/coniferous forest, like the kind we have in-game. For that, you need (and we have) an axe.

I have never understood the mania over machetes.

I have a machete, and I understand the mania over machetes. :twisted: I agree that it is out of place in this game. Maybe a double headed axe instead?

Jamie